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  • Apr 22, 2010, 08:13 AM
    speechlesstx
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    You pay for your neighbors and he pays for yours.

    Actually, more and more fire departments are assessing fees for fire and other emergency services. Where've you been?

    Now can we get back to this crap of a bill that's been foisted on us by a bunch of out of control Democrats?
  • Apr 22, 2010, 08:26 AM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by speechlesstx View Post
    Actually, more and more fire departments are assessing fees for fire and other emergency services. Where've you been?

    Now can we get back to this crap of a bill that's been foisted on us by a bunch of out of control Democrats?

    Hello again, Steve:

    Where have I been? Living in a progressive city where they don't do those things.

    Foisted?? FOISTED?? I don't know. The Democrats were ELECTED. The Constitution says that the majority can pass laws. If the minority doesn't like it, they can throw the bums out. That doesn't sound like "foisted" to me. It sounds like our democratic Constitutional process at work.

    However, I'm used to you guys screaming words like tyranny, foisted, and rammed down our throats. But, that can simply be chalked up to sniveling by the losers.

    I do agree with you though. Turning my beloved country into torturers was FOISTED on me.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 08:36 AM
    speechlesstx

    Foisted: 1. To pass off as genuine, valuable, or worthy

    2. To impose (something or someone unwanted) upon another by coercion or trickery

    3. To insert fraudulently or deceitfully


    I'd say my use of the word is proper.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 08:36 AM
    smoothy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, smoothy:

    Let's take this a step at a time. It's fine that YOUR firemen don't get paid. There's lots of community's that are served that way. But, there's a lot of other expenses involved with running a fire department than just payroll. Who owns the fire trucks your volunteer department uses? Who pays the 911 operator? Who pays for gasoline that goes into those trucks? Who owns or pays rent on the station WHERE the fire truck is kept? Who buys the firefighters equipment?

    I'm gonna stop there. I know you don't get it. I'm not trying to convince you, though. That AIN'T gonna happen. I'm writing for the other people who're reading this thread.

    excon

    The fire dept pays for ALL that stuff, and THEY own it... not the local government... YOU are talking out of your butt. And what does the 911 system have to do with local fire departments anyway. THey don't hold boot drives and have bingo for the fun of it. And yeah.. it gets expensive.


    And unlike you... I am talking about a number of volunteer fire departments in three different states, ALL of which get no tax money, nor any pay for the work they do.

    Now just because YOUR local fire department isn't a volunteer department doesn't mean they all are.

    And in fact I did have ONE uncle who was a professional Fireman, who was NOT a volunteer, all the rest were volunteers in a number of different departments. Two even ran those departments. The others volunteered in different capacities.


    Yes I grew up around that stuff even though I myself was never one... and am not just repeating misconceptions like some people.

    My brother was one for decades... three uncles were volunteers, one more was a professional, and about a dozen friends and neighbors over the years were volunteers.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 08:56 AM
    speechlesstx
    As tom alluded to (since we all eat the same thing), in the olden days we tried to keep our sick children home from school.

    Quote:

    Like I said, the connection is IMPOSSIBLE for righty's to make.
    I know, ignorant racists that we are. Btw, I provide equipment to with many a volunteer fire department for a living. They do or can get federal grants at times, some cities and counties do fund them to a certain degree, most get hand me down equipment, but this is how they typically raise money, fundraisers.

    Now can we get back to this crap bill that was foisted on us?
  • Apr 22, 2010, 09:00 AM
    smoothy
    I think a great place to start is STOP allowing 47% of the population to avoid ALL federal taxes. If you live here and breath... you pay a tax like everyone else who works hard. And they should pay the same rates the rest of us do... so they have the same stake in anything that bumps up those rates at all.

    See how many think freebies and handouts are such a great idea when THEY have to pay for them.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 09:11 AM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by smoothy View Post
    The fire dept pays for ALL that stuff, and THEY own it...not the local government....YOU are talking out of your butt. And what does the 911 system have to do with local fire departments anyway. THey don't hold boot drives and have bingo for the fun of it. And yeah..it gets expensive.s.

    Hello again, smoothy:

    So, the fire department owns it, and it pays for all that stuff. Really? Is THAT what you think? It doesn't dawn on you to ask who owns the fire department? The fact that you hold events to raise money for your department, doesn't clue you in that your community owns the fire department.

    Now, the word "community" has no legal bearing, so I suggest that there's another entity that owns the fire department, and that's probably your county. But, that's OK. We don't have to identify the particular entity that's responsible for the bills. Identifying it as COMMUNITY owned is good enough for my argument.

    That's because a COMMUNITY owned fire department is SOCIALISM at work on the local level. Now, because your community needs to have bake sales and bingo to pay for your fire department only means that the entity that owns it, like your county, is going broke. It doesn't change the fact that you pool your risk against fire. Pooling risk is Socialism.

    Socialism WORKS for you and your community. That would be unless you tell me that your fire department and your police department are PRIVATELY owned. Because that's the ONLY alternative to community owned. There ain't no in between.

    Again, smoothy my friend, I know you don't understand what I just said. It's OK.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 09:20 AM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by speechlesstx View Post
    Foisted: 1. To pass off as genuine, valuable, or worthy

    2. To impose (something or someone unwanted) upon another by coercion or trickery

    3. To insert fraudulently or deceitfully


    I'd say my use of the word is proper.

    Hello again, Steve:

    You say it was something that wasn't wanted. I say it was. You cite polls that support your conclusion. I cite the ELECTION which supports mine. You say it was trickery. I say it was our Constitution in action.

    Aren't you the guys who call for RESTORING the Constitution?? You just saw it WORK the way it was DESIGNED to work. I can't image what Constitution you'd be referring to. We only have ONE.

    Now, I agree with you. We were told that waterboarding ISN'T torture. We got tricked, but it was cool with you then.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 10:00 AM
    speechlesstx
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    You say it was something that wasn't wanted. I say it was.

    The FACTS are on my side, then and now.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 10:07 AM
    galveston

    I was talking to my wife's audiologist and learned that they have had to let one employee go and work themselves until 8 or 9 at night to get all the paperwork done. One job lost to Obamacare, as the medicare payment for hearing testing has been cut.

    Additionally, they are going to have to buy expensive software and spend MANY hours transferring paper records to computer to satisfy government mandates.

    Multiply this scenario by thousands or millions and see the unintended consequences of this health care boondoggle.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 10:08 AM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by speechlesstx View Post
    The FACTS are on my side, then and now.

    Hello again, Steve:

    I agree with you, in the short term, you WON the talking points debate. In the longer term, however, we got what was WANTED and needed for generations. THOSE are the facts.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 10:34 AM
    speechlesstx
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, Steve:

    I agree with you, in the short term, you WON the talking points debate. In the longer term, however, we got what was WANTED and needed for generations. THOSE are the facts.

    Wanted by who?
  • Apr 22, 2010, 11:17 AM
    Catsmine
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by speechlesstx View Post
    Wanted by who?

    The followers of Sol Alinsky, of course. These days they're called Progressives.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 11:21 AM
    NeedKarma
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Catsmine View Post
    The followers of Sol Alinsky, of course. These days they're called Progressives.

    You mean this guy? Saul Alinsky - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    How does he fit in to anything? 99% of the population have no idea who he is.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 11:25 AM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by speechlesstx View Post
    Wanted by who?

    Hello Steve:

    I'm not talking specifically about THIS law, because THIS law isn't exactly what was wanted. It's a step in the right direction. But, even the wingers in congress said health care reform was wanted. I understand that this isn't the way they would have accomplished it. But, I also understand, that when they had a chance to accomplish it, they didn't even try.

    Nonetheless, in terms of the idea of reforming health care, Obama ran on it, and won. Evidently SOME people wanted it.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 11:27 AM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by NeedKarma View Post
    You mean this guy? Saul Alinsky - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    How does he fit in to anything? 99% of the population have no idea who he is.

    Hello NK,

    He's the guy, Glenn Beck says, that is the author of the left's guiding principles. Now, I never read him, but if he supports the Constitution like I support the Constitution, then he's my man.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 11:30 AM
    Catsmine
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by NeedKarma View Post
    You mean this guy? Saul Alinsky - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    How does he fit in to anything? 99% of the population have no idea who he is.

    And 99% of the population has no idea of the radical legislation excon just got. Saul's blueprint Rules for Radicals - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia is his relevance.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 11:38 AM
    excon

    Hello Cats:

    I just read the link that NK posted. I see nothing dangerous about his thinking. Then I read the post that you linked me to. You're talking to a 60's radical here, so what I read seems rather mild to me. In fact, it kind of looks like what the tea partiers are doing.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 11:48 AM
    NeedKarma
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Catsmine View Post
    And 99% of the population has no idea of the radical legislation excon just got. Saul's blueprint Rules for Radicals - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia is his relevance.

    Nothing wrong there, what do you find so radical?
  • Apr 22, 2010, 01:21 PM
    smoothy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, smoothy:

    So, the fire department owns it, and it pays for all that stuff. Really? Is THAT what you think? It doesn't dawn on you to ask who owns the fire department? The fact that you hold events to raise money for your department, doesn't clue you in that your community owns the fire department.

    Now, the word "community" has no legal bearing, so I suggest that there's another entity that owns the fire department, and that's probably your county. But, that's ok. We don't have to identify the particular entity that's responsible for the bills. Identifying it as COMMUNITY owned is good enough for my argument.

    That's because a COMMUNITY owned fire department is SOCIALISM at work on the local level. Now, because your community needs to have bake sales and bingo to pay for your fire department only means that the entity that owns it, like your county, is going broke. It doesn't change the fact that you pool your risk against fire. Pooling risk is Socialism.

    Socialism WORKS for you and your community. That would be unless you tell me that your fire department and your police department are PRIVATELY owned. Because that's the ONLY alternative to community owned. There ain't no in between.

    Again, smoothy my friend, I know you don't understand what I just said. It's ok.

    excon

    Socialism Steals from people who earn it to give to those who won't.

    Socialism is never good for everyone, only good for the takers.

    And these fire Departments ARE NOT owned by the community... in fact.. since you are unaware of it obviously. Most of America doesn't reside in an incorporated town or city. EVERY ONE of these Fire Departments I mentioned get everything they have without any tax money... the Fire Dpeartment owns its own equipment... no town, City or County.

    Where in the hell to you get off thinking the community owns everything... or even has the right to.

    IF the community owned it.. then the community would legally be required to pay wages... insurance... workmans comp... etc to every fireman.

    ANd for those not in a town or city... exactly what right do any of those towns or cities have to lay claim to anything outside their limits?.

    I'll tell you. None at all. And Incidentally... I am one of those multitudes who spent most of his life... NOT residing in any Town or City.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 03:33 PM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by smoothy View Post
    EVERY ONE of these Fire Departments I mentioned get everything they have without any tax money....the Fire Dpeartment owns its own equipment...no town, City or County. IF the community owned it..then the community would legally be required to pay wages....insurance...workmans comp...etc to every fireman.

    Hello again, smoothy:

    You ARE a good tea partier. You have NO clue about government, taxes, the Constitution, how things work, or how to make them better. The only thing you know is what Fox News tells you.

    I cannot continue to discuss these weighty issues with somebody who thinks the fire department owns itself.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 04:56 PM
    paraclete
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post

    I cannot continue to discuss these weighty issues with somebody who thinks the fire department owns itself.

    There's you mistake right there, ex, you think we are discussing weighty issues rather than any old BS that any one of us decides to spout.

    What I have observed, whether it is there, or here, is that politics consists of running commentaries on the events of the day with weighty issues being buried as rapidly as possible behind a façade of look what we have done for you.
    :D
  • Apr 22, 2010, 05:01 PM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    There's you mistake right there, ex, you think we are discussing weighty issues

    Hello again, clete:

    Some people are here to pass the time of day. I'm here to save the world.

    excon
  • Apr 22, 2010, 05:16 PM
    paraclete
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, clete:

    Some people are here to pass the time of day. I'm here to save the world.

    excon

    Hey, Ex, I used to be Superman but I don't remember passing my mantle to you. To paraphase a famous saying let the world save the world.

    But seriously no one listens to what we might think, we would have to fill our little blogs with forbidden words for it to even be read outside of this site, you know the words, ex, Jihad, Bomb, Target, Osama,.
  • Apr 22, 2010, 05:33 PM
    smoothy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, smoothy:

    You ARE a good tea partier. You have NO clue about government, taxes, the Constitution, how things work, or how to make them better. The only thing you know is what Fox News tells you.

    I cannot continue to discuss these weighty issues with somebody who thinks the fire department owns itself.

    excon

    Quite full of yourself aren't you... ever get out of your liberal town into the real world?

    I live in a city... my local fire department owns itself... it has its own mortgage on the firehouse and the property, it owns its own trucks... pays its own bills. The City doesn't pay it. THe City doesn't own it.

    Just because the Collective owns you and everything in your town doesn't mean the rest of the world operates like that. It certaily doesn't in my part of the world.


    And something else... No homeowners Collective (association) takes any money from me... or tells me what I can and can't do either on my property. I paint my house the collor I want... I plant whatever I feel like planting... and nobody can tell me otherwise.

    I know NOT living in a communist Commune is a foreign concept to you... but give it a try.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 05:20 AM
    smoothy
    1 Attachment(s)

    Here is the perfect suggestion to add to the health care bill.

    This is from a very real restaurant in PA... in my old stomping ground.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 05:53 AM
    excon

    Hello again, smoothy:

    You ARE a good tea partier. You spread the tea party lies. FOX News told you that you would go to jail if you didn't buy health insurance. It's a LIE. It ain't so. It ain't even close.

    But, keep going cause I don't have anything else to do today except to put tea partiers in their places. You said it above. You can't fix stupid.

    excon
  • Apr 23, 2010, 05:59 AM
    paraclete
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by smoothy View Post
    Here is the perfect suggestion to add to the health care bill.

    This is from a very real restaurant in PA.....in my old stomping ground.

    Great idea, you could extend it to sending illegals to jail and then it will be a short step to incarcerate the entire nation, tell me, when you get there, where will you house them and who will look after them. Think on this though
    According to the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS): "In 2008, over 7.3 million people were on probation, in jail or prison, or on parole at year-end — 3.2% of all U.S. adult residents or 1 in every 31 adults."[
    So if I read the statistics right, the jail and courts system is already failing as an incentive to uphold the law so why would you think it might work for health care insurance evaders, or the unemployed
  • Apr 23, 2010, 06:11 AM
    smoothy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, smoothy:

    You ARE a good tea partier. You spread the tea party lies. FOX News told you that you would go to jail if you didn't buy health insurance. It's a LIE. It ain't so. It ain't even close.

    But, keep going cause I don't have anything else to do today except to put tea partiers in their places. You said it above. You can't fix stupid.

    excon

    Stay happy in your little fantasy world... because that's exactly what they have in that bill. I suppose you've actually read it...

    Or are you like Nancy Pelosi... who never read a word of it?
  • Apr 23, 2010, 06:13 AM
    NeedKarma
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by smoothy View Post
    Stay happy in your little fantasy world....because thats exactly what they have in that bill. I suppose you've actually read it....

    Or are you like Nancy Pelosi....who never read a word of it?

    Ok then, provide proof that they will send you to jail since you've read it.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 06:16 AM
    smoothy
    2 Attachment(s)
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by paraclete View Post
    Great idea, you could extend it to sending illegals to jail and then it will be a short step to incarcerate the entire nation, tell me, when you get there, where will you house them and who will look after them. Think on this though
    According to the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS): "In 2008, over 7.3 million people were on probation, in jail or prison, or on parole at year-end — 3.2% of all U.S. adult residents or 1 in every 31 adults."[
    So if I read the statistics right, the jail and courts system is already failing as an incentive to uphold the law so why would you think it might work for health care insurance evaders, or the unemployed

    What would I do... here is another suggestion... same people.

    I have NO sympathy for the illegals. Nor the terrorist prisoners.

    I'd do the same for both. Push them out over their own country. I am sick of the lazy bums ignoring OUR laws... wasting OUR tax dollars.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 06:24 AM
    excon

    Hello again, smoothy:

    Yeah, we're not done. The prisoners in Gitmo haven't been found guilty of ANYTHING. There's been no trials. Of the 600 that your man Cheney said were "the worst of the worst", 400 of 'em have been let go.

    Now, you would murder the ones that are left. And you somehow think that makes you better than them. It doesn't.

    excon
  • Apr 23, 2010, 06:52 AM
    smoothy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, smoothy:

    Yeah, we're not done. The prisoners in Gitmo haven't been found guilty of ANYTHING. There's been no trials. Of the 600 that your man Cheney said were "the worst of the worst", 400 of 'em have been let go.

    Now, you would murder the ones that are left. And you somehow think that makes you better than them. It doesn't.

    excon

    Boy you are full of it today.

    Newsflash... they ARE terrorists... I suppose Osama Bin Laden hasn't been found guilty of anything either... nor have any other innocent terrorists that your Messiah Obama has been having killed in Iraq and Afghanistan. Gee... that Makes Obama a Murderer by your logic since none of them have been convicted of any crime.


    Enemy Combatants are NOT entitled to a criminal trial... only left wing loons believe that.

    I suppose all the Japanese that attacked peral Harbor were all innocent too, because YOU didn't give them a trial. Same with Adolf Hitler.


    You have to live on the west coast... because NOBODY that lives near NYC or Washington DC... except for Moron in the whitehouse believes they are inncoent.

    And its clear you were never a target of those TERRORISTS... which they are regardless of what YOU claim.

    You must have voted for that lunatic and communist Nancy Pelosi... because not even New Yorkers are that out of touch with reality.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 06:57 AM
    NeedKarma
    Smooth,
    Still waiting for the health care bill text that says people will go to jail.

    Sincerely,

    NK.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 07:02 AM
    smoothy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by NeedKarma View Post
    smooth,
    Still waiting for the health care bill text that says people will go to jail.

    Sincerely,

    NK.

    He made the claim saying its not in there as a penalty... he has to provide the evidence that its not. I'm still waiting for THAT evidence.

    THat Bill was a lefty bill after all... the lefties that support it should know where everything is and be able to back it up if its so damned good.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 07:12 AM
    excon

    Hello again, smoothy:

    I found an empty page. That's where it WOULD be if it was there, but it isn't. Want to see it?

    excon
  • Apr 23, 2010, 07:28 AM
    smoothy
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by excon View Post
    Hello again, smoothy:

    I found an empty page. That's where it WOULD be if it was there, but it isn't. Wanna see it?

    excon

    So... you know every word that's in it... there is a penalty section for those NOT volunteering to get this wonderful piece of crap.

    Post that section... you have essentually just stated there is no penalties for those who decide they don't want it, and its not on a blank page. Cut and paste is sufficient.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 07:51 AM
    NeedKarma
    Here is what the health care law says about the penalty for not carrying insurance.

    2) SPECIAL RULES.—Notwithstanding any other provision of law—
    ''(A) WAIVER OF CRIMINAL PENALTIES.— In the case of any failure by a taxpayer to timely pay any penalty imposed by this section, such taxpayer shall not be subject to any criminal prosecution or penalty with respect to such failure.
    ''(B) LIMITATIONS ON LIENS AND LEVIES.—The Secretary shall not—
    ''(I) file notice of lien with respect to any property of a taxpayer by reason of any failure to pay the penalty imposed by this section, or
    ''(ii) levy on any such property with respect to such failure.
  • Apr 23, 2010, 07:52 AM
    excon

    Hello again, smoothy:

    It's appropriate that you finally posted a billboard. That IS where you get your information. I can't argue with billboards or slogans. It ain't satisfying.

    I've tried to teach you a few things, like who owns your fire department, but you ain't interested in learning. You're interested in spouting the latest slogan.

    So, like many of our arguments, I'm going to end it here. Don't worry, I'll jump in here and there to point out your errors in the future. But, you won't get me involved into a "did so - did not" argument as this one has devolved into. That's what 4 year olds do.

    excon
  • Apr 23, 2010, 07:59 AM
    excon
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by smoothy View Post
    Post that section....you have essentually just stated there is no penalties for those who decide they don't want it,

    Hello again, smoothy:

    Error. Error.

    You said people will go to jail. We said they wouldn't. You said that means there is NO penalty. Can't argue with stupid.

    Error. Error.

    excon

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