Ask Me Help Desk - America tried in the court of public opinion

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Originally Posted by paraclete

What does that prove, that there is a process or that more often than not there is a problem?

Yes there is a process . Sometimes the shooting is justified and sometimes not . It also proves that when not justified the cop is charged .

Also I would never disarm the cops . Last year there were 126 officers killed . 50 were killed by guns.

Perhaps they could be a little more selectively armed, but more that that that they operate in pairs because it seems these problem acts occur more often where there are lone officers the idea that each should have a personal camera is also good as it seems such devices lower the incidence of killings and remove the Judge Dredd culture

agree with the cameras . Cops here in the NY area patrol alone but almost always wait for backup .

The police chief in this SC town is asking for cameras for all his officers. Many others around the nation are also. We have also seen some disturbing video's caught on camera where questionable behavior was acquitted or deemed justified, so just cameras alone are not the total solution to bad cop behavior/decisions, or citizen deaths, or injury.

This has been an issue for a long time before it became so public. Now it has to be dealt with and all the factors that go into making this a big problem.

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Originally Posted by talaniman

This has been an issue for a long time before it became so public. Now it has to be dealt with and all the factors that go into making this a big problem.

So why has it been a problem? Poor selection? Poor training? Police culture? I have observed that here the police is a blue collar job, is that the same there

Tal overstates the problem .

I recognize it for what it is, a symptom of a greater problem we have to deal with in our country.

Do you think there is a will to deal with such problems?

Is this indicative of the problem?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-32270655

??? a guy tries to off himself is indicative of nothing .

On the contrary it indicates he had a problem with some part of society, he shoots at the capital and offs himself, would indicate some resentment and a feeling of hopelessness.

If you are trying to say that everything is OK, I think there is evidence to the contrary but the solution...

He fired one shot at himself ... yes he had personal issues .In a nation of 319 people you'll find some of them .

The population is shrinking too many people offing themselves and others

Even with those that are offing themselves and others, the population is growing my overly pessimistic Aussie friend. :D

Yes you haven't found the cause yet, unlike your japanese friends, pity and that's optimism you are seeing

Could be PTSD, it's running rampant amongst veterans and first responders.

Come on karma you know that doesn't exist, stiff upper lip and all that. It is just the manefestation of an uncaring society.

We all get to the stage were we have seen enough and need to go do somethingelse. I can't imagine what successive rotations to Afghanistan and Iraq would do to you, the sense of hopelessness and maybe it's like that in the cities too, but I think it is more a loss of faith, when you have nothing to believe in but yourself where do you go?

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but I think it is more a loss of faith, when you have nothing to believe in but yourself where do you go?

So in your opinion those with PTSD are all unbelievers in your religion?

No I didn't say that, but unfortunately many have settled for a god of self and that is nowhere to be when you have problems. My comment was a general comment on the state of western society, Believers are a little thin in the ground in some places

So religion is the answer to western society ills? I think that's most of the problem since most true believers don't practice what they preach. At least not the ones who get elected.

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many have settled for a god of self and that is nowhere to be when you have problems.

Many settle their problems without a requirement for a belief.

One of my good friends is a veteran with PSTD and a regular church goer. He can't work though he's younger than I.
If you walked into a field of combat or a school after a shooting and saw innocent civilians with their heads blown off, this would not affect you uniquely because of your belief?

Karma, I'm not immune to such situations but I can tell you that healing is possible

Tal I'm not talking about religion, Smells and Bells don't cut it

You are the one who said flawed humans returning from war have no morality, and deny that they are even suffering mentally and emotionally,

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Come on karma you know that doesn't exist, stiff upper lip and all that. It is just the manefestation of an uncaring society.

We all get to the stage were we have seen enough and need to go do somethingelse. I can't imagine what successive rotations to Afghanistan and Iraq would do to you, the sense of hopelessness and maybe it's like that in the cities too, but I think it is more a loss of faith, when you have nothing to believe in but yourself where do you go?

But you probably cannot imagine generations of bombs and gunfire so of course a lack of empathy for conditions beyond control of some makes you blame and shame. For some being alive is a struggle from day to day, and to say no trauma exists under those conditions is a sad commentary of your own belief system in my view, because then you share this gem of wisdom (Derision and sarcasm font was supposed to engage),

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No I didn't say that, but unfortunately many have settled for a god of self and that is nowhere to be when you have problems. My comment was a general comment on the state of western society, Believers are a little thin in the ground in some places

So everybody is just godless by your judgement, and that's the problem while you fail yourself to be an example of your own god. You sound like Jerry Falwell without a TV show, or Rush Limbaugh without a microphone.

Just my general commentary on self righteous Australian society.

Thank you for your comment Tal, I can't imagine why you must take everything to the extreme perhaps it is that self righteous american in you speaking. There are fewer god fearing people than either you or I know but there are a lot of self righteous people around.

Your humor font is defective.

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There are fewer god fearing people than either you or I know

This is indeed good news!

I make that comment karma not because they don't believe but their actions speak for themselves

As do the actions of believers.

And athiests don't forget we are all in this boat together

Oh now we are all in the same boat. How convenient, but does that include all the other flawed humans you have been dumping on? Or just those you approve of?

Your boat seems to have preconditions attached to it.

And you enjoy rocking it Tal you know that my boat is open to all but you cannot go on the voyage without belief that's the price of the ticket. Some try to stowaway but unlike the muslims we don't throw people overboard because they they don't believe as we do. Karma is one of those who believes he can come on the voyage without a ticket, it is called the universal provider syndrome. I'm here so I must be entitled

Whatever floats YOUR boat.

OK I'll try this for the second time, why don't you tell us about your boat Tal?

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come on the voyage

what voyage?

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Originally Posted by paraclete

OK I'll try this for the second time, why don't you tell us about your boat Tal?

Don't have a boat. This is how I roll,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvsAqkOhI48

What I got from that is you love going around in circles

The world is one big circle that goes round, and round. We humans just go with it.

So there is no need to go in ever dimishing circles

So where does Baltimore place everyone a mob of young people protesting police violence goes entirely over the top.

Are their actions seen as justified, did the police go too far?

This problem of community sentiment needs to be addressed by a different model since it is clear the existing model is failing

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Originally Posted by paraclete

This problem of community sentiment needs to be addressed by a different model since it is clear the existing model is failing

Today it looks like the (black as well as white) adults have regained control and had peaceful demonstrations. I saw a video of one woman chasing and hitting at her masked teenage son, telling him behave and go home.

Quote:

Originally Posted by paraclete

This problem of community sentiment needs to be addressed by a different model since it is clear the existing model is failing

You don't have to be anti-police to recognize something seriously wrong with a perp dying of a broken back while in custody. Union rules putting the custodial officers on paid vacation without even charging them vacation time during the investigation causes a lot of anger as well. Large crowds attract criminals, that's an axiom. Large angry crowds attracting violent criminals isn't much of a surprise.