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Originally Posted by inthebox

Certainly, a sinful humanity, including the church, have committed atrocities, but it is biased to only see one side.

In the name of Christianity:

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Who are you to speak "In the name of Christianity"?

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First and foremost - the way to eternal salvation via Jesus Christ and God's grace, mercy and forgiveness. - salvation army - god's pantry - ymca - mother theresa - countless church missions to countries throughout the world and to provide for the local community, MLK etc...

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Please elaborate and provide links.

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Read the preamble ot the Declaration of Independence and you will see that the founding father's DO acknowledge a creator that gives rights.

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"We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, that among them...." (from memory :D)
I see the words "created" and "their creator" it sounds to me like it is saying "Everyone has a right to believe what they want, because everyone is equal, and you can believe in your creator, no matter what that is.
NOT "Unless you are Christian get out of my country."

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Unlike atheists or those who do not put their trust in God, Christians acknowledge that humanity is imperfect, and that anything based on the humanity is going to have its faults.
I know I am seriously flawed as well as gifted in many ways. That is the way God made me. I dare not think that I nor any other human being can get the it right all the time.

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Where do atheists, or "those who do not put their trust in God" as a whole think humanity is perfect? You talk to any educated person, of any religion(or lack thereof) and you will find that everyone knows that humanity is imperfect.
Just like there were stray "Christians" who did inhumane things, and they don't speak for all of Christianity, there are stray "[insert any religion here]" who did inhumane things, but don't speak for the whole of their religion.

Certainly, a sinful humanity, including those not of the church, have committed atrocities, but it is biased to only see one side.


See what I did there? You need to look at it from another standpoint also. Used your own logic against you, because you are refusing to see anything else.

I don't know any court that any longer swears on the Bible. You simply put your hand up and say you are stating the truth to the best of your knowledge.

The separation of church and state as it is now defined is messed up. They claim to separate yet they have their hand in everything they do not approve of dictating a lot of what is appropriate or not by their standards. Therefore some things slip by while others are made a big deal of.
People think they do not have a right to pray in public and other things but it is what the media has people believing.
I do not believe that separatiion of church and state is what the founding fathers had in mind because otherwise the government buildings would not have many of the Biblical carvings and statues they have.

This is a good site to keep informed

http://www.aclj.org/

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I don't need yours or anyone's permission to express myself as you do not.Nor do I care to have your approval.

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You don't need my permission to express yourself, but be prepared for backlash if you continue to express yourself the way you have so far. I too have a right to express myself.

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As you stated.. I have a right to my beliefs.. which is exactly what I am expressing here. To be clear I am NOT a he.. I am a SHE and because I love my race does not make me racist.. I am talking about love-NOT hate.. that's where you liberals always get it wrong..

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And I was expressing my beliefs. You can dish it but you can't take it. Is that the case? Thanks for clarifying that you're a woman. That doesn't change my opinion on anything, but thanks for the info. I do have to laugh that you called me a liberal. Now you're assuming.

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when you spout about being PC to everyone.. maybe you need to actually include EVERYONE!] Just because I think things were better years ago than they are now and that a Christian based belief system is partially the reason AND because I happen to think ALL people should love their race you assume I am a WHITE CHRISTIAN MALE which of course to your way of thinking means a racist.. well here's a big surprise, I AM NOT!. If for instance I was a black, Muslim female that was waving a banner saying to, "love your race." You'd be all fine and cosy with that wouldn't you? Because THAT would be being PC to everyone. *spit* ridiculous!

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For someone that hates assumptions you sure are assuming a lot. It's hard to know who's behind the computer monitor, especially if their username and avatar don't give a clue. I said male because I didn't want to put "it" or "he/she". I don't care if you're black, white, purple, male, female, transvestite, if you're holding up a sign saying "love your race" I won't be okay with it, because it's a racist comment. So no, I wouldn't be all "fine and cosy" with it.

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Everyone should love themselves, friends, family and race.. Thought I made that clear.. There was no small print that said "if you're white"..

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I do love myself, my friends, my family and every "race". I really hate the word race. We're all part of the same race, it's called human, look it up. I thought you were Christian, aren't you supposed to love everyone?

Virtual grennie for that Alt!

But, come on! She said we are ALL liberals who would be fine and cosy, not just you! :rolleyes:

Looks like a white supremacist has escaped from Stormfront.

It is a lie that has been repeated so often that people accept it as being true.

The Founding Fathers of the USA were mostly Deists, not Christians.

The following is lifted from Wikipedia. See if you can find the Deists.
Religious Affiliation
Of U.S. Founding Fathers # of
Founding
Fathers % of
Founding
Fathers
Episcopalian/Anglican 88 54.7%
Presbyterian 30 18.6%
Congregationalist 27 16.8%
Quaker 7 4.3%
Dutch Reformed/German Reformed 6 3.7%
Lutheran 5 3.1%
Catholic 3 1.9%
Huguenot 3 1.9%
Unitarian 3 1.9%
Methodist 2 1.2%
Calvinist 1 0.6%
TOTAL 204


NOTES: The table above counts people and not "roles," meaning that individuals have not been

Google Religious affiliations of the Founding Fatherss for the complete article.

Pleae stop perpetuating a lie.

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Originally Posted by Catsmine

above all, The Dark Ages.

Really wonderful principles, huh.

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Really?

In the dark ages, the Church was in eclipse, and what was the name of those people running Europe, you know, the ones doing human sacrifice and various tortures at halloween? Druids, weren't they?

Are you a woman?

Women in countries with a strong Christian influence fare far better than anyplace else on Earth.

Christian influence has given us schools, hospitals, great art, music and liberty (in this country) unequalled in history.

The Bible also encourages private ownership of land and the work ethic, two concepts responsible for the creation of the great economic power that the USA has been.

It is departure from these basic concepts that is causing the downfall of our economy at the present time. The rush toward socialism is NOT Bible based, and has been proven to be a failure many times already.

So don't knock the Bible. It is an important part of our national foundation.

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Originally Posted by galveston

The rush toward socialism is NOT Bible based, and has been proven to be a failure many times already.

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Really? What method of political power does the bible advocate?

Also there is no "rush to socialism" and socialism is not a failure. There are more "wealthy" countries with socialized programs than those without.

Lots of art, music, medical developments have been done with complete ignorance of the bible. Private ownership of land is not a concept that began in the bible of course and a good work ethic has absolutely nothing to do with one's religion.

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Originally Posted by galveston

Women in countries with a strong Christian influence fare far better than anyplace else on Earth.

Christian influence has given us schools, hospitals, great art, music and liberty (in this country) unequalled in history.

The Bible also encourages private ownership of land and the work ethic, two concepts responsible for the creation of the great economic power that the USA has been.

It is departure from these basic concepts that is causing the downfall of our economy at the present time. The rush toward socialism is NOT Bible based, and has been proven to be a failure many times already.

So don't knock the Bible. It is an important part of our national foundation.

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Where is your proof that any of this is true?

You claim it was "proven" yet you have no "proof". Sounds to me like you are full of hot air.

The dark ages, approximately 400 -1200 A.D. The Church was the dominant power of Europe. Forted up in their abbeys and monasteries, the people running Europe were the Barons and Kings supported by the Church.

Altenweg.. tisk tisk.. getting your panties a little bunched up, aren't we? You are obviously a racist. Don't you get that by calling me one for me stating that we should all love our race is, in fact, YOU being a racist?

The fact that I say, "love your race" only means that I think we should love and take pride in who we are.. that means EVERYONE.. it is you that is deciding I mean just a group of people.

Get a grip.. go hug a tree or something.

NeedKarma? I don't know where stormfront is, I'll assume from the context that it's a hospital? Anyway, you labeled me a few pages ago and were wrong then as you are now.

I love my race, at least the ones who deserve to be included in it. I am not ashamed of my beliefs and will never apologize for them to anyone.

And I never said I was a Christian, I believe things ran better when decisions were made from a moral stand point to some degree and that was based on Christian beliefs. Labels.. Labels people.

Yes, I called one person here a liberal.. just as you think you know me by something I said, I too made a judgement call as I have seen that closed minded attitude of the liberal far too often. So, I'll take mine and say I am also guilty of the labeling but maybe it is YOU that wants to dish it out and not take it?

I am proud of who I am and nothing you say or do or any of your double speak is going to change it.. so keep flapping your lips, it's only entertainment.

Have a great day!

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Originally Posted by galveston

The rush toward socialism is NOT Bible based, and has been proven to be a failure many times already.

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Originally Posted by NK

Really? What method of political power does the bible advocate?

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Gal, read the OT brook of Amos. Read the NT Sermon on the Mount. Read the teachings of Jesus. Do you know the Golden Rule?

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Originally Posted by Lashercelt

Altenweg.. tisk tisk.. getting your panties a little bunched up, aren't we? You are obviously a racist.

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:eek: Wow, you obviously have no idea what it is you are talking about.

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Don't you get that by calling me one for me stating that we should all love our race is, in fact, YOU being a racist?

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What part of you is a race? I see no racism here, just a judgement call by Alt, and the need of a dictionary for the term "racist" for you.

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The fact that I say, "love your race" only means that I think we should love and take pride in who we are.. that means EVERYONE.. it is you that is deciding I mean just a group of people.

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No, if you meant "take pride in who you are" your signiture would say that. There is a reason you used the word "race" and underlined it.

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I love my race, at least the ones who deserve to be included in it. I am not ashamed of my beliefs and will never apologize for them to anyone.

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The fact that you could even think that some people don't deserve to be a race is racism in itself. You are completely close minded and wrong until you realize and accept that.

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And I never said I was a Christian, I believe things ran better when decisions were made from a moral stand point to some degree and that was based on Christian beliefs. Labels.. Labels people.

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Except, I believe that everyone has proved that the United States wasn't ran by Christians, so you are just talking in circles that have already been shot down.

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Yes, I called one person here a liberal.. just as you think you know me by something I said, I too made a judgement call as I have seen that closed minded attitude of the liberal far too often. So, I'll take mine and say I am also guilty of the labeling but maybe it is YOU that wants to dish it out and not take it?

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Actually, you said "you liberals". Since Altenweg is only one person, that means that you lied. Either now, or when you said it originally.

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I am proud of who I am and nothing you say or do or any of your double speak is going to change it.. so keep flapping your lips, it's only entertainment.

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Double speak... really? You're the one bringing about issues already shot down (such as the country was founded by Christians). You saying something already proven wrong is you double speaking, not anyone else.

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Have a great day!

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I will, thank you! :)

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Altenweg.. tisk tisk.. getting your panties a little bunched up, aren't we? You are obviously a racist. Don't you get that by calling me one for me stating that we should all love our race is, in fact, YOU being a racist?

The fact that I say, "love your race" only means that I think we should love and take pride in who we are.. that means EVERYONE.. it is you that is deciding I mean just a group of people.

Get a grip.. go hug a tree or something.

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Do you honestly think that talking down to people proves your position? You're showing your maturity and intelligence, or lack thereof.

If you want to have a discussion then discuss like a grown up.

Hugging trees can be fun, but I think I'll stick around here for a while.

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I love my race, at least the ones who deserve to be included in it. I am not ashamed of my beliefs and will never apologize for them to anyone.

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Those that deserve to be included? What does one have to do to be worthy of being in your presence?

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I am proud of who I am and nothing you say or do or any of your double speak is going to change it.. so keep flapping your lips, it's only entertainment.

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Ditto, I'm finding this entertaining as well, it's like arguing with my 10 year old.

Bye now. :)

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

Ditto, I'm finding this entertaining as well, it's like arguing with my 10 year old.

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How do you know she isn't a 10 year old? :eek:

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Originally Posted by HelpinHere

How do you know she isn't a 10 year old? :eek:

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Ask Me Help Desk - Search Results

Well, I wasn't being serious, but thanks for the interest NK! :p

I hope her pure aryan genital warts heal.

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

I hope her pure aryan genital warts heal.

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Doubtful. In order to heal those you have to go to a priestess and that's strictly verboten for people of her "race" and culture.

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Originally Posted by Altenweg

Doubtful. In order to heal those you have to go to a priestess and that's strictly verboten for people of her "race" and culture.

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I've heard that pressing a cut, raw potato on them works.