You know what, I REJOICED when Bellatrix Lestrange and Voldemort were killed in Harry Potter 7.
I guess I am a little immoral.
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You know what, I REJOICED when Bellatrix Lestrange and Voldemort were killed in Harry Potter 7.
I guess I am a little immoral.
That is very true...
Thanks for ruining it for me!Quote:
Originally Posted by southamerica
Oh no!Quote:
Originally Posted by ITstudent2006
I'm so sorry... blonde moment where I forgot some people only watch the movies.
Forget I said it, it doesn't actually happen.
It's Sauron that dies. And Darth Vader.
I was kidding. I don't watch that stuff and I can't read so books are a no-go.
I could have been serious (or acted like it) and made you feel bad...
YOU have no authority to determine he is any of the above! Architect is NOT good enough, you need to establish that he is the architect, or the plumber, or the realtor, or builder before you exact your punishment on him!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Are you really that unfamiliar with how crime organizations (and some 'legitamate' ones) operate? Sheesh, you seem to take everything you hear as fact and then comment on what the appropriate punishment should be. When, in fact, you do not seem to subscibe to the judicial process nor the route in which one should navigate through that process.
I don't even know what your saying anymore? OBL was the head, according to you. You shot him and he is now dead. What, praytell, are the other punishments bestowed on the other participants? The conspirators, the aides, the other top dogs, the backers behind billions in support money, the Pakistani officials? Bullet in the face? Trial?
I ask because one could easily argue the others had the same if not more involvement than OBL in the attacks so, according to the WONDERful judicial process you've now created, how are you to deal with them if you catch them? Question them, determine their role and... oh wait... you don't do that, sorry.
He himself said he was.Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
You could have had a lot of fun with that, too. I'm super gullible and am easily guilted to boot.Quote:
Originally Posted by ITstudent2006
Thanks for being kind :)
BMI- SO what is your stance on this whole OBL situation. Do you agree with the shooting? Celebration? etc...
P.S. Where are you from? (simply curious)
IT - I disagree with the shooting and I am not comfortable with the celebration. If he was captured alive, we'd know the whole story. The fact that they killed him, buried the body and did not provide any evidence of the event, brings the whole operation into disrepute.
I'm from Toronto, Canada.
How do you figure that would work out?Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
Ever hear of the label 'fall guy'. Common tactic gang members and the mafia employ when their top dogs are being tried for certain crimes. The lower level 'employees' admit to the crimes and the bosses walk.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Is OBL the fall guy in all of this? I doubt it, I think he did play a role. However, in order to establish the validity of these claims and given scenarios, you conduct trials. At trial they examine evidence, they piece together the events and corroborate it with evidence and testimony. Only then can you get a clear(er) picture of what actually happened.
In the absence of the above, a man was shot in the face because it was WIDELY believed he killed 3000 people. He did what he did, how he did it because they said that's how it happened:rolleyes:.
I mentioned I'm from Canada. Years back we had a man accused of murdering a child. The country WIDELY believed he was guilty without question. They conducted a trial and the evidence pointed towards him. He was convicted. Many years later, he was released. 100% innocent of the crime due to DNA testing.
Imagine, all that proof and evidence and support for his conviction (not to mention what he was called and considered amongst the population and in prison) and he was innocent all along. Now consider, OBL being 'convicted' and sentenced to a bullet through his head without any of that process. Also take into account other 'strange happenings' in America in the past, WMD's, the magic bullet. Then, finally, mix that with the what, 8 different versions we've already heard of the killing, the peculiarities surrounding the very honest and respectful burial granted and the pictures and video that were taken but never released. I ask, is that just cause for killing him?
Good question, let's ask him... damn!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Yeah, like making him a batch of fudgy brownies (or raspberry baklava) would have encouraged him to tell all.Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
I guess we will never know? I suppose that's why I am such a proponent of NOT killing someone before bringing them to trial.
Good to be a proponent of such.Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
Hello? BMI... you go to far. I never claimed any of the above... you assume and you know what happends when someone assumes.Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
HOWEVER, it IS one of the funniest posts I've read on this site. Interesting that you are MORE than willing to give OBL the benefit of the doubt but you've got ME all figured out and judged according to your small minded assumptions. Here is a wild and crazy thought... Why don't you extend to me the same courtesy you have osama? The hypocrisy of your post would be laughable, if it weren't so UNbelievable.
Slam dunk... Classy take a victory lap... and spike the ball!!
"They" didn't say anything. HE said he did it.Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
He had the opportunity to surrender. He decided not to.
Tom,Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
You think I'm "good enough" to dance during the victory lap. I'm STILL shaking my head. :)
Wait!! I'm being accused of assuming things? Wait! You didn't get the purpose of using your original post to prove my point? Wait! I'm a hypocrite?
Please tell me this is not the same ClassyT that earlier argued the Bible actually reads "Thou shall not murder"!!
Also, please tell me that the poster above me didn't just agree with her drivel? Thus demonstrating his very base volleyball skills.
No, no, it is I who was, and still is, laughing.
Its is mournful anytime a life has to be taken. It is even more painful when innocent life is taken. But when dealing with things in the world there is a system in place to do so. It is born of the same regiment that our soldiers train for. The systems that are in place have thought to have been broken. In this case it is seen as the system actually working. The people entrusted to do the job actually doing it. That is something to celebrate. We are all born of circumstance and its art of our lifes journey. Good bad and the rest of it. The bottom line is we all make decisions. And in turn those lead us down a path in life to whatever outcome it may be. So taking a life is nothing to celebrate but having the system work as it is suppose to is.Quote:
Originally Posted by ITstudent2006
That my friend is a justification that you will be facing when you deploy. The enemy has mnay faces and it will be your job to decide the outcomes. That is what the sysyem is demanding of you and all of us that support you and others like you (seal teams and the reguler boots on the ground). Its because of the commitments of our servicemen that we can all be proud to be Americans and give thanks that we can speak freely.
I always give thanks to those that have and are serving our country. And as General Patton said: Its not up to you to give your life for this country... Its up to you to take thiers for they are the enemy.
The benefit of the doubt? I'm arguing that he should have been brought to trial, not set free. You are of the position he should have been shot without trial. That is the precedent you are supporting and arguing should be the norm, I suppose. Bah, even your own justice system disagrees with you, but you do have Tom so...Quote:
Originally Posted by classyT
Courtesy I have for Osama? Spoken like a true 'patriot' without a clue or understanding of what it is my position is or what this 'argument' is even about, but finds it hysterical.
Maybe there is a Santa Claus :Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
Wikileaks documents show WMDs found in Iraq Hot Air
Report: Hundreds of WMDs Found in Iraq - U.S. Senate - FOXNews.com
American Thinker Blog: Wikileaks proves WMD found in Iraq
Hundreds of WMDs discovered in Iraq
http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/A...wmdsfound.html
LOL! You sourced Fox News! Quick, go up on your roof and look down your chimney.Quote:
Originally Posted by califdadof3
What's super funny about this is that as soon as I saw califdad source fox news, I KNEW that would be your only comment.Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
Predictable, predictable, predictable.
Now that I'm thoroughly nauseated, I hereby unsubscribe.
So many sources to choose from. There are hundreds of links like those and video on YouTube. So deny all you like. Also Sadam did use WMD's against his own people. Or is that yet another fabrication?Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
With your previouse post you sound like a card carrying member of the tin foil hat crowd. So no evidence is good enough for you anyway.
^ Another one.
Maybe because Fox News is known around most parts as being, unreputable. Shocking you'd comment yet not know that?
I hope you feel better.
Where is your source stating that they never report the story correctly and report the facts?Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
At least I showed just a portion of what's out there. So either show some sources where it shows as consistent or lets get back on topic.
The post before was not directed at you, to clarify. This one is:)Quote:
Originally Posted by califdadof3
You're an expert internet researcher correct? So is it necessary to tell you that I can easily find articles which say they didn't exist? You think?
To save me from doing that, are you aware that the majority of American people polled believe no WMD's existed in Iraq and it was just an excuse to invade? Were you aware, if not, maybe check the internet, apparently you know allllll about it functionality.
No evidence is good enough for me? Kind of like the evidence prooving they did kill Osama? Is that the threshold?
I'm out. Can't argue with the 'patriots' and I have this nagging suspicion they get none of my clever jokes. NOTE! Please don't respond with predicatable answers, SouthAmerica is already not feeling too well:(
I have this very strong feeling that you are not really an internet researcher. However, I do, without doubt, believe you are American (amoungst many other things).Quote:
Originally Posted by califdadof3
Your wrong again. Sorry. At a minimum during the time they were still finding the WMD's there was at least 50% that believed they existed. And that's from a poll in 2006. Before the WIKIleaks.Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
And they were still finding them in 2008. And here is your complimentary picture to go with it.
Poll: 50% of Americans believe Iraq had WMDs.
50 percent of U.S. says Iraq had WMDs - Washington Times
WikiLeaks Show WMD Hunt Continued in Iraq – With Surprising Results | Danger Room | Wired.com
Seems that doubt is the only thing you have said that can be qualified. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by BMI
Um... odd that the entire body of congress was briefed on that evidence... the same briefing the leadership got earlier.
It's the same stuff and conclusions our Allies got from their own intelligence agencies.
Canada got 200 tons of yellow-cake uranium from Iraq for processing (just a precursor to the really dangerous stuff), Wiki-leaks showed documents that WMD's were transported to Syria...
And then there is the WMD's (poison gas in this case) that was used on the Kurds.
And just because its posted on the internet doesn't mean its factual. Hardly any internet posts back anything up with real evidence ( and quoting another source that isn't backed up... isn't backing it up.)... and much of the drive by media does little better.
Rathergate as one example of where evidence was fabricated by CBS to support a story they way they wanted to report it since reality didn't back them up..
Nothing wrong with being a healthy skeptic... there is a lot of false information and intentional misdirection on the internet... as well as in the newspapers and on TV.
Everyone wants to tell it the way they wish it was, rather than the way it is.
You convinced me. The Obots have muddled the narrative so badly that nothing they say is believable . I can sign onto that . So here's my best guess.
1. Since AQ has confirmed that
OBL got wacked ;we can believe them if not the Obots... right ?
2. Do I believe he got the ultimate water-boarding?? Nah ! The President's religion is basketball and despite his rhetoric of finding the Muslim call to prayer one of the sweetest sounds he's ever heard ;I think it more likely that it never happened... That's why he won't release photos of OBL dressed in the Shroud of Turin.
More likely these copters originated from an Afghan air base and that's where they landed... not 500 nautical miles away taking the risk of a mid air refueling over Pakistan air space.
I think OBL doesn't have a watery grave at all. I think he was jetisoned like so much balast over the Hindu Kush and will soon have a snowy grave .
Can I take off my tinfoil hat now ?
First, I agree this was not a time for celebration. I don't believe we should celebrate anyone's death. I said this on the other thread.
In fact, I am getting more and more concerned about this operation. The latest admission from the govt indicates that this was a straight out assassination. Michael Moore said that he believes our country "has lost its soul". I tend to agree with this. I had no problem with killing OBL if he was defending himself. But to kill him outright was wrong.
I do have some other things to say.
Specifically to BMI. As I just said I would agree that he should have been brought to trial. But I really don't get where you come upon your disbelief in his guilt. As noted HE ADMITTED HIS INVOLVEMENT. I have never seen any credible reports disputing his own admission of guilt. There is more than sufficient evidence that OBL was the leader of Al Qaeda and had primary responsibility for ordering the 9/11 attacks along with other terrorist attacks.
This also justifies, in my opinion, the invasion of Afghanistan. It is pretty clear that OBL was being protected by them. On the other hand, the invasion of Iraq was more about gaining control of oil and revenge for Hussein's thumbing his nose at the US. Hussein badly underestimated Bush and it caused his downfall. Terrorism was just an excuse. Bush felt the time was right to get public approval of finishing the job his father didn't.
Another point. The comparison between the celebrations of the end of WWII and killing OBL are not really valid. The end of WWI was an end to 5 years of hostilities. Well worth celebrating. The death of one man no matter what he was responsible for has nowhere near the same meaning.
Coming back for a moment to say that my comment about being nauseated was about the route this thread was taking, not just BMI. I apologize for my not-very-well-thought-out delivery of that statement. I should have merely unsubscribed.
I don't like it when political debates turn into rash generalizations, buzz words, and name-calling. They always do, however, and it nauseates me.
I am unsubscribing again :), and will stay away from political threads, as I am clearly not cut out for them. Carry on!
Quote:
Another point. The comparison between the celebrations of the end of WWII and killing OBL are not really valid. The end of WWI was an end to 5 years of hostilities. Well worth celebrating. The death of one man no matter what he was responsible for has nowhere near the same meaning.
__________________
Perhaps not . However for the generation of kids that grew up and has had their youth shaped in large part by images of the towers falling... some seeing their families or friends ,or someone they knew killed on that day... their peers ,if not themselves joining the military to fight the war against jihadist nihilism ;this was the 1st time they had any type of closure moment close to VE VI day,or the fall of the Berlin Wall.
You did notice that it was that generation that erupted in spontaneous celebration . I don't blame them at all. OBL's death doesn't heal that wound... but it moves us closer to that day.
That's the larger majority of the threads on the Current Events forum. Its almost like a blog to air some people's fanatical beliefs.Quote:
Originally Posted by southamerica
I completely agree with this. The war on terror is all I've known from the age of 14 to 23 and on... I vow to do what I could to help so I joined the military. The death of OBL and the happiness that I see from most people reassures me that what I'm doing isn't for not.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Does that mean I threw a party and danced in the street? No, because I realize there is a lot of work to be done and chances are the death of OBL really didn't affect anything.
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