You mean folks like this should get off their duffs and get a job? I think they had one until they didn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Jobless claims: Another 712,000 Americans filed new unemployment claims last week (yahoo.com)
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You mean folks like this should get off their duffs and get a job? I think they had one until they didn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Jobless claims: Another 712,000 Americans filed new unemployment claims last week (yahoo.com)
The 25 points of the Nazi charter ;cowritten by Hitler is chock full of socialism .
It calls for equality of rights for Germans . It calls for the subjugation of the people to the state ;confiscation of wealth ,and land ,the nationalization of industry ,profit sharing for the worker , extension of old age welfare ,duty of the individual to the state ,the communalization of the great warehouses and those being leased at low costs to small firms, nationalizing education; regulation of the press,
National Socialist Program - Wikipedia
Quote:
For oddball reasons, the modern-day right has seized on the NAZI name to claim Hitler was a socialist. I can expect that of illiterates, but not you, tom. The name of the party preceded Hitler by several years. You really should know better.
Actually I first read that when I read Hayek's 1944 book 'The Road to Serfdom' . So no it is not some alternate history . It is a fact . Hayek described Nazism as a “genuine socialist movement” . National Socialism was a collectivist authoritarian movement .The Nazi ideal embraced identity politics based on the primacy of the people, (volk) and invoked state based solutions for every possible problem. It was nation based socialism.
Yeah I get it ,European Socialists of the 1940s were embarrassed about what their movement had wrought .Not surprisingly they were not so embarrassed by Stalin's version even though Stalin exterminated many more people than Hitler ever dreamed of . So they concocted this false narrative that Nazis were some off shoot of capitalism . That is the narrative that is ridiculous .
This is an unusual situation, especially considering that much of the economic damage being done is at the direction of brainless pols who really believe that we can just shut down vast areas of businesses and leave these people with no jobs. It's insane.
perfect liberty doesn't exist, if you want to defend it it comes at a cost. If you don't support those without support society will degenerate into anarchy. Unfortunately the only way to make sure everyone contributes short of robbery is taxation and while I consider taxation is theft it is a necessary evil to ensure an ordered society particularly in these times when people are unemployed or destitute through no fault of their own but never the less those like you will cling to their money in the name of liberty just as they cling to their gunsQuote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Nothing perfect exists on this earth. That's no excuse to ignore liberty.Quote:
perfect liberty doesn't exist,
But everyone does not contribute, and there is no desire whatsoever amongst liberals for everyone to contribute. The battle cry is always for the wealthy to pay their fair share, which is absolute nonsense. Tax the rich! How does that ensure that "everyone" pays?Quote:
Unfortunately the only way to make sure everyone contributes short of robbery is taxation and while I consider taxation is theft it is a necessary evil to ensure an ordered society particularly in these times when people are unemployed or destitute through no fault of their own but never the less those like you will cling to their money in the name of liberty just as they cling to their guns
For those who are sound of mind and body, you usually do them no favors by passing out money. That's how we find ourselves in the insane situation of having college students who expect the taxpayers to pay off their loans. And if you really want everyone to contribute, then why did you limit your suggestion to only those making more than 2.5 mil?
Illinois struggled with this -- a flat income tax or a graduated income tax.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Which state in America hands out welfare benefits or free money without work requirements? Which state does that for life?
More hardcore right wing BS!
from those who can to those who can't, I know you don't like the concept but who but the rich have the ability to contribute to support the society that made them rich. You rail against the taxation of the rich but the poor are made poorer by taxation
All taxation makes everyone poorer. I don't rail against the taxation of the rich. I oppose the forced charity imposed upon others by people like you who say you want everyone to contribute until the truth finally comes out. I find that people like you are all in favor of raised taxes so long as it is do ne to someone else. It is why I say repeatedly that I never meet the person who is in favor of raising taxes on him/her self in order to help the poor. It always comes down to, "Vote for So and So, because he will raise taxes on the rich to give goodies to you!" It is sickening to me.Quote:
I know you don't like the concept but who but the rich have the ability to contribute to support the society that made them rich. You rail against the taxation of the rich but the poor are made poorer by taxation
Plainly you are free to believe what you will, and I don't intend to sound harsh. You want to tax the wealthy to pay for the poor, and do so against their will. You feel that is justifiable. I question it greatly. I guess that's where it stands. I do have some sympathy for the idea of using some tax revenues to help those who genuinely need it, but at present it is being used to encourage out of wedlock births by basically making husbands/fathers nothing more than a option, and to encourage people not to work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Tom, you've been hoodwinked by the alt-right. The following is from the very link you provided.
Historian Karl Dietrich Bracher writes that,
To [Hitler, the program] was little more than an effective, persuasive propaganda weapon for mobilizing and manipulating the masses. Once it had brought him to power, it became pure decoration: 'unalterable', yet unrealized in its demands for nationalization and expropriation, for land reform and 'breaking the shackles of finance capital'. Yet it nonetheless fulfilled its role as backdrop and pseudo-theory, against which the future dictator could unfold his rhetorical and dramatic talents.
Like Hitler, Trump offers an effective, persuasive speech at his rallies to manipulate the masses. His lies are pure decoration, yet his pseudo-theory attracts nearly half the population in thrall to him. The wannabee future dictator came close to toppling this country and destroying its democracy.
Like an insane man, Trump continues his mad screed of screaming that he was robbed and that the election was rigged. The world watches in absolute astonishment.
In the end, decency and goodness won.
I am not in favour of taxation per see and I have said many times I consider taxation is theft so your continual characterisation of me as a person who favours raising taxation is plainly wrong and an excuse to once again sing your favourite song and dance the dance of raining on the poor saying they are not entitled to support. Charity is plainly inadequate to provide for those who have little and if the rich and super rich are coerced to contribute more of what is a super abundance I see they are unharmed by itQuote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
First you say you are, "not in favour of taxation per se," and that my characterization of you as a person who favors raising taxes is "plainly wrong". But you conclude by saying, " and if the rich and super rich are coerced to contribute more of what is a super abundance I see they are unharmed by it." Well, you can't have it both ways. My characterization of you seems to be exactly correct. You don't want your taxes raised, but you do want to raise taxes on others, so you're all for charity as long as it doesn't cost you anything. You are advocating for the exact kind of painless charity that others on this board advocate for. "Let the rich pay for it!" It's the song and dance of the Biden supporters. "Vote for Biden and he'll pay off your student loans." It's the same something for nothing idea that they've been selling for years now.
The problem with the idea is that it all comes down to government confiscation of another person's property, and all on the idea that someone else has decided they really don't need to have it. Well I would suggest to you that both of us likewise have property that we really don't need. Should the government come and take that as well? If they can do it to the wealthy, then why not to you? And compared to most of the rest of the world, aren't you similarly "super rich"?
You do realize that you voted for the dufus for your own reason so why can't others have their own reasons for their vote like you did? Seems a bit self righteous, but the fact is whatever the reasons you seem to have been outvoted this time.
Bummer ain't it?
Like eminent domain at the southern border....federal government jerking ranchers' property out of their grip in order to build a useless wall.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
No one is questioning that.Quote:
You do realize that you voted for the dufus for your own reason so why can't others have their own reasons for their vote like you did?
Are you also opposed to eminent domain being used to build highways?Quote:
Like eminent domain at the southern border....federal government jerking ranchers' property out of their grip in order to build a useless wall.
What if it's your property they want to build an interstate through?Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
You did not answer the question. That is very common for you, but I'll step up and answer yours anyway.
It does change things when it becomes personnel. To make a comparison, I am all in favor of the police arresting criminals unless, of course, I'm the criminal. Now in my case, I have actually had to deal with the state buying some of our land to build a highway on. They paid us very well, and we used a good bit of that to send our two kids through college when, before that, we had no really good idea of how we would do that. But that is not the case with everyone, and I understand that, but I don't know how you can have a modern country without eminent domain. So to be critical of Trump using eminent domain to build some of the southern wall, but then not be willing to simply express an opinion on the general use of eminent domain just strikes me as pretty lame.
Neither did you.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
I just answered the question. Look above.
So it's okay for the government to take your land and money to build a wall, but feeding and sheltering the least is out of the question?
Always the nasty comment.... *sigh*Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
At least I can spell. (Am returning the "compliment")Quote:
It does change things when it becomes personnel.
The federal government isn't taking any care toward its citizens and the environment in how it's using the eminent domain power. Private property, state lands, wildlife preserves -- all are fodder for Trump's gristmill he calls a wall.
From https://www.theyucatantimes.com/2020...-and-wildlife/ --
The project is part of the administration’s ongoing effort to install at least 450 miles of new and replacement barrier along the 2,000-mile southern border before Trump leaves office, much of it on protected public lands. The result, according to Indigenous communities and environmental advocates, has been ecological and cultural destruction on a shocking scale. “This new construction has bulldozed a huge amount of desert habitat, blasted rugged mountains, destroyed cultural sites,” says Laiken Jordahl, a campaigner with the Center for Biological Diversity. “It’s absolutely devastating.”
Truth can kind of sting, can't it? You have, in fact, still not answered it. Sigh. You see a potential trap coming that will not work for your argument, so you just avoid it. Yep. It's pretty lame.Quote:
Always the nasty comment.... *sigh*
I know. It's terrible if Trump does it. TDS on display.Quote:
The federal government isn't taking any care toward its citizens and the environment in how it's using the eminent domain power. Private property, state lands, wildlife preserves -- all are fodder for Trump's gristmill he calls a wall.
This is according to indigenous communities and environmental whackos? Go figure.Quote:
ecological and cultural destruction on a shocking scale.
Says the hardcore right wing wacko. Pot? Kettle? Makes no difference...pick one!
more like a camp oven eh?
What did I say that you disagreed with? Ever notice how often you leave out the essential?Quote:
Says the hardcore right wing wacko.
You know what I disagree with...why you playing? Pick any post, doesn't matter especially you're response to this one,
You got proof you're NOT a wacko?Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
In other words, you don't have the slightest idea. As to feeding and sheltering the least, when you are actually doing something yourself, then get back with us. OR when you are ready to call for an increase in YOUR taxes, then you will sound like something more substantial than the bleating of sheep.Quote:
You know what I disagree with...why you playing? Pick any post, doesn't matter especially you're response to this one,
That's all you got? You do know when the dufus finally leaves you have to leave with him because despite the best efforts we don't seem to be able to separate your head from the dufus's a$$.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
How'd you get so far up there anyway?
I'm very concerned about this strange fascination you have with other men's rear ends. How long have you had these strange fantasies? Strikes me as kind of sick, but at any rate it's not my deal at all, so I'll leave that to you. I guess I'd think you might want to keep that obsession more of a secret, but you can barely make it a month or two without wanting to talk about it. Have you seen professional help about these fantasies??? Do you go to websites to see these images you seem to love so much? Certainly is nothing to be proud of. Very sad.
As to the rest, if you ever want to impress anyone with your concern for the poor, then get your own money involved in it. Until then, it's just hot air. It means nothing.
No guy I'm worried about where your head is stuck at.
obviously never heard of don't ask, don't tell which masked such a fascination for years and as to the hot air that means nothing, it would all go away if you would just shut upQuote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Tal, it's fine. It does seem to be either a sick humor or a sick fantasy life with you since you are the only person, literally, I have ever met in my entire life that loves to talk about it so much, or talk about it at all for that matter. It has never occurred to me in 67 years to ask another man (or woman) such a sick question, and it's really a strange, strange affair you have. Nonetheless, I do know that God loves you a great deal, so it is not for me to be harsh with you. It's puzzling, but it's your strange problem to deal with, so rant away. It means nothing.
I'm sure it would. You could all sit around and pat yourselves on the back for being so noble in your feelings about the poor that you are perfectly willing to force others to give them money. But you can forget that. Someone on this board has to point out your fake charity, and I guess it's me, so get used to it. I know it irritates you to have it pointed out, but that's your problem.Quote:
it would all go away if you would just shut up
You have absolutely NO idea what any of us here give for charity and how we help others, financially and otherwise, who need a boost. Please stop saying we "force others to give them money."Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
If you will stop doing it, then I'll stop saying it. It's a core belief of liberal dems and of the Harris/Biden ticket to raise taxes on the wealthy so you can "take care" of the poor by making the wealthy pay their "fair share", a notion that has been shown to be foolishly fake here many times. I know none of you have ever voted to raise your own taxes, or at least you can't name the time you did if that was the case. There is one person on this board who has flatly stated he does not want his own taxes raised. I do give you somewhat of a pass. You do at least seem to take a personal (I listened to your correction!) interest in the poor, but you insist on voting for the fake charity of raising taxes on others but not yourself.Quote:
You have absolutely NO idea what any of us here give for charity and how we help others, financially and otherwise, who need a boost. Please stop saying we "force others to give them money."
Doing what?Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
I have mentioned it (posts 95 and 126) and did vote that way on November 3.Quote:
I know none of you have ever voted to raise your own taxes, or at least you can't name the time you did if that was the case.
What you said.Quote:
Doing what?
You have never mentioned any specific instance where you voted to raise your own taxes. Vague references will get you nowhere.
Post #95 wasn't specific enough for you?Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
A simple date??? Hardly.
Along with #126?Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
(Clue from post #126: Which would raise my taxes, a flat tax or a graduated tax?)
Fraid not, and not even when you count post 1 to post 159. The point is voting to raise your own taxes. You have not given any specifics on that.
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