suppress the vote? for a moment I thought I was back on the IRS scandal op. Now that was wholesale vote suppression !
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suppress the vote? for a moment I thought I was back on the IRS scandal op. Now that was wholesale vote suppression !
Don't know how it works where you are but we have an electoral role and you have to identify yourself against that, these roles are automatically maintained by the electoral office so registered deaths are automatically struck off, the parties are very active scouring the nursing homes to gain postal votes and actively promote postal voting, but then this is what is possible in a centralised system where there is no local interferrence. If you are to vote multiple times you are just being an idiot because you will be fined for electoral fraud and if you fail to vote you will also be fined so no incentive for someone to steal your vote.
And I think that is a GREAT idea... and would support it, as would most conservatives. The Liberals here however want nothing to do with anything like that... they don't even want people to be required to show a legal ID. The only excuse to do such.. is the desire to continue allowing wholesale voting fraud. Committed by their side. Thats how Al Frankin stole an election...and how Obama got voted in twice just to name two.Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
That's not entirely true smoothy since many forms of ID have been used for goods and service, but when you specify a different criteria for ID and what it takes to obtain them you put many into a trick bag to comply. I mean its kind of obvious when you allow a hunters license to suffice but not a state college ID, and cut early voting to create longer lines in some communities, and also close some DMV's in more populated areas, and move them to more rural ones, are just examples of targeting voter suppression by the republicans who make these laws.
I am for a national ID but not with the shenanigans, and agenda that goes with them. Especially when republican party leaders have stated the goal was to help republicans win elections. Now you can ignore all of that, but you cannot ignore the ruling of many court across the nation that have already struck down these laws as being prejudicial, and unconstitutional.
Not that you guys won't stop trying.
the liberals here are fine with it, they don't have to pressure voters to turnout and can focus on the issuesQuote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
I actually like the concept of everyone voting Clete, but I have always pointed out that the size of your population as compared to ours means you have less logistical nightmares than we do. We also have 50 independent jurisdictions to contend with and some are more proficient than others in the fair department.
But we have had voting rights issues since the founding, and still haven't gotten it right.
THey might forcus on the issues In Australia... out our way they follow the school of "if you can't dazzle them with brilliance, then baffle them with BS". The democrats stopped trying to dazzle people a long time ago... they go straight to the baffle them with BS part these days.Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
That was a kind of partisan assessment smoothy, seeing as how no new ideas come from your side, but plenty of BS has been produced. In truth neither side has addressed the real issues as elections are always looming on the horizon, so more BS is expected from all the ruling class elites.
We have lots of new ideas... the partisan hacks that jokingly call themselves journalists refuse to bring them to common public knowledge.
And proof what I said is not partisan... just look at EVERYTHING that has come out of the Obama administration... there has not been a more partisan administration in the history of this country.
Its foolish to expect a liberal to act in the way a conservative, and equally foolish to think conservatives will act in a liberal way, but the real issue is no compromise position can be attained and that's the way its supposed to work.
Even the Voter ID laws can be reconciled if you would recognize the suppression of particular targeted groups. One of the reasons you get sued is the narrow minded focus of winning an election and justifying it with integrity of the vote. The rhetoric doesn't match the facts, and the courts rule against your version of cause and effects and the outcomes you want being DEVIOUS, and prejudicial.
You have never answered the effects of moving DMV's from heavier mostly minority enclaves to rural setting. Nor have you disclosed that all those free ID's require money and the ability to travel outside the dwellings of most city bound public transportation centers to buy those documents to get a free ID. The most egregious, and most devious tactic is the time table is always just before the next election.
Expect more lawsuits.
THis fictitious suppressed group?
THe Illegals? THe Dead people? Or the group that feels they are entitled to more than one vote per person? Other than those there is no group anyone is trying to suppress. And none of those three groups are entitled to do what they want anyway.
What about non driving poor working people. Of course you ignore those groups which are predominately minorities and democratic voters.
Really... exactly how do poor people apply for or collect benefits of any type.. without an ID? Oh... thats why.. we are talking the illegals... and those poor working dead folk... who are upset they won't be allowed to vote as often as they want. Not US citizens. Who actually have a heartbeat.
You don't get food stamps, welfare, subsidized housing or any other handout without having an ID when you apply for them. You have to have one when you apply for a job because the employer is legally required to verify a lot of things. THe poor working folk you talk of all have ID's.
It's the dead people that can't get their renewed... and the Illegals that aren't entitled to one... and local jurisdictions frown upon people having more than one.
Just admit it... opposing votor ID is all about supporting voter fraud.
Hello again,
Allegations of widespread voter fraud often prove greatly exaggerated. It is easy to grab headlines with a lurid claim (That's how Franken and Obama WON!). Yet on closer examination, many of the claims of voter fraud amount to a great deal of smoke without much fire. They simply do not pan out.
The link is to a REPORT by the Brennan Center for Justice at the New York University School of Law.
Here's a portion:
It may be a little much for our non reality based community.. You know, a study from an actual university, and all.Quote:
Allegations of election-related fraud make for enticing press. Many Americans remember vivid stories of
voting improprieties in Chicagoland, or the suspiciously sudden appearance of LBJ's alphabetized ballot box
in Texas, or Governor Earl Long's quip: “When I die, I want to be buried in Louisiana, so I can stay active
in politics.” Voter fraud, in particular, has the feel of a bank heist caper: roundly condemned but technically
fascinating, and sufficiently lurid to grab and hold headlines.
Perhaps because these stories are dramatic, voter fraud makes a popular scapegoat. In the aftermath of a close
election, losing candidates are often quick to blame voter fraud for the results. Legislators cite voter fraud as
justification for various new restrictions on the exercise of the franchise. And pundits trot out the same few
anecdotes time and again as proof that a wave of fraud is imminent.
excon
yeah no reason to be suspicious when absentee ballots mysteriously appear in trunks of cars during recounts.
Typical Democrat stratagy... misdirect or try to change the subject.
#1. Dead people aren't allowed to vote.
#2. Illegals aren't allowed to vote.
#3 The remaining people who actually do have the right to vote... are only allowed to vote once... not as many times as they can each election.
Nobody is trying to deny THEM the right to vote... Showing proof of who you are only ensures they have the right to vote.
The so-called poor manage to find ID's when it comes time to get free stuff or apply for free stuff. They can break out that same ID when its time to vote.
Hello again,
The above from a study by the Brennan Center For Justice at New York University School of Law.Quote:
It is more likely that a person will get struck by lightning, than it is for him to impersonate another voter
It's, you know, a REAL STUDY. I thought I'd mention it again lest it be ignored.
excon
votes cast exceed the number of registered voters in some precincts in Philly ... nothing there ...move on.
The Dems even steal elections from each other .
Troubling actions by Board of Elex members - NY Daily News
Hello again,
I can HEAR you. You KNOW I'm in the room, don't you? I guess I have to post MORE of the, uhhh STUDY, from a REAL University. You seem to be IGNORING it. Guess what? I ain't gonna let ya.
Quote:
These inflated claims are not harmless. Crying “wolf ” when the allegations are unsubstantiated distracts attention from real problems that need real solutions. If we can move beyond the fixation on voter fraud, we will be able to focus on the real changes our elections need, from universal registration all the way down to sufficient parking at the poll site.
Moreover, these claims of voter fraud are frequently used to justify policies that do not solve the alleged
wrongs, but that could well disenfranchise legitimate voters. Overly restrictive identification requirements for voters at the polls — which address a sort of voter fraud more rare than death by lightning — is only the
most prominent example.
Over to you, wingers..
excon
Okay keep ignoring what the judges have said case, after case, where your headlines and hollering have LOST as legal arguments over, and over, and over again.
NOW explain THAT!
you won't get my ear arguing that if a judge says it ,it must be so. I don't see their power as absolute as you do.
The Brennan Center is Wrong: Voter Fraud is a Real Threat to Every Citizen's Constitutional Rights
got a bit of a problem with judicial integrity do we
Well heck Tom, you can call the judge wrong, but you have to appeal it. That's just the law, and the process. I mean you guys are arguing you're right AFTER being JUDGED wrong, AGAIN, AND AGAIN, AND AGAIN.
Oh, your link is from 2012, after the judge said you guy were WRONG!!
Yes Tom likes to rely older thoughts
Shock News!!!! That Voter Fraud Which Has Never Been Proven Has Happened Again!!! | suyts space Its been proven to be real over and over again... its only the democrats that have everything to lose that keep denying it. THis was only ONE district that was looked closely at...and it was by an NBC affiliate. NBC is a left wing network.
Hello again, tom:
Here's the deal.. I quoted a real study, done by people who have NO stake in the outcome... Why it's real, is because the facts and it's conclusions can be VERIFIED. I'm NOT surprised that you can't tell the difference between scholarly work, and opinion by a partisan hack.
excon
The "partisan hack " referenced The Pew Research center as his source:Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
.Quote:
Pew Research Center is a nonpartisan fact tank that informs the public about the issues, attitudes and trends shaping America and the world. It conducts public opinion polling, demographic research, media content analysis and other empirical social science research. Pew Research does not take policy positions
About the Pew Research Center | Pew Research Center
Among their findings according to the "non-partisan " NY Slimes is that
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/14/us...inds.html?_r=0Quote:
One in eight active registrations is invalid or inaccurate. At the same time, one in four people who are eligible to vote — at least 51 million potential voters — are not registered. The report found that there are about 1.8 million dead people listed as active voters. Some 2.8 million people have active registrations in more than one state. And 12 million registrations have errors serious enough to make it unlikely that mailings based on them will reach voters.
There is a way to fix this ,but the Dems resist it because they rely on the game being rigged.
How?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
So the solution is another purge?Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
Florida's latest voter purge bid draws criticism
Now you find 94(?).Quote:
In 2012, at Scott's behest, the state attempted to purge non-U.S. citizens from voter rolls in an effort he said to address voter fraud. The state's list of potential non-citizens began with 182,000 names but later was reduced to as few as about 200. The effort was halted before the presidential election in the wake of opposition from Florida's elections supervisors and a flurry of lawsuits.
How many will you purge from certain zip codes this time?
now the Brennan Center also describes itself as 'nonpartisan ' . Then further on they say .....
http://www.brennancenter.org/aboutQuote:
A singular institution — part think tank, part public interest law firm, part advocacy group, part communications hub — the Brennan Center seeks meaningful, measurable change in the systems by which our nation is governed.
Indeed . It's named after one of the most liberal judges to ever serve in SCOTUS ,Justice William J. Brennan, Jr. and the biggest proponent of the so called 'Living Constitution'.
So you may think that the study was just some academic research ... But now you know better . The authors had a point of view and looked for "facts " to support it. Oh ;one more thing ....The price tag for the report? George Soros's Open Society Foundations gave the Brennan Center $7,466,000 from 2000 to 2010. New York University also received $2,819,540 during this same time period. That's a total of $10, 285,540.
Solution is arresting the people who illegally registered to vote... toss them in jail for a few months followed by immediate deportation upon their release for those who were illegals... for those voting numerous times as citizens... a bit longer in jail followed by a permanent loss of voting privledges. And a lengthy prison sentence if they get caught a second time. THe story I quoted they found far more than 94 and it was in a single voting district...and there is zero reason to expect it is unique to just that one. Extrapolated percentage wize according to population...it could easily be over 600K illegal votes....near all of which were democrat votes. Al Frankan should not be in office ...and never should have...nor should Obama and quite a few other democrats. Because the fraud ammounts far exceede the margins they won by.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Hello smoothy:
I'm gonna throw some real common sense at you, and you're STILL gonna deny what I say is true..Quote:
Solution is arresting the people who illegally registered to vote..
Obama is deporting illegal aliens at TWICE the rate of George W. Bush. I don't like it, but so far, he's sent 2 MILLION of 'em packing.. Now, just pretend you're ONE of them.. If you were, you really don't want ANY confrontations with local authorities. You stay AWAY from situations like that. You don't want to put yourself into a position of getting caught and sent back...
So, if you're THIS person, would you walk into a state registrars office and show whatever ID you have and demand to be registered???? No. Of COURSE, you wouldn't. Nobody would.
But, you're gonna tell me that illegals DO, and they do it in numbers that matter. Ummm, umm, ummm..
excon
Now I get it. Cut fraud and make it hard for legal American's who are minorities, and young people to vote, and you guys can take your country back. Brilliant plan but we knew that was the plan. See you in court again.
That's what he claims... He also claims the economy is doing great and unemployment is lower than it was under Bush. All of which are also lies. https://www.numbersusa.com/content/n...tatistics.html Sorry... but this administration hasn't been honest about anything. I can't give the benefit of the doubt to any administration as deceptive and crooked as this one has been. And before you say it....I don't blindly take any politicians word for anything. Incidently....those lies were uncovered by no less than the Washington comPost, one to the two largest lefty newpapers in the USA. Most of its employees either get wood or leave snail trails at the sound of Obamas voice or picture.
time to buy a fresh box of grapes those ones you have are a little sour
Hardly sour... what the Democrats are doing is trying to force feed Koolaid to the rest of us. Despite their own people discrediting "The Messiahs" outlandish lies.
your press must be a little rabid over there, comes from being too close to the centres of power
Heh, nice false choice to offer. 94 from a small sampling from a local news reporter. But, I guess if you're not for ensuring the integrity of our democratic process, you have to believe that's the only place in the US that's happening... except for the many other examples found in Ohio, NY, Texas, and anywhere one can look.Quote:
Now you find 94(?).
How many will you purge from certain zip codes this time?
So, my question, to those who don't think this is a problem is how many fraudulent votes are acceptable to you? How many times should one be allowed to vote in the same election, like the lady in Ohio? Or, how many people can have their names fraudulently registered and voted for, as they did in NY? And, how many illegals are okay to vote and you believe we still have a proper democratic process?
For those ignorant of what happened in Florida, voter rolls were purged because of the absence of a voter ID law, which would make a purge mostly unnecessary, but wouldn't protect us from people like the lady from Virginia who voted there and then in Florida, as well, in the last presidential election. I'm sure it's a coincidence, but, of the examples I cited, all were Dem voters... the same who bitterly oppose voter ID laws... odd, isn't it?
For those who wish for the people of the US to have faith in our democratic process, the easiest way to get a voter ID law passed is to start emulating Dems. I advocate that Repubs start registering everyone in all graveyards.
As to the original post, yes, I would fully expect more Repub success if dead people, illegals, and multi-voters were prohibited from corrupting our representative democracy, as would any rational person.
so your hypothesis is that only democracts are corrupt and attempt to corrupt the electoral process? is this just rhetoric(B/S) or can you give us some statistics proving that there were no illegal votes lodged for republicans?Quote:
As to the original post, yes, I would fully expect more Repub success if dead people, illegals, and multi-voters were prohibited from corrupting our representative democracy, as would any rational person.
Clete regardless of who corrupts the process ,if there is fraud, the process is corrupted. There is nothing more important that the integrity of the vote. That's what's supposed to separate us from the ballot in Crimea. Voter photo id is a good start until some future date when biometric id replaces it.
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