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Originally Posted by tomder55

good plan . you can't supply your homes with energy but you plan on electrifying the whole auto fleet Brilliant

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Texas screwed up a few days and it cost some misery for a few during a RARE event for us. What does that have to do with the car companies?

you tell me . Do you think the national grid it up to it Here is the challenge . The average home in this country uses 30 kilowat to power appliances, computers, lights and heating and air conditioning. That takes an EV 100 miles . And the grid isn't divided evenly around the nation. What happens to EV when you have Texas sized blackouts? They are already talking about needing to charge EVs in off peak hrs . But people who drive need their vehicles charged and ready to go whenever they are needed .

electric vehicles are the same fallacy hydrogen powered vehicles are. We want to reduce energy dependence and yet every thing is done to increase dependence on the grid and why, to reduce mythical global warming. Sooner or later lifestyles have to change

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Originally Posted by paraclete

I think you are an atheist because of your anti christian views

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Ah, thank you.

Two questions for you:

1. Are Jews atheists because they don't believe Jesus is the Messiah? Can't get more anti-Christian than that. Same question (with variations) about the Sikhs, Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims, et al?

2. What, specifically, are my anti-Christian views?

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Originally Posted by tomder55

you tell me . Do you think the national grid it up to it Here is the challenge . The average home in this country uses 30 kilowat to power appliances, computers, lights and heating and air conditioning. That takes an EV 100 miles . And the grid isn't divided evenly around the nation. What happens to EV when you have Texas sized blackouts? They are already talking about needing to charge EVs in off peak hrs . But people who drive need their vehicles charged and ready to go whenever they are needed .

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You're absolutely right Tom, the grid is the crucial part of the infrastructure plan that makes everything else possible and I will admit at this time we are nowhere near close. That should change in the next decade or so, when we can talk about money for implementation and not just the huge amount of dough investment for research and development.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

you tell me . Do you think the national grid it up to it Here is the challenge . The average home in this country uses 30 kilowat to power appliances, computers, lights and heating and air conditioning. That takes an EV 100 miles . And the grid isn't divided evenly around the nation. What happens to EV when you have Texas sized blackouts? They are already talking about needing to charge EVs in off peak hrs . But people who drive need their vehicles charged and ready to go whenever they are needed .

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ah convenience, the old excuse, the excuse for the gas guzzzling SUV, wonder how SUV will go with electric engines, won't deliver the same power

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Originally Posted by tomder55

"It's all hands on deck " 100 % agree . Let the market decide

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The market DID decide and look what happened!'

The right is freaking out blaming AOC and the "Green" crowd for Texas. Even the governor who initially blamed the lack of updating equipment changed his tune and started dissing AOC and "Green". Does the guy know that millions of people are seeing him and his lies on TV?

As more info comes available re Texas, it's becoming very clear that the Republican powers in charge for decades had been repeatedly warned about this very thing but did NOTHING to prevent it.

The right-wing comments about wind power conveniently omit info about Canada and Greenland and other countries who have successfully utilized wind power in cold climates.

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The right-wing comments about wind power conveniently omit info about Canada and Greenland and other countries who have successfully utilized wind power in cold climates

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I already addressed this . For a cost largely unjustified for a 50 year event ,the windmills can be weatherized .One of the best ways is to blow gas powered heat into the blades .

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As more info comes available re Texas, it's becoming very clear that the Republican powers in charge for decades had been repeatedly warned about this very thing but did NOTHING to prevent it.

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I don't give the Repubs a pass . But it is a warning sign about over reliance on renewables .

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The market DID decide and look what happened!'

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nope it was mostly a government call The market would not choose a more expensive ;less dependable method of supplying energy . see Texas ​Renewable portfolio standard (RPS ) . Texas’s RPS mandates 5,000 megawatts (MW) of new renewables be installed in Texas by 2015 ,and 10,000 MW of renewable energy capacity by 2025.

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ah convenience, the old excuse, the excuse for the gas guzzzling SUV wonder how SUV will go with electric engines, won't deliver the same power

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Clete they do not have the same horse power ,but electric or hybrid SUVs are available . They cost more . You know why gas lines went down in Texas ? Well it used to be that the pumps were powered by gas . But now it is mandated that they are powered by electric . So when the electric wend down the gas used as back up power did not flow .

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Originally Posted by tomder55

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I already addressed this . For a cost largely unjustified for a 50 year event ,the windmills can be weatherized .One of the best ways is to blow gas powered heat into the blades .

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This is actually the 3rd event in the last 19 years. Ask me how I know that as FACT?

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I don't give the Repubs a pass . But it is a warning sign about over reliance on renewables .

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Nope, an initial investment to insulate with the right equipment and a routine maintenance program would have saved the misery, and lives.

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nope it was mostly a government call The market would not choose a more expensive ;less dependable method of supplying energy . see Texas ​Renewable portfolio standard (RPS ) . Texas’s RPS mandates 5,000 megawatts (MW) of new renewables be installed in Texas by 2015 ,and 10,000 MW of renewable energy capacity by 2025.

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That's what the energy providers sold the politicians at a cheap price with enough subsidies and loopholes to drive a truck through.

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Clete they do not have the same horse power ,but electric or hybrid SUVs are available . They cost more . You know why gas lines went down in Texas ? Well it used to be that the pumps were powered by gas . But now it is mandated that they are powered by electric . So when the electric wend down the gas used as back up power did not flow .

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What part of frozen supply lines are we disputing here Tom? Abbott already tried that spin. Even if what you say is true it was repubs who mandated the protocols that led to this failure, and while not the first failure definitely the worst. Failure to address the real problem because of cost cutting just gets worse. The cold caused the diminished capacity to meet the increased demand.

Former governor Rick Perry said it best

Rick Perry suggests Texans prefer blackouts to federal energy regulation (yahoo.com)

You buying that too? Wonder who he asked? Certainly nobody in my family who lost power for days. Having your own grid may puff up the ego, but a screw up can't be blamed on the feds, or federal policy.

Can't wait for my next electric bill.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

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Clete they do not have the same horse power ,but electric or hybrid SUVs are available . They cost more . You know why gas lines went down in Texas ? Well it used to be that the pumps were powered by gas . But now it is mandated that they are powered by electric . So when the electric wend down the gas used as back up power did not flow .

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so this is a prime example of why the environmental lobby is wrong, diversity is what keeps systems running, redundancy is what keeps systems running, it is not the planet that is in danger, it is the population, in danger of foolish ideas carried to extreme. we had the same sort of thing happen here a whole state reliant on wind power without supply because coal fired base line generation had been dismantled, they are reliant on battery back up now but it is still a foolish idea

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Originally Posted by tomder55

. For a cost largely unjustified for a 50 year event

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from Talinman
This is actually the 3rd event in the last 19 years.

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'Nuff said.

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This is actually the 3rd event in the last 19 years.


'Nuff said.

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The previous two were not comparable to this one. "Texans are preparing themselves for a winter storm predicted to be unlike anything they've seen in decades.A polar vortex will bring temperatures in the Lone Star State to below zero in the coming days, according to the National Weather Service. The service has issued a winter storm warning for the entire state.
In Houston, the NWS issued a wind chill warning for the first time in the city. Even as far south as San Antonio, residents are expected to receive two-to-three inches between Sunday and Monday morning."

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...m-polar-vortex

if it is the third event in 19 years, then precautions surely need to be taken to secure power supply. Someone is derelict in thier duty, several someones, state governors and the like. Don't tell me it is up to the market, legislators need to make sure the market is responsive

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Originally Posted by paraclete

if it is the third event in 19 years, then precautions surely need to be taken to secure power supply. Someone is derelict in thier duty, several someones, state governors and the like. Don't tell me it is up to the market, legislators need to make sure the market is responsive

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The Republican government were repeatedly warned that precautions needed to be implemented. They refused to do so. Derelict in their duty is a good way to put it. The oft-quoted mantra of the right that the market will correct things failed miserably in this instance. Effective regulation was the answer - an answer ignored, leading to death and misery.

Much more simple undertaking to make nukes or natural gas facilities weather secure as opposed to solar or wind.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Much more simple undertaking to make nukes or natural gas facilities weather secure as opposed to solar or wind.

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You must secure all your systems for efficient functions in all conditions. Anything less is irresponsible.

How do you secure solar against a covering of snow and loss of sunshine, how do you secure wind when the wind doesn't blow or they fail becuase of ice and snow. how do you secure the grid from similiar conditions, well at least that can be done, you underground it. Over reliance on market forces means you get the least done to secure the system, under reliance on regulation means you get the least done to secure the system. Seems to me you have a lot of slackers over there

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This is actually the 3rd event in the last 19 years.

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Central Texas near Ft Hood ,they had a record 205 hrs below freezing between 2/10 and today . Previous record was 150 hrs in 1983 .Abiline had 252 consecutive hours . So no ;this is something Texas has not experienced recently .

still no excuse Tom, climate change means the unpredictable can happen, will happen and has to be anticipated. Business as usual is never a good model

come on man !! (apologies to Quid) you can't prepare for all contingencies and it is silly to expend a lot of resources preparing for a 100 year event . Multi car pile ups happen in the southern states because they don't have mountains of salt and sand ready to spread at the 1st sign of a snow flake .