It has everything to do with elections as you had a chance to repeal the ACA just by electing Romney. You failed. Elections are they way it works around here so win a few. Don't act like it ain't so.
2014 is your next shot. Good Luck.
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It has everything to do with elections as you had a chance to repeal the ACA just by electing Romney. You failed. Elections are they way it works around here so win a few. Don't act like it ain't so.
2014 is your next shot. Good Luck.
Nahh Dems don't believe that ,if they can't get what they want in elections ,they use obscure parliamentary procedures ,then they try the courts .When that don't work ,they use the bureaucracy . They have an emperor who changes laws outside of the constitutional way of laws being created and changed in Congress. THEY NEVER GIVE UP AND ACCEPT THAT ELECTIONS HAVE DECIDED ANYTHING .
I've been listening to hearings for 2 days now . Haven't yet heard an honest answer from anyone testifying as to how many people have actually successfully enrolled ,or even tried to enroll. The contractors claimed they were under contractual restrictions from disclosing that info to Congress... and Sebelius is stonewalling as I type .
Hello again, Steve:
Let's review, shall we???Quote:
This has nothing to do with any election, it's the fact that the majority of the country said NO to Obamacare and Dems passed it anyway
Not long ago we had a national election.. It was an ACCURATE bellwether of what the people want, because EVERYBODY was involved. If you recall, Obamacare WAS an issue in that race. One of the candidates said he'd REPEAL Obamacare on his first day in office.
He lost, and, he lost BIG!
excon
Let's review, what put Obama over the top was not Obamacare. I think much of it had to with your manufactured war on women, not to mention the media cheerleaders and all those precious, but clueless young people who are getting a reality check about now.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
You can dispense with the spin, we're not stupid.Quote:
President Obama's tactical victory is clear when you look at the election returns. He has no grand mandate that comes out of Tuesday's numbers. He has been re-elected, but his policies did not win the day. Voters didn't turn their faces up to the vision he painted they way they did in 2008. When voters were asked which candidate had a vision for the future, Romney won that question in exit polls, 55 percent to 43 percent. Asked about Obama's signature achievement, health care, voters did not approve. Forty-nine percent said they wanted it repealed in part or whole. Voters also said the federal government was too large.
Voters are deeply divided by race and age. The president can credit strong support from women. He led by 11 percentage points among women, while Romney led by 7 points among men. There was also an Obama advantage among younger voters. He grabbed a majority of those under 45. Older voters broke for Romney. Obama lost the white vote by a larger margin than in 2008 when he got 43 percent of the vote. On Tuesday, he got just 40 percent of the white vote. They represented virtually the same share of the electorate as before. But Obama made up for that deficit by winning handily with minorities which represented an ever so slightly larger share of the vote.
Bush got his tax cuts through parliamentary tricks.
The Fiscal Cliff We All Saw Coming - Businessweek
Quote:
Those other priorities were more important to voters than lower taxes. In 2001, the Pew Research Center found that 37 percent of Americans preferred to use the surplus to fund Social Security and Medicare, 23 percent for domestic spending, and only 19 percent for a tax cut. Even after selling the idea as a way to give back part of the surplus, Republicans couldn't bring on enough Democrats to pass it. To do so they resorted to reconciliation, the same parliamentary trick Democrats would use in 2010 to pass health-care reform. That allowed Republicans to get around a threatened filibuster, but Senate rules don't allow bills passed by reconciliation to create deficits more than 10 years in the future. Thus, the 10-year expiration date.
Just to give accuracy of how the government works by YOUR side, and mine. Because YOU guys FAILED doesn't mean we will. I mean you cost us 24 billion with a shutdown after bringing about a credit down grade, that raised interest rates on the debt. Both have negative global implications.Quote:
By the next year, things had gotten very serious. The economy had slowed, and a war was on the way. There were no more surpluses to play with. In 2002 the federal government ran a deficit of $158 billion. The White House began a push for more tax cuts, this time justifying them as a stimulus
My conclusion is you guys can't count.
So everybody is stupid but YOU guys?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Nope, we aren't the ones treating Americans like they're stupid and helpless.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
They all said you get the numbers in November. But they keep asking for the numbers over and over and getting the same answer.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Why should a member of Congress wait ? The numbers are available except for the stonewalling .
You mean why should republicans wait? Because we all know they just want something to pounce on. So wait for it. You been pouncing on stuff for three solid weeks already.
Curb your enthusiasm. Your seek and destroy mentality is disgusting. Past FAILURE is frustrating I know.
And your aversion to transparency is even more disturbing. I'm tired of being lied to.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
https://www.healthcare.gov/what-if-i...d-health-plan/
Its up to insurance companies to administer grand fathered plans, so go talk to them about why they lied about not letting you keep what you like.Quote:
If you are covered by a plan that existed March 23, 2010, your plan may be "grandfathered." You may not get some rights and protections that other plans offer.
Grandfathered plans
Grandfathered plans are those that were in existence on March 23, 2010 and have stayed basically the same. But they can enroll people after that date and still maintain their grandfathered status. In other words, even if you joined a grandfathered plan after March 23, 2010, the plan may still be grandfathered. The status depends on when the plan was created, not when you joined it.
How to find out if your plan is grandfathered
•
Check your plan's materials: Health plans must disclose if they are grandfathered in all materials describing plan benefits. They must offer contact information.
•
Check with your employer or your health plan's benefits administrator.
What grandfathered plans do and don't have to cover
Here's a quick look at the consumer protections that do and don't apply to grandfathered plans:
All health plans must:
•End lifetime limits on coverage
•End arbitrary cancellations of health coverage
•Cover adult children up to age 26
•Provide a Summary of Benefits and Coverage (SBC), a short, easy-to-understand summary of what a plan covers and costs
•Hold insurance companies accountable to spend your premiums on health care, not administrative costs and bonuses
Grandfathered plans DON'T have to:
•Cover preventive care for free
•Guarantee your right to appeal
•Protect your choice of doctors and access to emergency care
•Be held accountable through Rate Review for excessive premium increases
In addition to the above, grandfathered individual health insurance plans (the kind you buy yourself, not the kind you get from an employer) don't have to:
•End yearly limits on coverage
•Cover you if you have a pre-existing health condition
Note: Some grandfathered plans offer protections they're not required to. Check with your insurance company or benefits administrator to learn if your grandfathered plan offers the rights and protections listed above.
And this bears repeating, stop shifting the blame and treating us like fools. They knew most plans would not be grandfathered.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
And I might add, the regime's old tactic of intimidation is apparently back.
WH Intimidates Insurance Companies Not to Publicly Criticize Obamacare | The Weekly Standard
I might point out you are acting loony going back and forth on two threads. Take a break... BREATH!
It's you repeating the same lies about "grandfathered" plans on two threads, you give it a break.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
The emperor KNEW that ObamaCare would force the withdrawal of millions of insurance plans 3 years ago and still he repeatedly spewed his big lie.
Yes, and we were called loons for saying this since the beginning... despite the fact its written into the act that almost all older plans can not be grandfathered...Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Just this week have the Drive by media started saying anything about it... its obvious they are as dense as granite because they have been calling everyone liars until now and act like it's a new revelation.
Since the beginning they have been claiming everyone could keep their doctors and insurance just like their handlers told them to.
I've still got my insurance and doctor. My son, a private payer, does too. No changes at my house.Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
You are aware none of this actually takes effect until Jan 1... right?And Everyone that got cancellation notices had policies that expire in January 2014....there is still everyone who's policies that expire Feb thru Dec 2014 that will be getting cancellation notices over the next 12 months. When does yours expire?. Almost NO policies in effect right now qualify...and if there are ANY changes to anything then under the law they HAVE to be canceled, changes in coverage, changes in deductibles, rates, copys ANY change and it can't legally be continued.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Its written into Obamacare very explicitly to force everyone OFF their existing policies. Nancy Pelosi and Obama should have told you if they weren't trying to hide it.
Tal... You said you was able to register and everything... have you heard all your personal information is up there on a site that has absolutely ZERO encryption or ANY security what-so-ever?
Yes thats right....that government website is completely and utterly devoid of ANY security what-so-ever.....and its your people that admitted to that.
You better hope the Hackers of the world don't get that information and commit identity theft with it....if that happens (heaven forbid) you have Obama and your own party to thank for it.
And the coup de gras will begin when the employer mandate begins to go into effect . The “Cadillac Tax”, which will hammer companies with a 40 % excise tax beginning in 2018.Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
It's actually "coup de grâce". Coup de "gras" means a blow from fat. :)Quote:
coup de gras
Ooops
No Fau Paux or was that Fau Gras
It's "faux pas".
Sure its not a PHO PAW?
Foie gras?
The latest from President "the buck stops there" sounds like he's been getting his talking points from AMHD, Obamacare is just weeding out those bad apple insurance companies.
Obama blames ‘bad apple insurers’ for canceled insurance plans
It's simple America, it's not a broken promise if he never intended to keep it, everyone but Obama, the Dems that passed it, wrote it and implemented it is to blame for the incompetence and it doesn't matter if you liked your plan, could afford it and wanted to keep it because you're too stupid to know what you want.
Where does the incompetence lie if this legislation was enacted by the House and the Senate, Obama may have signed it but he wasn't its author
Hello again, Steve:In this great country of ours, it's NOT illegal to buy a $400 car that isn't road worthy. It IS, however, ILLEGAL to put it on the road. We made it illegal, because people ARE very, very, STUPID.Quote:
it doesn't matter if you liked your plan, could afford it and wanted to keep it because you're too stupid to know what you want.
Look. We've talked about the states that offer low cost cheap insurance. They have them because THOSE states have insurance commissioners who are friendly to the insurance INDUSTRY instead of the populace. Those states offer CHEAP insurance that your side thinks EVERYBODY should have, because they bring down the cost of healthcare...
But, if they don't really cover you when you get sick, they're not worth much... Basically, they're not "road worthy". When they break down, YOU and I pick up the difference. Now, I understand letting the free market reign. In fact, I'm a free marketeer.. But, when these policy's FAIL, the people go to the ER to get the MOST EXPENSIVE CARE there is, and YOU and I pay for it.. That is ANYTHING but the free market at work. It's you and me subsidizing the MOST EXPENSIVE HEALTH CARE THERE IS... As a card carrying right winger, that should really piss you off. But, it doesn't appear to. Why?
Now, are the people who BUY these policies STUPID??? No, of course not. They're DESPERATE. Come on, Steve. It's absolutely IMPOSSIBLE to make an apples to apples comparison when buying insurance.. I'm NOT stupid, but I have NO idea whether I have a good policy or not. In my booklet, there's 25 pages of exceptions, and things they DON'T cover. Nahhh.. I tossed a coin and bought what I THINK is ok, but I HAVE NO IDEA...
Look. I know this is the most recent right wing outrage, only to be replaced with another, and yet another, and even another, given that you're like a pit bull with his jaw clenched on a leg.
But, this outrage too, will be proven to be a lot of hot air about nothing. I say again, when all the chaff is cleared away, people will LOVE Obamacare, just like they do Medicare and Social Security.
excon
How do you ignore the horror stories of people getting sick and finding out the insurance they have been paying for years doesn't cover their sickness? That was before Obama Care happened, and it was more the normal business practice to cap, limit, and discard policy holders.
How do you just dismiss the decades that people were rejected from buying insurance because they had medical issues?
You make a big deal of people losing insurance they like, but most will find out when they need it what they have. Then they won't like it. Yeah its great to be healthy, but we all know we have little control over sudden life changing events. How would you like to be a female who gets pregnant and that insurance you have had for a year doesn't cover maternity care, or hospital visits?
Simply saying you like what you have because its cheap and not needed at this time shouldn't stop you from looking at it objectively, nor objectively explore ALL your options, which you didn't have before.
Like what ways you can get a more comprehensive plan and if it can be subsidized to help pay for it. I guarantee those with sticker shock haven't explored those and are reacting out of that sticker shock, and haven't looked at what's out there (YET! ).
Bottom line, make sure you know what you have before you say how much you like it.
Another point is the number of people so affected by this "change" in policies you SAY you like, which so far is less than one in ten insured Americans, and a full 75% of those will mitigate that sticker shock with tax credits IMMEDIATELY. So I think we should make sure we have all the facts and not jump to a decision because of scary feelings.
Nobody has asked any of those people that can no longer keep what they like if they have even looked to see if they had better options available that they like more. Just hype over getting that letter that DIDN"T explain a damn thing they could do about it, and that's not the truth, or the fact of the matter.
Do your home work, before you holler, and I hope that sticker shock wears off soon. Then you won't be stuck on what you like but take a hard objective look at what you HAVE!
Tal do you ever get sick of talking to a wall
We aren't walls... we are people smart enough to see the liberal propaganda for what it really is... a steaming pile of bovine excrement.
Um, I put that blame where it lies, "the Dems that passed it, wrote it."Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
Ex, that's bullsh*t and you of all people know it. It goes beyond all logic for an insurance company to triple the price of plan that's worse than their basic Obamacare plans. Enough already, I am not that stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Since when are you an apologist for the emperor ? I can assure you that this is exactly what the emperor wants . Reid and Madame Mimi did exactly what he wanted. All his public statements ,even before the 2008 election revealed that he wanted a transition step to fail before his utopian vision of socialized health care is implemented .Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
Hello again, Steve:
No, you're not stupid.. But, you ARE premature.Quote:
It goes beyond all logic for an insurance company to triple the price of plan that's worse than their basic Obamacare plans. Enough already, I am not that stupid.
When all the dust settles, I have CONFIDENCE that the FREE MARKET will work. People will be able to BUY good policies at affordable prices. If it doesn't, and/or it doesn't work on OTHER levels, I'll be the first one on this board to support repeal...
But, it's much too soon to make that determination...
excon
Possibly, but I doubt it. Meanwhile stop feeding me nonsense.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
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