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Why should high school dropouts that count to 11 without unzipping their pants get the wages recent college crads or high school grads start with?Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
Most of them are lucky the get out of bed before lunchtime. Mostly because they hang out until 3 or 4 am robbing people.
Point well made Clete, and to just add Smoothy's attitude against those not as smart as he is makes my case for why there is poverty in the first place. That's what happens when a sourpuss get an extra buck, he pats himself on the back, and slaps the next fellow. Heavan forbid he get competition from those he derides. That would throw his world order into chaos.Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
Now there is a real indication of what is wrong with the system, the minimum wage should be way more than welfare as an incentive for people to work, where I come from welfare is about half the minimum wage and unemployment about a third
He can no longer measure himself by how many are beneath him. That's why the solution to him is to work harder and pursue that imaginary job, instead of shutting up and getting out of the way.
OK keep denying new workers the chance to learn a trade or profession outside of college and you consign them to poverty and dependency for the rest of their lives... the liberal solution!!
Everybody should have a chance to learn, that's the liberal approach, but you have to eat too!
Never once have you heard me say an education or training is unnecessary. Obama has said it's a priority investment, for which you blast him for.
Dude, there are only so many places for philosophy and dance majors.
President Obama has said high schools and community colleges are great places to offer vocational training and certificates for daycare, line cook, auto mechanic, hospital tech/lab worker, vet tech, etc. At my h.s. back in the day, we had two tracks (college/professional and vocational training), and students were moved onto one of those tracks after intensive testing and counseling. So let's go back to that model. That way, colleges would get students who could handle the demands, and the workforce would get trained workers (who would have been coached in job hunting).Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
If that were the case in this country then the minimum wage would be around $25 per hour worked. Welfare is very generous here in the states.Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
The Work Versus Welfare Trade-Off: An Analysis of the Total Level of Welfare Benefits by State
This last line bothers me. It is because I believe you can make it a condition. If a erson is of low education then their job is to get educated. If they keep popping out babies then they can join a CoOp and babysit for those getting an education etc. Yes those that can work should one way or another. As far as alchoholics goes they shouldn't be supported by the system without conditions. One of them being to get straightened out. We need to put time limits on programs. We need to convert many off the public dole and onto being productive tax payers. That way there will always be a safety net.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
And if they don't meet the time limit, then what?Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
Then that is their choice. Start a reduction down to very basic levels.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Yes, but what happens to them? They are refused public aid and any associated benefits? They are sent to Nevada to die in the desert?Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
Goes along way to eliminate poverty, wipe out the deficit, and stimulate the economy as Wall Street sets a record, and businesses have never done better.Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
Rather than raise the minimum wage? Come on!!Quote:
Any welfare reform proposal must recognize that individuals are unlikely to move from welfare to work as long as welfare pays as well as or better than working. That suggests that the most promising welfare reforms are those that substantially cut back on the level of benefits.
They go on to live at minimum levels. Food and shelter and a small amount for clothing. No cellphone. No new cars no extras that life can afford you at higher income levels.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
What your talking about would cause hyper inflation. Im sure you have your wheelbarrow handy for buying that loaf of bread. Do you think you could still buy a hamburger for a dollar if the minimum wage were $25 ? What it shows is how over the top generous this country has been with welfare. It should be more about giving a hand up then giving a hand out.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
So why do we give oil companies and corporations welfare, through deductions and loop holes since a hand up for them isn't needed. That's what destroys the argument for me is that welfare for the ordinary is bad, but for big business its good.Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
So you think we should be competing with 3rd world wages?
I agree, but how would that work? Job coaching? A social worker/counselor assigned to each person to monitor their progress?Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
Why are we giving Hollywood massive subsidies and tax credits with the money they make... why do we give Obama free vacations at the expense of the poor with the Millions he has...Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Works like this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
CalWORKs Welfare-to-Work
Is that successful? There has been a gradually lessening of people on welfare?Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
Which loopholes are we talking about here? Can you be a little more specific then just the broad brush your painting with ?Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Legitimate business expenses are going to occur. Now if you would like to eliminate all expenses and move to a "fair tax" Im for it. But it seems you and this president want to subsidize a select industry even if it's a failure and take away from those that are a succeeding. What is your definition of coporate welfare?
Yes to an extent it has been working and getting people to get into the work force and off welfare rolls. Like with any system it has its problems but it has been chugging along and does have a mainly positive outcome.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
The idea is theory is to raise a persons self worth so they can be proud again and want to succeed verses just hanging in there for the long haul.
Seems to work around here, every fortnight they face an interview about what they have done to get a job and there are reskilling programs as well as specific counselor help if they have disabilities like anxiety, depression, etcQuote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Who pays for that? The government?Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
Yes all part of the service, our government is serious about getting people off the welfare and unemployment queues, they just cut the benefits to single parents with children over 8 and they refuse to lift the unemployment payment, a little while back they changed the rules on disability benefits, and get this, these guys are what you call liberal, we, of course, call them something else
From the same state that suggests, whistles, ball point pens and peeing or puking on cue as a defense against rape, a Colorado Democrat lectured a rape victim on rape statistics, telling her the odds are a gun wouldn't have helped:
I'm sorry you moron, I think she deserves the chance to defend herself so as not to become a rape victim. Another Dem, Democratic Strategist Zerlina Maxwell thinks the solution is to teach men not to rape. Perhaps she can start with the UN.Quote:
"I just want to say statistics are not on your side, even if you had had a gun. You said that you were a martial arts student, I mean person, experience in taekwondo, and yet because this individual was so large and was able to overcome you even with your skills, and chances are that if you had had a gun, then he would have been able to get than from you and possibly use it against you," Hudak said.
The money quote from Dana Loesch, "There is a war on women, and it’s coming from the left to turn women into victims."
Seriously, what does the left have against women?
THey just hate that a woman can fight back... just think if every woman had a gun.. Bill Clinton would not have lived long enough to become president.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Lol ;did you see the pop tart ?
Pop-Tart 'gun' suspension: Seriously, folks?
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...14492772_n.jpg
It's a no-brainer, the kid shouldn't have pointed the pastry.
Geez...
School seizes cupcakes decorated with toy soldiers
The silliness continues.
My preschool co-teacher took away a toy gun from a student, so the little boy lifted his hand and made the shape of a gun and shot her.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Was he suspended for pointing his finger?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Nope, and it was a Christian school too. He is now a Christian teacher.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
In other words he didn't become a mass murderer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Not yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
And what's he doing now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Right this minute? I have no idea. I said he's a Christian (parochial) school teacher.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Yes you did, sorry. So has he created any mass murderers?
The city that Our president hails from, Chicago, has the highest gun/murder rate in the entire Nation. Washington DC is next with the highest gun crime in the nation. This subject is NOT ABOUT GUNS. This debate should be about PEOPLE. Tell me one deterrent in our justice system that would make a career criminal NOT use a gun? NOT ONE. The Death Penalty is all but gone and where it is still on the books, it take years and years and a lot of taxpayer money to get it done, it it actually is done. A decision by the Supreme Court in 2005 states that the police "are not bound by law to PROTECT anyone. Their sole job is to enforce the law."
So who is to protect the people who live in these crime ridden cities... no one. Is it reasonable to think that one should do everything possible, within the law , to protect themselves, their property, and their families? Absolutely. I have no problem with background checks(I went through them when I obtained a carry permit in NY 40 years ago), registering guns and keeping them locked in a safe place in my home or place of business. I have no problem with law abiding citizens carrying a concealed handgun for their own personal protection. There is NO PLACE anywhere in this country, in this day and age, that one can be certain that they are completely safe from crime or criminals. The shootings that spur these "gun control" people, are no perpetrated by law abiding citizens. They are perpetrated by someone who has had a history of crime, a history of mental illness and uses ILLEGALLY obtained guns. The needs to be a national data base of persons with mental disorders that prove to be socially dangerous. Then when background checks are done, that information turns up also. This is an issue of human behavior. Let's face one thing. People in today's world are bombarded every minute of everyday with the sensationalism of crime and it's perpetrators and victims. We know of a murder anywhere in the world within minutes of it happening. We do not need to know that. When "news" was not instantaneous, most things in other countries were not known for months if ever.
I do not care what happens in Timbuktoo. It has nothing to do with the way I live my life here. I am concerned about what happens in my home town and my home State and what our "Representative" are doing in Washington. WE need to stop paying attention and supporting other countries troubles and take care and worry about the citizens of THIS country. A sequester of $85 billion in cuts but the government can authorize $260 Million in aid to a country that would rather see us destroy ourselves than help them.We can be the police of the world but we do not need to be it's wet nurse. Guns are only a crutch for the powers that be to distract us from the real issues.
Latest news suggests only 35% of US homes possess guns so it seems gun possession is a minority issue, a very vocal minority but a minority issue nonetheless. If only 35% will be alienated by improved gun control what is stopping government from getting the job done?
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