There is no proof in any state that the rules were broken by the governor or legislature. Court rulings are court rulings whether we like them or not. The point is we have a process to follow and resolve such disputes. Public statements are not pronouncements of law and I find it fascinating that the repub cry of voter fraud and the inherent shenanigans to prevent it using suppression, purges and ID laws and requirements have failed in the courts repeatedly.

If you want to question the federal results, then question the local ones too even where repubs enjoyed success. That's not happening so one can only conclude the hope is to try claims of voter fraud in the court of public opinion using wild claims and innuendo targeting specific constituencies when no evidence has been presented in the court of law.

A simple case of lying to the people and crying foul, which has little to do with the outcome we have certified and vested even in repub strongholds. It appears to be a great money raising tactic for repubs and their sheeple however futile that is for any changes.

The dufus just got beat by turnout, the best I've ever seen, but repubs have known turnout would be their downfall for decades now, and the cries of voter fraud has been debunked rather decisively. Not that it stops the hollering though, nor the shenanigans.

Even turtleface is telling his minions to cool it and accept the outcome. The first step to a more perfect union. When you getting on board with that Tomder?

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If you want to question the federal results, then question the local ones too even where repubs enjoyed success.

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Nonsense . Why would I question the results of states like California or NY that are clearly going to go the the Dem ;or red states where you know they are voting Republican . It is only swing states that are in question .

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and the cries of voter fraud has been debunked rather decisively.

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Why because courts refuse to hear cases or make a claim that they can't enforce a remedy ? Nothing has been debunked . We probably will not know decisively until a forensic investigation is done ....... some time well after Quid is installed . Who knows ... we may never know .... just like we will never really know how Kennedy stole the 1960 election. Multiple judges and one independent prosecutor responded to Republican complaints that the vote tally was fair. But historian Robert Dallek, who wrote biographies of JFK and LBJ,, concluded that Daley’s Chi-town machine “probably stole Illinois from Nixon" .

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There is no proof in any state that the rules were broken by the governor or legislature. Court rulings are court rulings whether we like them or not.

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That's true unless, of course, you count these.


https://dailycaller.com/2020/09/30/m...ump-joe-biden/

A judge ruling requires a petition to the court so lets just assume the better legal argument won. Never heard a judge ruling without being asked to. Have you?

hmmmm in all cases except perhaps NC ;judges and Governors over ruled the state legislatures .

And the point is that the law was not followed.

That's a broad and inaccurate premise since as I have said to prevail in a court, one side needs a better compelling argument. To suggest the governor and the courts colluded to subvert state law or authority doesn't seem at all logical. You would need a state by state examination to even arrive at that conclusion.

If you have such a case I would love to examine it.

I just gave you seven.

So extending mail in voting because of the post office problems or covid is a bad idea?

If it violates state law? Yes.

Well guy a judge ruled the changes or adjustment didn't violate the state law, even if a guy in another state disagrees. The state legislatures went along with the judges ruling even if it was grudgingly. Did they appeal those rulings? What happened?

Personally I question such an effort to disenfranchise voters. Political shenanigans. Penalizing a voter because the mail is slow or fear of covids, or even having to work on election day?

A demonrat questioning an effort to disenfranchise voters, I guess that is no the same as helping them with millions of mail in votes

The big problem is that our voting system has become questionable in the eyes of millions of Americans, and with good cause. It is the very predictable outcome of the insane idea of mass mailouts of ballots.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

The big problem is that our voting system has become questionable in the eyes of millions of Americans

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Hmm, wonder why THAT is???

It is because marketing has taken over from reality. PAC collect and pour in millions that are actually an infringement of funding laws but both parties benefit so noone does anything about it. These funds can be directed anyway at all and so millions of mail in votes appear as if by majic

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Originally Posted by paraclete

A demonrat questioning an effort to disenfranchise voters, I guess that is no the same as helping them with millions of mail in votes

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Keep drinking the fake news conspiracy against repubs perpetrated by repubs Clete. Tom and JL have an ample supply and willing to share.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

The big problem is that our voting system has become questionable in the eyes of millions of Americans, and with good cause. It is the very predictable outcome of the insane idea of mass mailouts of ballots.

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Naw, it's a recurring right wing theme to justify continuing Jim Crow era voter suppression.

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Naw, it's a recurring right wing theme to justify continuing Jim Crow era voter suppression.

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So we have to mailout ballots to who knows who with no way to verify the ballots are being filled out by the persons receiving them in order to make it appear that Jim Crow is over with? That's an insane idea. Jim Crow died and was buried decades ago. It's the pretense that some people are unable to get off their butts and go vote like they go and buy groceries, shoes, liquor, books, prescriptions, and many other items that is insanity.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

So we have to mailout ballots to who knows who with no way to verify the ballots are being filled out by the persons receiving them in order to make it appear that Jim Crow is over with? That's an insane idea. Jim Crow died and was buried decades ago. It's the pretense that some people are unable to get off their butts and go vote like they go and buy groceries, shoes, liquor, books, prescriptions, and many other items that is insanity.

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And if they have to drive across the county to the only polling place (because the closer ones were closed) and wait in line for eight hours or more, that's okay? And what if they don't own a car or truck or even a motorcycle?

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

So we have to mailout ballots to who knows who with no way to verify the ballots are being filled out by the persons receiving them in order to make it appear that Jim Crow is over with? That's an insane idea. Jim Crow died and was buried decades ago. It's the pretense that some people are unable to get off their butts and go vote like they go and buy groceries, shoes, liquor, books, prescriptions, and many other items that is insanity.

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None of those things takes hours, and white people have been voting mail in for decades, especially repubs, now minorities are lazy because they want to do it with the same ease? Now it's a fraud, and insane?

Even repub elected officials found no evidence of voter fraud and NEVER have so your whole statement is stupid and insane and a complete lie and sham. 60 court cases and a SCOTUS ruling and still you squawk.

Squawk on dufusite. you got life and BS all mixed up.

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None of those things takes hours, and white people have been voting mail in for decades, especially repubs, now minorities are lazy because they want to do it with the same ease? Now it's a fraud, and insane?

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No one mentioned race but you. If voting takes hours, then that should be remedied, but I doubt that is widespread, and I doubt even more that it is race based in any way.

Requested mail in ballots are a completely different animal from unrequested mail in ballots. One is secure while the other is not. I guess insecure voting is, to you, a fine thing.

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Even repub elected officials found no evidence of voter fraud and NEVER have so your whole statement is stupid and insane and a complete lie and sham. 60 court cases and a SCOTUS ruling and still you squawk.

Squawk on dufusite. you got life and BS all mixed up.

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Thank you for that well-reasoned response.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

No one mentioned race but you. If voting takes hours, then that should be remedied, but I doubt that is widespread, and I doubt even more that it is race based in any way.

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You didn't see those photos and videos of long lines of poc, patiently standing in line for hours -- all day and even after dark?

"The lines are long, but Black voters are demonstrating their will to vote.In Texas, Georgia, Virginia, North Carolina, and Indiana, African Americans’ resiliency and resolve have never been as severely tested.
They have gone to great lengths to overcome voter suppression, discouragement, misinformation, gerrymandering, and so many other obstacles to participate in America’s elections."
https://www.insightnews.com/news/nat...2db2e8e3b.html

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white people have been voting mail in for decades, especially repubs,

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This is true . It is called absentee ballots . You have to request them and your identity verified before receiving them . Then they ONLY get counted in close elections .

‘Absentee ballots remain the largest source of potential voter fraud.”

(2005 report of the Commission on Federal Election Reform, chaired by Jimmy Carter and James Baker ).


They also called on states to increase voter ID requirements(REAL ID should cover that ....sometime next year people will be required to have them for many uses like driving ,air travel ,passports ,getting into Federal facilites ); to halt ballot harvesting; to maintain voter lists; to allow election observers to monitor ballot counting; to make sure voting machines are working properly and to have a paper audit trail for every vote the machines tabulated . They also called on the media to refrain from calling elections early based on exit polls .
Building Confidence in U.S. Elections (legislationline.org)


Kay C. James, a commission member said :

"So many of the problems we’re now hearing about in the aftermath of the 2020 election could have been avoided had states heeded the advice of the Commission on Federal Election Reform,”......Simple protections against fraud, like voter ID and updated voter registration lists, make perfect sense if we truly believe that every vote must count. Election officials should take another look at the commission’s recommendations and make sure they’re doing everything possible to protect the integrity of our elections.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

This is true . It is called absentee ballots . You have to request them and your identity verified before receiving them . Then they ONLY get counted in close elections .

‘Absentee ballots remain the largest source of potential voter fraud.”

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Tomder, for all your blather, Trump's own administration called the election the safest and most secure in the history of US elections.The head of CISA Chris Krebs who made this statement was promptly fired by Trump. Give it up and stop acting like the nutcase in the WH.

What was he doing as Director CISA while the Ruskies were hacking ?

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Trump's own administration called the election the safest and most secure in the history of US elections

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A statement by one person amounts to, "Trump's own administration"???

It seems unfortunate that there are so many people who believe that minorities are either too simple-minded or too lazy to get a voter ID (which most people already have) and go to a polling place to vote. To them, only white people can figure out such a fantastically difficult and complicated process, so for them, requiring those things amounts to some form of systemic racism. It actually amounts to a subtle and yet substantial prejudice against minorities in suggesting they cannot do what everyone else seems perfectly capable of doing. It illustrates "the bigotry of low expectations."

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Originally Posted by tomder55

What was he doing as Director CISA while the Ruskies were hacking ?

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He was doing his job. Whether he knew or didn't know about Russian hacking is irrelevant to what he knew about the election. Various sources, including IBM, said the election was not hacked by the espionage hack. It's also possible Krebs knew but did not publicly reveal what he knew re the hack.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

A statement by one person amounts to, "Trump's own administration"???

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Does it matter the dufus LOST. Accept it.

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It seems unfortunate that there are so many people who believe that minorities are either too simple-minded or too lazy to get a voter ID (which most people already have) and go to a polling place to vote. To them, only white people can figure out such a fantastically difficult and complicated process, so for them, requiring those things amounts to some form of systemic racism. It actually amounts to a subtle and yet substantial prejudice against minorities in suggesting they cannot do what everyone else seems perfectly capable of doing. It illustrates "the bigotry of low expectations."

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Black voters obviously met the standard in their states to register and vote despite the shenanigans, so your disgusting assessment is a deluded fringe loony lie. I mean do voters standing in long lines sound lazy to you? It seems the subtle prejudice against minorities is YOURS and obviously blatant and unfounded at that.

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Black voters obviously met the standard in their states to register and vote

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Wonderful. Kind of makes your argument weak, don't you think?

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so your disgusting assessment is a deluded fringe loony lie.

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You sure are thin skinned.

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I mean do voters standing in long lines sound lazy to you? It seems the subtle prejudice against minorities is YOURS and obviously blatant and unfounded at that.

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You need to learn to read. I did not say anyone was lazy. I have no doubt that anyone in this country who is willing to trouble him/her self can register and vote. You are the one who doubts that they are willing to put out the effort to do it. "The soft bigotry of low expectations."

Sorry we voted the dufus out. I know it hurt you deeply. You loony fringers have my sincere condolences for your loss. Look at the bright side. The dark stank of the dufus a$$ can be replaced by sunshine and flowers if you so choose. If you need help extricating yourself don't hesitate to ask.

It can't be easy after years of delusion and lunacy, but I'm here for you!

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Sorry we voted the dufus out. I know it hurt you deeply. You loony fringers have my sincere condolences for your loss. Look at the bright side. The dark stank of the dufus a$$ can be replaced by sunshine and flowers if you so choose. If you need help extricating yourself don't hesitate to ask.

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Honestly, I'm tired of your constant references to men's asxes. I have enjoyed many of our exchanges, but that makes you appear to be an ignorant, vulgar little man who can come up nothing intelligent to say and is afraid of any kind of honest discussion. If that is the case with you, then find someone with similar interests in men's rear ends to exchange with. That sick train of thought is not something I am familiar with. If you want to continue it, count me out.

Obviously you are in denial of where your head is stuck at. That's okay. I understand your helpless frustration. If you stop kicking so wildly I can grab your ankles and pull you free.

Just trying to help my loony fringe brother get some fresh air.

Could you turn your head a bit to the left so your nose can clear the dufus hemorrhoids'?

Thankfully, there is a "block" choice on this site to eliminate cowardly, ignorant, vulgar little men who can come up with nothing intelligent to say and are afraid of honest discussion. Boom. It's a shame, but it's time. I'll miss our discussions, but there must be some level of civility, so enough.

@JL

Well you could just simply deny my observation of where your head is at, but if blocking me makes you feel better then go for it.

Makes no difference to me where you run...you can't hide. Or you could just stop throwing rocks yourself, up to you what you do.

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Originally Posted by talaniman

Obviously you are in denial of where your head is stuck at. That's okay. I understand your helpless frustration. If you stop kicking so wildly I can grab your ankles and pull you free.

Just trying to help my loony fringe brother get some fresh air.

Could you turn your head a bit to the left so your nose can clear the dufus hemorrhoids'?

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I had to laugh at this. Gross, but you painted a picture hard to get rid of. Still laughing.

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I had to laugh at this. Gross, but you painted a picture hard to get rid of. Still laughing.

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Unsurprisingly, it would attract you.

It's a dirty job Athos, confronting an insulting bully, but somebody has to do it.

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Originally Posted by talaniman

It's a dirty job Athos, confronting an insulting bully, but somebody has to do it.

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And with humor! Nice work.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Thankfully, there is a "block" choice on this site to eliminate cowardly, ignorant, vulgar little men who can come up with nothing intelligent to say and are afraid of honest discussion. Boom. It's a shame, but it's time. I'll miss our discussions, but there must be some level of civility, so enough.

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why are you still here

Same reason you're still here.

Insomnia?