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Originally Posted by tomder55

yes or no ...can it be legally used to go into government computers and download filed that are US property ?

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If the user has installed software on their machine to allow their contents to be shared then that's the user's decision, it's not a legality issue no matter how hard you're trying to make it. If the user is not allowed to install that software then they should face repercussions within their organization for breach of contract.

So if the user, without knowledge or intention, installs programing that allows pirates to enter his hard drive and steal his files ,it is the users fault and not the person who knowingly enters that person's hard drive to steal the files ?

That is a ridiculous assetion .

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Originally Posted by tomder55

so if the user, without knowledge or intention, installs programing that allows pirates to enter his hard drive and steal his files ,it is the users fault and not the person who knowingly enters that person's hard drive to steal the files ?

That is a rediculous assetion .

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The user installs the software with express intent to share and obtain files from others. When doing a search for keywords or file types you do not know what user has those files.

I don't know what a "rediculous assetion" is, it looks like English but...

Bye tom, educate yourself son.

Unsubscribing.

Hasta la vista . Do you have any other examples where the victim of theft is the one at fault ?


Wait... I take it back.. you have one of those rare opportunities where you can contribute something useful to the discussion.
Educate me! Tell me how by installing software onto my computer I am at fault if a predator uses that software to gain access to my files and steal them . Even better... tell me how the government is at fault if their computers are hacked because someone sends a GI in Afghanistan and Iraq some music files for their entertainment . To piggy back onto those files means the hacker must be some low life scum . To compromise that soldier's safety by publishing order of battle plans is worse .

Tom there is a principle here, practised diligently by your government in parts of its endeavours. What you don't protect, you will loose. How come information isn't in the same category. In the real world if you leave something laying around, it inevietably be stolen or just just be assumed abandoned. Why is information different?

You want to forget that this information has been provided by an insider, one of your own and Assange is merely the vehicle by which it was published, as far as we are aware without attempts to gain directly. Whistle blowers are hated by governments throughout the world, but it is by their actions that we find we are deceived and cheated, not by the actions of governments

Clete if you read the converstion prior to this you would see that I linked to instances where Wikileaks piggy backed on peer to peer file sharing by the troops to gain access to the US data base(comment #13) They then trolled and downloaded files... just like any illegal hacker pirate would . Many of these revelations are very sensitive national security information that even you would agree should not be public knowledge.
This is separate from the traitor PFC Manning's shameful and dishonerable actions .

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Originally Posted by tomder55

you would see that I linked to instances where Wikileaks piggy backed on peer to peer file sharing by the troops to gain access to the US data base(comment #13) They then trolled and downloaded files ....just like any illegal hacker pirate would .

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That article says nothing of the sort. What does "piggy backed on peer to peer file sharing" even mean? Can you explain it to us?

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

That article says nothing of the sort. What does "piggy backed on peer to peer file sharing" even mean? Can you explain it to us?

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Means it was a trojan file that came with the legitimate software.


Anyone that installs P2P software is aware they are doing it. But they may not be aware of the consequences of their actions. Its like leaving the door open to your home for anyone to walk in and have a look around.

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Originally Posted by califdadof3

Means it was a trojan file that came with the legitimate software.

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Agreed that that can happen but the article said nothing like that happened. Tom kept writing stuff like "Wiki through pirateware hitches a ride on the transmission and gains access to a hard drive" which makes no sense whatsoever. Especially when related to music files which are the least likely to contain trojans.

So besides your technical nitpicking ;what I was saying was correct. Wiki was using the P2P to infiltrate US computers to steal it's content .

Edit .last night I heard similar arguments that you surrender your rights when you use file sharing programs ;and it's not theft .

I think that justification is bogus nonsense. If the government gave soldiers the authorization to send music files to each other it doesn't mean they also gave Wikileaks the right to access the computer and plunder government files .

This part of the story also has a Chinese connection . Wilkileaks has been aided by Chinese 'hackers' using the TOR network . According to the 'New Yorker ',the Chinese were the ones who stole the many early documents that Assange used to start up Wikileaks .
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...khatchadourian
Pure speculation... there are no independent hackers in China. They are part of the government apparatchik.They are conducting espionage for the government and they found a useful idiot in Assange .

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Originally Posted by tomder55

so besides your technical nitpicking ;what I was saying was correct. Wiki was using the P2P to infiltrate US computers to steal it's content .

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Absolutely not. You can't use p2p to target a single computer.

More nitpicking . I used the plural suggesting it was the government network they were accessing .

Jesus dude, read up on the technology. P2P computers are anonymous on the network. You can't send a file a specific computer, it has to basically come get it from you.

Let me make it easy for you . I am not really interested in the nuts and bolts about how he was able to access the US database . There were 2 points to make .
1. We have been told that he was receiving information from whistleblowers. It turns out it was more than that . Besides the pfc Mannings ,he was also hacking into the government system to illegally obtain the files he released.

2. That the information he has released is not the inconsequential stuff your op suggests . Some of it is . But there is also a lot of stuff released that have real national security implications .

I really am not interested at all about how p2p works except that according to a number of links on the web. that was his means of access.

Here's a Google search: -inurl:htm -inurl:html intitle:"index of" mp3 "pearl jam" - Google Search

Click on it, click on the first result, see that list of music? Feel free to right-click and download any song. Congratulations, you are now an amazing hacker and a criminal. That's pretty much exactly how trolling KaZaa worked. Stupid people leave web directories open (as in this case) or choose to share the contents of their C: for the whole world. No hacking required.

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

You can't send a file a specific computer, it has to basically come get it from you.

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And? In the same way you searched for open files you don't think Assange could do the same? Geez dude, we're not stupid.

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Originally Posted by speechlesstx

And? In the same way you searched for open files you don't think Assange could do the same? Geez dude, we're not stupid.

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So you're saying that Assange found the army guy's computer on an anonymous network and sent him a virus? Yea you are stupid about P2P, you can't find a specific computer in the anonymous P2P cloud. If you can show me the specifics on how that can happen I'd be interested to know. You do realize that when you download a file on a P2P network you're getting it from multiple sources, right?

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

So you're saying that Assange found the army guy's computer on an anonymous network and sent him a virus? Yea you are stupid about P2P, you can't find a specific computer in the anonymous P2P cloud. If you can show me the specifics on how that can happen I'd be interested to know. You do realize that when you download a file on a P2P network you're getting it from multiple sources, right?

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Without going into a long and technical explination. Lets just say it can be done. The proof resides in the lawsuits that have been filed against college students for violation of copyrighted materials. And all the bills that came with it.

Absolute protection is a discipline and most people never reach that far. Look at how many people on a daily basis come here and share way too much information thinking they are imune from harm. As much as a benefit the net is it can also be a nightmare. And yes anyone can be found with the right diligence.

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Originally Posted by califdadof3

Without going into a long and technical explination. Lets just say it can be done. The proof resides in the lawsuits that have been filed against college students for violation of copyrighted materials. And all the bills that came with it.

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That's setting up a honeypot and logging all who connect to it. Even the RIAA don't know who those IPs are, they have to petition the ISPs to get that information. Wow this Assange guy is truly a mastermind and a powerful, powerful man who can get ISPs in many countries to give out personal information. Even the US government can't do that.

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

That's setting up a honeypot and logging all who connect to it. Even the RIAA don't know who those IPs are, they have to petition the ISPs to get that information. Wow this Assange guy is truly a mastermind and a powerful, powerful man who can get ISPs in many countries to give out personal information. Even the US government can't do that.

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Here is where your dropping the ball. All that is needed is an I.P. address and you can do a DNS to see who owns it. If it falls back to the government then from there he did his homework. DNS registration is open to the public and anyone that wants to look.

Also the government is pushing ISP's to allow them to find anyone at anytime they want without warrant. Its been part of the new debates surrounding the internet and its users. They keep asking and pushing for the key to the door.