No way can one logically come to that conclusion.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
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No way can one logically come to that conclusion.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Now the most transparent President ever is flat out lying about his lie.
https://mobile.twitter.com/reidepste...01587368595456
Hello again,
Yes, the rollout has been flawed, and Obama is the guy in charge. But, that's the rollout, and the president.. It's NOT the law. The LAW is gonna work just fine. Yes, there's gonna be some bumps and bruises along the way. But, not every bump is a TRAINWRECK.
Obamacare REQUIRES that insurance companies, for example, spend 80% of its income on claims... Let's say that you own a policy with a company that spends, say 50% of its income on claims.
(1) Why would you WANT to keep it, and (2) why would you THINK the law would let you??
If I were talking to people who WANTED to fix it, I'd expect a rational response.. But, since I'm talking to people who want to KILL it, (3) I'm sure you're gonna run around with your hair on fire..
excon
Flawed is the understatement of the century.
Hopelessly broken is a better definition.
Just going by what Tom said. Bush lied, even though the previous supply side president was flexible enough to raise taxes when needed to cover his spending. That flexibility was not afforded to Bush one, and got you guys out of the WH.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Now you guys are hollering liar to a promise by Obama that's 97% accurate, and trotting out horror stories of the 3% who have sticker shock and can't keep their plans because of insurance company policy, and state legislatures, even though it's well documented that those that cannot keep those plans have better options than they had before.
But you guys have never been known to look deeper into things BEFORE you holler foul. If you did you would find that the lady in California will be getting into a bigger and better network of doctors going on the exchange than she had with her small carrier that withdrew from the private insurance market in California.
I hope they report her solution as fast as they hollered about her distress.
Obamas clain is 0% accurate... just like everything else the brown messiah spews out of his facial sphincter.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Quit trying to spin tom's post. The point was Bush faced consequences for breaking his promise. You guys support this man's habitual lies and broken promises.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
You are just mad because we don't support what you are hollering about. Everybody is running from you. Your lie we run from is when you say most Americans agree with you. That's a whopper.
You guys may think you are a good option, or alternative, but truth is you are not.
Polls prove otherwise. And Obama anObamacare approval ratings keep sinking by the day.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Hello again,
I just heard Rubio saying that the Va. Governors race is a CLEAR choice between Obamacare, and the FIRST Attorney General in the nation to OPPOSE it.
Wow. Do you guy wanna go down this road again? I dunno WHY you'd wanna put Obamacare up for a vote. You KNOW that Cuccineli is gonna lose, and you KNOW that you'll disavow what Rubio said about it.
I KNOW it, if you don't.
excon
Give it a rest, you're panicking at the reality unfolding and desperately looking for more bullsh*t spin to cover for what Americans now see. You also ignore the fact that regulation was one of the prime factors in denying Americans insurance in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
The government, both federal and state has had its hands all over our health care and health insurance for ages, and yet you pretend it's all these crappy insurance providers to blame for the mess. Now the government footprint is even larger and so far, it isn't panning out too well. Americans are not stupid, Tal, they aren't buying the propaganda and they don't want to buy your high priced, half-a$$ed policies either.
Definition of Obamacare
Remember when Nancy Pelosi said about Obamacare:
“We have to pass it, to find out what's in it”
A physician called into a radio show and said:
"That's the definition of a stool sample".
That pretty well sums it up.
You love regulations on females health care in Texas. You love regulations on poor people and you hate regulations on rich people forgetting that one in four people in our own state have NO insurance, and you guys are still against really poor people ever getting it.
Maybe its time for cutting out the middle man and making everyone have the same insurance and the same premiums and benefits. All of our institutions need a major overhaul is my position. Insurance companies are NOT gods, so why do you worship them over the people who have suffered for decades with their BAD business practices.
Your arguing for a policy that is not being seriously advanced anywhere .Even in Europe they realize that it aint sustainable . That's why your emperor tried incremental approach . With the disaster that is the law they passed however ,you will never see your utopian fanasy realized .
Who in God's name is worshiping insurance companies? I hate insurance companies, what I hate more is government screwing it up further, the president lying to me and treating us like we're idiots and the endless bullsh* from his defenders.
Again, you're going in panic mode just like the White House, hence the latest lie about his first lie. And you haven't even begun to see fallout yet, buddy. Just wait until more people buy their new super duper plan and realize they can't keep their doctor.
From CNN:
I guess you really, really smart people should have considered this before ramming it down our throats.Quote:
Obamacare 'War Room' docs: We're concerned next media story is some consumers getting on website and finding fewer options, higher prices
By CNN Chief Washington Correspondent Jake Tapper
Washington (CNN) - Officials expressed concern that the next shoe to drop in the evolving story about the Affordable Care Act would be disappointment from consumers once they are able to get on the troubled HealthCare.gov website – disappointment because of sticker shock and limited choice, according to a new document obtained by CNN.
“Mike described a general concern of PM (plan management team): getting to the point where the website is functioning properly and individuals begin to select plans; the media attention will follow individuals to plan selection and their ultimate choices; and, in some cases, there will be fewer options than would be desired to promote consumer choice and an ideal shopping experience. Additionally, in some cases there will be relatively high cost plans,” say the notes from the Obama administration’s Obamacare 'War Room' from one week ago.
Probably not Tom, but I blame the broken economic model more than band aid policies that react to those flaws. Poor circulation is the prognosis for whatever the underlying cause. There are no quick fixes to a systemic global problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Hello again, Steve:
Ramming? Nahhh. It's not ramming if we LIKE it.Quote:
ramming it down our throats.
excon
You hate everything so what's new? Your solution to destroy and not replace, but keep what didn't work, ain't a solution. Bet you would have hollered as vigorously against SS, and Medicare too if you were old enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Still waiting for the day you actually argue the points instead of spewing spewing the same rehearsed (and untrue) bullsh*t.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Thank you Mr. Orwell.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
I guess the big difference was that GHW Bush had every intention of keeping his pledge to not raise taxes . Contrast that with the emperor ,who knew he was giving the American public a bald-faced lie .Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Hello again, tom:
That you believe you know the mind of either of these men is arrogant, to say the least.Quote:
the big difference was that GHW Bush had every intention of keeping his pledge to not raise taxes . Contrast that with the emperor ,who knew he was giving the American public a bald-faced lie .
excon
Oh no, it's quite clear that Obama was always full of sh*t. The evidence is beyond overwhelming, you of all people I wold have thought would acknowledge the lies by now.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
It is a fact that the emperor knew that what he was telling us was a lie . Even NBC News has figured that out .
Obama administration knew millions could not keep their health insurance - Investigations
Yep, and yet another example of someone getting forced out of the crappy plan they liked and could afford into a much better, more affordable plan...
It's enough to turn a lifelong Democrat into a Republican foot soldier.Quote:
Expecting parents being forced into new health plan now have a deductible 3Xs the amt of old, $10,000 #mycancellation pic.twitter.com/rlzoIptz1H
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BYQ3zabCMAAsb6y.jpg:large
Canceled health insurance plans add to angst of change | Local News | The Seattle Times
Everybody knew about the junk insurance market place and have for years. What do you think pre existing conditions, and the grandfather clause was all about?
Please try and keep up and stop acting all indignant like it was a complete surprise.
http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/resources/nhwaiver.pdf
What you think NH was the only one complaining about junk insurance and it just started? Why are you guys the last to know, and the least to understand. Why follow the Hannity/Fox example?Quote:
New Hampshire's waiver application notes that four companies offer individual insurance
policies in the state. One of these, Anthem, dominates the market with 72% of enrollees. Of the
three smaller insurers, two met the medical spending requirements in 2009 and would not need to
make changes under the new rule. The third company, junk insurer Chesapeake Life, reports a
shockingly low medical loss ratio of just 43.6%, as adjusted under the federal formula.
Although the application provides no details of the insurance policies sold by Chesapeake in
New Hampshire, we can gain insight into its policies from its sister company, Mega Life and
Health. Both are subsidiaries of HealthMarkets, Inc, which sells through different insurers state
by state, but offers similar products across these companies.
Mega Life and Health sells low-benefit plans with no coverage for many benefits that are
standard on comprehensive policies – including prescription drugs, maternity care, and even
doctor visits unless the customer purchases a rider. The company's deductibles and out of pocket
maximums, which on the surface seem similar to those in other policies, are also misleading
because consumers are required to pay all costs that exceed daily or yearly caps on specific
benefits. The story of Dana Christensen illustrates how such policies fail to protect their
policyholders. Dana was left with $450,000 in medical bills when her husband Doug died of
bone cancer. The couple had purchased a special chemotherapy rider with their Mega insurance
policy, but the rider capped payments at $1,000 a day, while Doug's treatments were as much as
$18,000 a day. (More on Dana Christensen and HealthMarkets' history of deception here:
Dana Christensen's battle with junk health insurance | Consumer Watchdog)
Consumers would probably be better off purchasing coverage from another company in the
market if Chesapeake were to leave New Hampshire. (The company's extremely low medical
loss ratio suggests it might, although the state's application doesn't provide any data to make the
case.)
That story appears no where else but on Twitter. Any other sources?
Also:
Inside the Fox News lie machine: I fact-checked Sean Hannity on Obamacare - Salon.com
You'll notice some material that has been used here.
Canceled health insurance plans add to angst of change | Local News | The Seattle Times
Great link.
Quote:
“It turned out not to be the case for most people with individual plans, because the plans were so much worse,” she said. “In all honestly, they didn't provide meaningful coverage.”
The bare-bones plans left people vulnerable to costly medical bills and even bankruptcy. So insurance companies drafted new, more comprehensive plans to meet the law. Then they looked at a subscriber's current plan and tried to match it to one that most closely resembled one of the new plans.
Here's an idea and we can all be happy. You let us keep our old plans with a third lower premiums, copays, out of pockets, caps and deductibles, the doctors and hospitals we liked and you guys have the new super duper insurance.
What happens when you have to go to the hospital and have to have surgery and your inexpensive plan doesn't cover much of the expense? Or if Aunt Maude is in the same boat and has no savings but has to cough up $2500 as her deductible?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
She's lucky if her deductible is ONLY $2,500, thats pretty reasonible for a surgery even with a DAMN GOOD insurance.policy. I think I paid $1,600 out of pocket on my last one that was outpatient, (orthroscopic repair of rotator cuff) I went in and was heading home inside of 4 hours... I've been seeing cases of $10,000 deductible per year or higher with the new Obamacare quotes....Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
No offense but what's it to you? It's my life and if the new crap sandwich is so good it should be an offer they can't refuse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Quote:
Here's an idea and we can all be happy. You let us keep our old plans with a third lower premiums, copays, out of pockets, caps and deductibles, the doctors and hospitals we liked and you guys have the new super duper insurance.
Remember, "but" means disregard anything I've said before the "but."Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Are my tax dollars going to pick up any expense that you can't pay?
Not true at all Carol.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
I pay my bills and my risk to you is less if I don't have to pay a premium that costs 2-3 times more with the higher deductibles. There is no incentive to buy insurance if your risk of going broke is higher for buying it.Quote:
Are my tax dollars going to pick up any expense that you can't pay?
Yes, it is true. "I love you but...."Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Oh good grief, it doesn't negate the sentiment. Only a woman...Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Wow, the putdowns come fast and furious.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Dr. Phil said it first.
Everything before the but is a lie - Lawrence Fine
It's simple, I'm the one who said it and it was sincere, I did not want you take offense. So take it from me, not Dr. Phil, and maybe you can avoid goading people into unleashing snarky remarks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
I goaded you? You just couldn't help yourself?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
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