I'd much rather see them reading math and English books than a bible. Let them read their bible at home with you. Same goes for every other religion. Get it out of my face. Im not interested.

EDIT: I'm fine with children having Bible's at school in their bag. No problem at all. Just leave it out of class. There are more pertinent things that require to be learned at school in my opinion.

How much do you protect them from life, entertainment and the media if that is they way you look at it?

Kids can still always have their bible at school, but can not use it during organised class time. *** unless there are comparative religion classes or bible as part of history or culture classes which are allowed.

But during breaks between classes, they are even allowed to have organised after school programs.

So the idea that they are not allowed is completely false.

I can have my bible at work, but can't read it during working hours.
An inmate in prison can have a bible but can't read it during his work, his school or other duty times either

Quote: 1099669, I would like to add my own insight, which I have acquired through 35 years (to date) of unique life experience and serious introspective attention:

ONE'S FIRST GUT INSTINCT IS PURE REASON


My beliefs, inspiration, ideas, thoughts, critiques and opinions are delivered with the chunk removing force of a machete swung by a male who believes that, to chop off the unnecessary and get the job done right, the swing must be swung with a muscular, mighty follow through.
My Creator endowed me with naturally high testosterone levels an a very low tolerance for hypocrites, liars, enablers, piecemeal practice of principle, emasculated males, political correctness, and any other kind of oppressive, fantastical caca that doesn't work in the private backyard of my own individual life.
I am a "being" created with the ability to judge, so I do. I am also a male inspired by men who have held greater ideals and have done much greater things than any of us have who are living today, most notably Classical Heroes and America's Principled and Brilliant Founding Fathers.
I believe in lean, muscular wisdom without fat or wiggle(room) and hold today's intellectuals and their ideas to a times past standard of responsibility, integrity and commonsensem and brave, bold, stout manliness.[/QUOTE]


MY FIRST GUT INSTINCT IS ALWAYS EMOTION. Being female, I demonstrate stout manliness poorly. Being "emasculated" allows me to love you, even when I think that if your penis, testicles and half of your brain were removed you might be qualified to watch my children.

The attitude you present is what I warn my kids against. You're so full of ego you have dissociated yourself from your connection with the world. If you thought fuzzily, against your will, would you kill yourself for being less than an exalted human?

Just asking.

Oh, and everything is a shade of gray. When you can grasp that with your logical black and white mind, I'll be happy for you. Actually, I'm happy for you right now too.

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Originally Posted by N0help4u

How much do you protect them from life, entertainment and the media if that is they way you look at it?

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Is that aimed at me? If so I don't know what your talking about. Nothing to do with protecting them from anything. They can make their own decisions when they are ready.

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Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

Kids can still always have thier bible at school, but can not use it during organised class time. *** unless there are comparitive religion classes or bible as part of history or culture classes which are allowed.

But during breaks between classes, they are even allowed to have organised after school programs.

So the idea that they are not allowed is completely false.

I can have my bible at work, but can't read it during working hours.
An inmate in prison can have a bible but can't read it during his work, his school or other duty times either

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Well said Father.

Piece by piece our liberties have been stripped from us. We had it all. The richest country in the world with our way of life. The envy of nations- and now.. look.. it sickens me. This bible issue is just one more thing. I am not a bible thumper by any means, but having God up front and recognized in schools was a great thing. A moral compass. And now.. don't get caught singing Christmas carols.. I'll stop here because I know this is completely pointless and I'll only get myself angry by continuing. Maybe I should have opened by saying:

Piece by piece we sold off and gave away our liberties. ..The piper is coming to collect boys and girls..

Lashercelt,

Who is the piper, exactly? Do non-Christians have no moral compass? Sure, everyone's God should be up front in their lives. But choosing which God it must be is a large part of what has brought anti-God legislation to schools.

Hi Simone,

I wasn't suggesting that non-Christians have no moral compass. That's obviously not true. My point was that having that in place as a standard to hold one's self up to worked quite well. The choice of which God is not a choice at all as there is only ONE. Only now that we are so run over by clashing cultures/beliefs is it NOT OK for our children to pray after the Pledge in the morning at school as it used to be.

I understand you are saying not everyone believes the same. I respect that. To each his own. But can you imagine trying to force down the throat of any Muslim country the American way of life or Christian beliefs? There is NO way it would be tolerated if I tried to move a Muslim country and implement Christmas as a holiday and did what I could to do away with how many times a day they kneel and pray. Or if I rallied in the streets about the rights of Americans in THEIR country. Actual, being a woman, I would probably be killed or at least deported.

It comes down to this country having been founded by God fearing men and the fact that it worked for a long time. Now with the influx of so many alien beliefs that are catered to- it's all been lost somewhere.

**I used a Muslim country as my example because Islamic symbols was brought up in another post.. I do NOT need endless comments back to me from users disagreeing with my choice of which country to use to make my point**

--ugh! See.. how ridiculous that I even need to say that, but if I don't the PM's will be endless.

That makes sense to me. But when you state that, "the choice of which God is not a choice at all because there is only ONE," the Muslims would disagree with you. Their God is the only one, Allah. Are they right? Are you wrong?

The point you bring up about this country (the USA?) being founded by God fearing men. Were they? Were they Christians? There is some debate about that. It did work for a long time. What worked though, and why?

If I attend public school and they insist, (or treat me like I don't fit in if I refuse) that I pray to the Christian God isn't that a form of control? Having choices is what keeps us sane. Having our choices dictated by someone who we disagree with is something we can vote on, I guess.

http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-christianrepublic.htm

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lashercelt

Only now that we are so run over by clashing cultures/beliefs is it NOT ok for our children to pray after the Pledge in the morning at school as it used to be.

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Hello L:

It used to be that black children couldn't go to school with whites. Do you want to go back?

excon

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ren6

You're twisting my words. I don't think kids should be exposed to violence. The bible is chock full of nastiness- why expose them to it?

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Then I expect that you will keep them away from TV and movies and popular music as well for the same reasons... they are chock-full of nastiness. Why expose them to it?

As to why we should expose them to the bible, the Bible does have lessons about morality, right and wrong, good and evil, personal responsibility, responsibility to society, understanding consequences of our actions, obeying G-d, finding a connection with something spiritual, and other good moral values. Even within the stories of violence and "nastiness", there are important lessons to be learned.

Whereas TV, movies and popular music have... sex, drugs, violence, and bigotry. Not much else.

If I had to choose popular culture or the Bible, I'd choose the bible.

And if I let my kids watch TV, I'd CERTAINLY want to offset some of that damage by teaching them some of the Bible's lessons.

As it is, my kids generally don't watch TV. The videos they watch are screened by me or my wife first, and generally have family themes or religious themes. And they go to private religious schools where they get Bible studies as well as secular studies. And I study Bible and other religious works with them.

If I had to choose between the violence of the Bible or the violence of modern pop-culture, I'd choose the Bible. In essence I HAVE made that choice.

Elliot

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Originally Posted by excon

Hello L:

It used to be that black children couldn't go to school with whites. Do you wanna go back?

excon

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I am not saying there weren't problems, but anyone with eyes & ears and any sense at all can plainly see that we were better off before than we are now. We are in the middle of a mess that is only getting worse by the day.

So, to answer you: Yes, I'll take a seat on that "rewind" train. I would rather work on the problems of that time than the insurmountable issues of late.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by excon

Hello L:

It used to be that black children couldn't go to school with whites. Do you wanna go back?

excon

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Look at his answer above and look at his signature:
*Love yourself, Love your family and friends, Love your race*

That's what you're dealing with.

Hello again, L:

I'm not too much different than you - except the things that I think changed us for the worse are probably not the things you think did it...

I used to think that once we SOLVED a problem, we'd never have to visit it again, and we could move on to OTHER pressing issues. But, that ISN'T what we do... We solve a problem, then throw away the solution and start over...

Take juvenile justice, for example... Somewhere along the line, we figured out that treating kids like adults didn't work, so we set up an entire justice system just for them... PROBLEM SOLVED!

But, wait... Along comes people who apparently didn't remember the past. They said kids should be punished like adults... And, that's what happened...

So, if you ask ME what's wrong, I'd say it's too many people in jail. I'll bet you'd say there are not enough.

excon

Wow.. way to judge me.. humorous, simple minded NeedKarma.

First NeedKarma.. I am a woman.. NOT a man.. was it not obvious by the hot pink my puppy is wearing or the hot pink writing in which my tag line is written?. and what does my tag line say that makes you feel the need to say, "That's what you're dealing with?" And what exactly is it that you find wrong with my answer?

Excon: You also assumed you knew my way of thinking, but you are WRONG. There are far too many people in jail/prison. Prison is a revolving door of big business. I feel that the system is set up so that when someone is released they are at a high risk to reoffend. People go to jail/prison for ridiculous charges such as drug use. If you rob a store and are high on crack you should go to jail for the robbery but why are there other charges because you were on crack? It's absurd and it's all about money.

And to be clear~ I don't believe a child should ever be charged as an adult.. isn't the point that they ARE children? Ludicrous!

So then, boys.. maybe next time you can reserve your judgement until you have all the facts?

Hello again, L:

I DID assume that someone who thought god should be in the classroom would be consistent with others who shared that same belief.

My bad.

excon

excon: Thanks for the, "My Bad" :)

And to be clear: I'd never side with or go along just because someone might have the same belief system I do. I've never been accused of being one of the SHEEPLE or been afraid to stand alone on a soapbox. I speak my own thoughts and will listen to and agree with anyone like minded, not go along blindly because someone looks like me or prays to the same God.

Thanks for answering back. I've read some of your other posts and you come off as intelligent and truly aware of what's going on. You're a good read.:D

Have a great day!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ETWolverine

Then I expect that you will keep them away from TV and movies and popular music as well for the same reasons... they are chock-full of nastiness. Why expose them to it?

As to why we should expose them to the bible, the Bible does have lessons about morality, right and wrong, good and evil, personal responsibility, responsibility to society, understanding consequences of our actions, obeying G-d, finding a connection with something spiritual, and other good moral values. Even within the stories of violence and "nastiness", there are important lessons to be learned.

Whereas TV, movies and popular music have... sex, drugs, violence, and bigotry. Not much else.

If I had to choose popular culture or the Bible, I'd choose the bible.

And if I let my kids watch TV, I'd CERTAINLY want to offset some of that damage by teaching them some of the Bible's lessons.

As it is, my kids generally don't watch TV. The videos they watch are screened by me or my wife first, and generally have family themes or religious themes. And they go to private religious schools where they get Bible studies as well as secular studies. And I study Bible and other religious works with them.

If I had to choose between the violence of the Bible or the violence of modern pop-culture, I'd choose the Bible. In essence I HAVE made that choice.

Elliot

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You seem really stuck on violence in the media, and seem to believe that I condone that. I don't watch t.v. I only listen to "talk" radio. Capiche? I don't approve of violence, anywhere. Nada.

It only makes sense that parents and guardians would want to shield their children from the attempted child sacrifice, rape, gathering of enemies fore-skins, throwing one's virgin daughter to be raped by hordes of evil men, mass murder, punishment of rape victims and general blood-letting and mayhem that is so often featured in the bible.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ren6

You seem really stuck on violence in the media, and seem to believe that I condone that. I don't watch t.v. I only listen to "talk" radio. Capiche? I don't approve of violence, anywhere. Nada.

It only makes sense that parents and guardians would want to shield their children from the attempted child sacrifice, rape, gathering of enemies fore-skins, throwing one's virgin daughter to be raped by hordes of evil men, mass murder, punishment of rape victims and general blood-letting and mayhem that is so often featured in the bible.

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The Bible is a record of men and events, whether good or bad.

So you obviously don't want your children to study secular history either.

You know, things like the holocaust, our Revolutionary War, our Civil War, WWI, WWII, Korea, Viet Nam, the rigimes of Joe Stalin, A. Hitler, Pol Pot, the slaughter of innocent civilians in the Twin Towers, and on and on.

We learn from the history of the Bible, just as we do from other histories. At least, we had BETTER learn.