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And it IS an allegory

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There is no compelling reason to believe that. The authors of the NT took it as basically literal. "If we had no other means by which to determine whether Genesis is myth or history, the New Testament alone is ample proof. Depending on how one calculates the material, the New Testament has at least 60 allusions to Genesis 1-11, with over 100 allusions to the entire book.7 Jesus and the writers of the New Testament consistently treated Genesis as literal history. As a matter of fact, every New Testament author refers to Genesis, and nearly every New Testament book does as well. Their handling of the Genesis text demonstrates that they considered the events to have actually occurred, rather than being mythical or legendary folklore that merely contains useful lessons." https://apologeticspress.org/genesis...eral%20history.

But a person has to make his or her own decision regarding that. It is in the person and ministry of Christ that we take our basic stand. "Whosoever believeth in Him..." is still the lynchpin and glory of the Gospel message.

I prefer daaah. Its not full on duh, its halfwit daaah.

In fact God said; "When you eat of it you will surely die."

It was as good as eaten right then and their.

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In fact God said; "When you eat of it you will surely die."

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Sure sounds a lot like authority being exercised to me.

Prophecy?

Your missing the point.

Its the power of the Word. God gives man the Authority to speak.
When you allow God to speak through you, there is Power. Its the same as God speaking.

And prophecy REQUIRES authority.

But I still think we can agree on John 3:16.

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For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life

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.”
Main Points For/so: These are link words expanding or explaining something that was said earlier. Context: We need to look at the preceeding verses 14 and 15. “Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.” This refers to an event in Numbers 21:4-9. God was angry with the Israelites because of their sin of ingratitude. So God sent poisonous snakes which killed many of them. So they cried out to God. God refused to take the snakes away but told Moses to erect a bronze snake on a pole so that when the people who had been bitten looked at the snake they would not die. God provided a way of escape. Thus, in the same way . . . . . . v 16. Loved: past tense. (Not “loves”) Agape love – a love of action, that responds to a need

What's your take on this?

Just as the serpent was strictly an issue of obedient faith, so salvation now is a matter of obedient faith. So it still comes down to, "whosoever believeth in Him."

What about the love? Where's the Love...does God not Soooo love the World?
We tend to focus more on the love, and lose sight of the Cross.

Christ crucified, speaks much more about "The love of God" then Pointing out John 3:16 as a love verse.
This might speak about what we were talking about earlier. Speaking the Word of God without having to point out any reference verses? A non believer will never understand Gods love by pointing out chapter and verse. Yup, here it is...John 3:16 See It...it says right here; God Soooo loves you! Oh yah, that's Jesus on the cross, no worries bro, God still loves you. Yup, welcome, welcome welcome to our Church. Come come on in, God loves you...not knowing if they know that or even care. so what brings you to our church - you promised me a muffin and a meal ...you need to be seeking the cross in order to learn of the love God has for you.

God's love IS the cross.

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Christ crucified, speaks much more about "The love of God" then Pointing out John 3:16 as a love verse.

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Who pointed out John 3:16 as a love verse? The rest of your reply is just material that you cooked up yourself from who knows where. My emphasis was on the belief aspect which directly lifts up and glorifies Jesus as the source of all the goodness and mercy of God and identifies Him as the one and only necessary source of true salvation. Please stop using your inventive imagination to misrepresent what others here are saying. Not trying to be ugly but it would be helpful if you would try being a great deal more attentive and reply to what is actually stated.

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When you allow God to speak through you, there is Power. Its the same as God speaking.

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That's OK as long as we understand that no man speaks with the authority of Scripture. That's why Paul warned us in 1 Thessalonians, " Do not quench the Spirit. 20 Do not despise prophecies, 21 but test everything; hold fast what is good. " It is never necessary to "test" the Scriptures, but it is always necessary to test prophetic statements.

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Why do people in authority (politicians, clergy, educators, et al.) lie?

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since this is a biblical discussion
est veritas?(John 18:38)

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est veritas?(John 18:38)

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Perhaps even more to the point, "Quid est verum?"

my Latin is a bit rusty

Mine is non-existent. I used an online help to translate, "What is true?" as opposed to "truth".

Mine was literally ' is truth ?' 'What is truth ? ' is the correct English translation . I've never been sure if it was a mocking question or if Pilate was having trouble because of relativism

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Who pointed out John 3:16 as a love verse?

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Are you kidding? (This goes back to an earlier thread) Its the go-to place (verse) when declaring the Gospel (in today's world)...Spreading the love of God, by the Power of the "Word." Not at all backed up by the Holy Spirit...Backed by Scripture, only...this is what you get -no understanding of God's love. Just a belief system, A religious understanding.

Example: let me tell you about Gods love, ill back it up with scripture -John 3:16. Now let me tell you about myself, I'll back it up with Scripture...it is all empty pages without the Holy Spirit.

Using Scripture is not a thing (to an unbeliever) when discussing God's love. If it was then all's need be done is point out (which many do) John 3:16, and be on your way. If they don't accept it, that's on them. You've done your part. After all that is what the Bible says...I'm Backed by scripture, not by my mouth or what comes out of my mouth or actions, all I need know, is scripture and where to find it...I'm backed by scripture and that is everything to me!

It's nice to be backed up by scripture but it is not everything. A person might find himself depending on Scripture more than The Word...the living Word...Not ever becoming aware of a potential problem or defect. You don't need to debate or discus the Word of a King...unlike the kingdom in which we now belong too.. The Kingdom of heaven is not a Democrecy.




Note:
Jesus being tried in the proper court was a must...the proper Authority? The religious Court (God) had not been given the Authority...God set it up that way. Human authority Decreed him guilty. That (Man had the Authority, going in for the kill) and the fact that God (speaks) said; Curse is the One who Hangs on a Tree. This is a court room, and we have a cell waiting for us. It is all about legality -Authority, Laws, judgement, testimony, justification etc.

God gave Authority to man, God gave Laws. God will not break his word. God will not interfear without having the Legal right to do so...isn't it Amazing that Jesus showed up on the scene. That God is King and has gone through the proper channels in order to become Man and Lord of all creation!

Who says God is too big to be part of his creation...and if he was ever part of his creation then he is no God???

I've often wondered as well what Pilate's point was. He was replying to the contention of Christ that, "Everyone who is of the truth listens to my voice.”

38Pilate said to him, “What is truth?” Perhaps his question was serious. Life did not turn out well for poor Pilate.

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Originally Posted by waltero

Spreading the love of God, by the Power of the "Word." Not at all backed up by the Holy Spirit...Backed by Scripture, only...this is what you get -no understanding of God's love. Just a belief system, A religious understanding.

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Wow, Waltero, I'm starting to understand you. I've been saying the same thing - in different words. Belief is a part of it, just not all of it.

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Now let me tell you about myself, I'll back it up with Scripture...it is all empty pages without the Holy Spirit.

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I'm listening.

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Using Scripture is not a thing (to an unbeliever) when discussing God's love. If it was then all's need be done is point out (which many do) John 3:16, and be on your way. If they don't accept it, that's on them. You've done your part. After all that is what the Bible says...I'm Backed by scripture, not by my mouth or what comes out of my mouth or actions, all I need know, is scripture and where to find it...I'm backed by scripture and that is everything to me!

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You are saying it far better than I ever did. I'm humbled by your insights.

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It's nice to be backed up by scripture but it is not everything. A person might find himself depending on Scripture more than The Word.

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EXACTLY! Let those who have ears hear.

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It's nice to be backed up by scripture

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If it's only "nice", then the problem becomes evident.

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A person might find himself depending on Scripture more than The Word.

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I have found that people usually make such comments when they have beliefs not really supported by the Bible.

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I'm starting to understand you

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Ah, errr, wait a minute - this wasn't suppose to happen? Should I be worried?

@JL: The Bible should tell you more about yourself than anything else...it is you that is in "this book.
Example: Tell me a little about yourself...backed by scripture!

Let your word "Live in me, oh God!

Why do you think the Pharisees and scribes asked Jesus - by what Authority do you do these?
What was Jesus answer??? (backed by scripture?)

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@JL: The Bible should tell you more about yourself than anything else.

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Why do you believe that?

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Why do you think the Pharisees and scribes asked Jesus - by what Authority do you do these?
What was Jesus answer??? (backed by scripture?)

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He appealed to John the Baptist, who himself had been prophecied...by Scripture.

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Originally Posted by waltero

.Ah, errr, wait a minute - this wasn't suppose to happen? Should I be worried?

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LOL - good question!

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The Bible should tell you more about yourself than anything else...it is you that is in "this book.

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You're on a roll, W.

I once read a book about what the author called "theology". They were simple stories about God and how people reacted to God. In the preface, he advised the reader to see himself in the stories, not someone else. I think you're saying something similar.

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Let your word "Live in me, oh God!

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Yearning like the Psalmist.

It's a simple equation. When a person wants to believe whatever he/she wants to believe, then that person will cut loose from any objective standard as much as possible.