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Originally Posted by paraclete

You may not have active islamists in your nation but I can assure you they are active in other places as demonstrated by killings and other incidents in various places

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Maybe we're going to have to start recalling library cards we've issued to Muslims.

Clete, what percentage of Muslims are extremists?

Wondergirl you know that I don't have a precise handle on it and nor does anyoneelse and all things being relative it depends upon where you live. Let's use a well know political device to predict how many there might be. They say that for every person who writes a letter to a politician there are 500 of similar views, so for every extremist who is caught or who actually commits an offence there might be 500 of similar views. But extremists don't all manifest at the same time or in the same place. The people of Boston, Texas and various parts of the US may still harbour some among them as undoubtedly do the people of the United Kingdom, France, Spain, Australia, Indonesia, Pakistan. What I do know is there are more than 100 residents of my country fighting with Daesh and many sympathsisers still here. If there are 30,000 Daesh fighters then there might be 1,500,000 behind them. You may consider these number small but I consider them significant

I met a Muslism long ago and he came from Maynmar(Burma) This was the time of the Six Day War and he was talking Jihad. Even at this distance he held extremist views about what was taking place in the world.

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Originally Posted by paraclete

If there are 30,000 Daesh fighters then there might be 1,500,000 behind them. You may consider these number small but I consider them significant

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So that's what percentage?

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

So that's what percentage?

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Percentages like statistics are the hiding place of scoundels. I know what you want is to see some small percentage and say that's insignificant but the reality is the problem is not insignificant. There are many countries of the world that have been touched by muslim extremism. Whole nations have been engulfed, others disrupted. I doubt that there is a muslim nation that has not suffered terrorism, disruption, turmoil or even insurrection and there are many others who have suffered attacks. The greatest single source of refugees and displacement is the actions of muslim extremists with millions affected

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Originally Posted by paraclete

I know what you want is to see some small percentage and say that's insignificant but the reality is the problem is not insignificant.

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You're a psychic now? I guess I'll call my library.

Let's just say wondergirl I can see the direction you are going in, don't need to be psychic. Ask yourself how is it that the extremists haven't been rooted out of Islam by all those peaceful Muslims. Perhaps you think it is because of freedom of speech, if so your nation is in great danger

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Originally Posted by paraclete

Let's just say wondergirl I can see the direction you are going in

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Actually, that WASN'T the direction I was going in.

Well I don't have a clear count on the number of Muslims, nor have I extrapolated the backing of Daesh into a backing for muslim extremism world wide so at a wild guess somewhere between 5 and 10%. Numbers in places like Afghanistan, Pakistan, Nigeria, Somalia, Yemen, Gaza might be higher. I draw inference from the fact that the highest particpationary support for Daesh comes from Tunisia and that Daesh is a growing force in Libya. One can understand some of this where there are places where Muslims are under extreme pressure such as 100% of the Rohingya in Maynmar driving an exodus, and in Syria, Iraq and Yemen but in large muslim countries there is support, even government support of extremist groups.

One of the reasons we cannot know with accuracy is the structure of Islam which is not coordinated but each group has its own leader and these groups don't seem to quickly oust those with extremist views

Do you also throw out the baby after a bath? Or the whole bushel of apples because one was rotten? So why would you blast the whole of Islam for the actions of a few?

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Originally Posted by talaniman

Do you also throw out the baby after a bath? Or the whole bushel of apples because one was rotten? So why would you blast the whole of Islam for the actions of a few?

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I think it is because when the few have acted the rest seem to be just going along for the ride. You dont see any major uprisings on condemnation from the rest of the muslim population.


Why? If it is because of fear then what kind of religion lives like that? If someone watches something happen and does nothing about it then they are just as guilty. What will happen when in this country (United States) the population of muslim reaches a point of saturation and they receive protected status and we see sharia law creep into our system on a wide spread scale?

I think history shows that every major civilization/group/tribe has experienced this same dilemma, the conquering army terrorizing the unarmed subjugated population, who flee rather than fight, and immigration patterns following wars and conflict bear that out.

I think it unreasonable to think that sharia law will ever circumvent the law of the land here in America and more likely Islam like Christianity before it will be Americanized by those that have fled here and immigrated over the last 100 years.

Fact is most Muslims reject the extreme views of Sharia fundamentalists, just as Christians reject the extreme views of their fundamentalists. Extremism still exists true, but it's not limited to a particular group/religion/or region for that matter.

Take religion out of the equation and we till have the same roots as we always have had, poverty, ignorance and isolation exploited by those who enrich their own pockets and egos. Such is the history of mans condition. The tactic of fear is universal, as are it's motive.

Tal to talk like that actually denies history. Islam has not shown itself to be moderated by contact with other cultures, it actually seeks to subvert other cultures. Sharia law becomes an issue when there are sufficient muslims in the population to push it. Already in the UK it has become an issue and even in Australia with about 5% muslims they are pushing for it, so it is only a matter of time before it becomes an issue in the US. Any push for sharia law is an expression of muslim fundalmentalism

http://www.billionbibles.org/sharia/...haria-law.html

Islam is not a religion with a social conscience at least not in the Christian way, a muslim gives alms but not in an organised fashion so don't expect them to allievate poverty. The americanisation of Christianity will lead to the decline of christianity but I doubt americans will change Islam

Islam hasn't changed since the Battle of Tours in 732 or the original jihad against non-believing Arabs 622 (Medina) -634 (Siege of Damascus ).

You are right Tom the objective is still the same the establishment of the world wide caliphate, literally one world government with everyone bowing to Mecca five times a day.

Tal every time you defend Islam this is what you defend
Foreign Correspondent: Qatar World Cup labourers in filthy conditions

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Originally Posted by paraclete

Tal every time you defend Islam this is what you defend
Foreign Correspondent: Qatar World Cup labourers in filthy conditions

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The next big Clinton scandal that no one is covering is the fact that Clinton received money from both Qatar and from FIFA . Clinton was sent at taxpayer expense to Zurich to try to get the World Cup games for the US . Instead he left with a pocket full of $$$$$$$$$$ and the games scheduled to be held in the most inapproriate place on the planet .

Much as you would like to make Clinton responsible for your failure to buy the World Cup, he was just out gunned, but with a new FIFA President you may have a chance but you will have to get in line


http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/football/32982449

When you have the two most corrupting influences on the planet in the same place, Islam and money, some one like Clinton would be out of his league

can't think of a single reason why I'd want the World Cup here .

What I want is the Clintoons frog marched to a jail cell for the organized crime ring that family is .

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...-millions.html#

There was also no one happier than I when I learned that we would not be hosting the Olympics .

Also hope the NFL and the NY area learned their lesson and never plan to hold the Super Bowl in this area again .

Also wish they would find another city in the world to host the UN .

Now Tom you mustn't be isolationist. Wouldn't you like to host a true world series? Actually the world cup generates a lot of activity and revenue just like the olympics, we would have been happy to have it instead of Qatar which is a ridiculous place to hold it, but then we have a number of world class sporting venues so we wouldn't have to do much building. We are used to having attendences of 80 or 100,000. It might have coincided with the new Sydney airport

As to the Clintons there is a lot of corruption in high places and no one is immune it seems. No doubt we will hear much about it in the next year or so

the only corruption I've seen at their level was the Kofi Annan crime syndicate that he operated out of the UN .