So what's the problem, excepting it might be a little outdated
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So what's the problem, excepting it might be a little outdated
Dude, stop dancing around the issue and insulting my intelligence. My occupation is in SAFETY, we have to comply with DOT, MSHA and OSHA for starters, the scope is MIND BOGGLING, and that doesn't take into account the usual regs applicable to most businesses, state regulations and local code.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
One shouldn't need a 400 page safety manual to walk around a plant inspecting fire extinguishers, but thanks to liability issues and over-regulation that's EXACTLY what all those evil corporations that you think need more oversight are requiring now and it gets deeper every day. So don't condescend to me on regulations, put up and show us how easy it is to comply or shut up
Hello:
The term "regulations" means different things to different people. I think we have too many, but I don't think we should get rid of ALL of 'em... I actually LIKE regulations that keep us "safe". Of course, the word "safe" means different things to different people..
Fer instance, I think it's FINE that I can't smoke in public buildings, and it's FINE that I have to wear a seat belt. It's NOT fine that the government wants to put me in jail for smoking pot..
excon
But of course claiming that we want to get rid of ALL regulation is a strawman.
Again with myth that we want to get rid of ALL regulations. Come on ex, you know that's ridiculous.
My occupation was safety too, and I did a lot more than just walk around checking for fire extinguishers, and know full well the short cuts workers and companies take for convenience and save a few bucks. If its not in detailed writing, and put into practice it doesn't get done so keep your manual handy and read the damn thing because it might save your life.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
And stop belly aching because I have personal friends who have died because of not paying attention and not following the rules so get the freak off my back about what's needed and NOT needed.
We aren't talking about just you, we are talking about how to handle very dangerous materials and situations that do occur industry wide, and for your information many deaths and injuries have resulted in procedures and policy being updated, or changed completely. The first rule is to be aware of your surroundings and pay attention to potential hazards. Even if all your doing is checking fire extinguishers.
Sorry the manual is 400 pages, there is a lot to cover. Read it BEFORE you check those extinguishers. And I have acknowledged the difficulties involved with compliance, never said it was easy nor should it be, but the alternatives are death and injury, sometimes serious injury.
Take your pick.
So far all you have complained about are the number of pages to read but you have not articulated any regulation to date that HURTS a business. Big business has NOT either, so what the hell are you guys b1tching about?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
In other words, you're all hat and no cattle.
No, you parrot the straw argument that regulations hurt businesses and have laid out no specific examples, so that makes YOU what you refer to me as and I ain't going for it.
Talking loud, and saying nothing is unnacceptable. That's no way to have a debate and arguing abstract ideas is NOT a debate. Be specific, like why the government has stricter requirements for energy companies for emissions or disposal of left over by products of refining shale oil, or diclosure of chemicals used in frakking, as that's specific, not the entire regulation guide for the whole country.
Now if you want to know how to use those tools that's different than hollering about the expense of compliance.
Wrong Bucko, you asked "So what could those regulations that are choking them so bad be?"Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
I did my part, all you give us is a head fake.
I have already pointed out they have trained lawyers and accountants to explain things to them and devise strategies, and you don't. What do you think congressional staffers do? Read and explain stuff, and write legislation. You have to get your own understanding from other sources like the boss or a manual.
Don't blame your own innability to articulate your questions on me.
Oh I get it, I forget sometimes that you lefties think we're too stupid for our own good and that bogging business down with the expense of lawyers, accountants and consultants and otherwise complying with the over-bloated bureaucracy is just the cost of doing business.. Sorry dude, but you're just digging yourself a deeper and deeper hole.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
You aren't dumb or stupid I just worked for a global company that demanded I have a formal education to have a good job is all.
And yet you can't see the forest for the trees.
Café standards didn't lead to new materials nor robots. It lead to plastics being used so if the car catchs fire you have yet another hazzard on your hands from the smoke. There is enough competition in the world that it should be eliminated as the standards they are using is actually holding back progress rather then promoting it. Also why should there be a built in penalty for the working man? Its time is long past to drop it as a "standard".Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
The great difficulty with standards is they are often written with the close involvement of industry, so it becomes not something to be attained but that which is already attainable. A country will write standards which force its competitors into disadvantage
You see Clete its not the 70's anymore. That is what brought this whole thing about.Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
More info:
CAFE (Fuel Efficiency) Standards for Passenger Cars and Light Trucks
Café standards ,like the Tesla are built for utopia instead of the roads of the North East.
Tesla Nightmare Shows Problem With All-Electric Cars - Business Insider
Obama's CAFE Standards – The Obama Administration's CAFE Standards
Still not sure why you are opposed to Café?
I had told you. It is no longer needed and is holding back progress. What more do you need for opposition ?Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
I think there is much room for improvement, and I think we can and should build on what we have done so far. Why stop now?
What progress does this stop?
The standards are in conjunction with the EPA and prevent inovative ways of making things much more efficient. So once they have a "standard" then there is no need to reach above the bar. It is a disincentive to all of us to hold everything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
I think I see what your driving at. Once a goal is reached then the creative thinking for a better product declines? Couldn't raising the bar a bit higher help with that?
Not really as then you obtain unreachable goals with the way they demand it being done. You have to understand that they are stuck on the stochiometric standard. If they remove it then we could go places where there are no such limitations. Instead with this in place your limited in the scope of your thinking.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Comes down to a reliable long lasting power source if I understand you correctly. That is the key and like everything else the support and delivery system around it. We seem to be having the same problem in lighting our cities too.
For now we are limited.
Do you have a problem lighting your cities? I thought that only happened in the third world. When I was in Pakistan it reminded me of the days of my childhood when power interruptions were frequent but such problems have long since been solved by digging up some deep green. I know that is out of favour but reality demonstrates that we have not had to build a power station in many years since we exported all our polluting industries to China, where I didn't see the sun from the time I got there until the time I leftQuote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
The problem is not lighting the cities, its more maintaining an aging grid subject to failures under stress, like from the weather. We don't even prune the trees back from transmission lines any more due to cut backs.
You can't get away with that here once it was proven that power lines cause catastrophic fire events but then our transmission lines aren't in private hands
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