Ah, so you have none to abide by?
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Ah, so you have none to abide by?
Again I ask, which rules are you referring to?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
I'm really starting to like this man:
"It was a terrorist attack. It wasn't the result of a mob being excited. It was a group of jihadists who were well-armed and well-trained and well-equipped, and they decided to attack the consulate in Benghazi and try and kill people. That's far different from what happened in Cairo, where a mob was whipped into a frenzy by these people who were talking about this so-called movie that insults Mohammed."
As for the Obama administration's handling of the crisis, McCain was almost entirely positive. "I think it was fine. By the way, Secretary of State Hilary Clinton gave a marvelous statement today," said McCain. He did not offer such praise for the Romney campaign's statements on the events. (ABC News)
Specifically, the one here that says "Do not disparage any member publicly on the forums. If you state that you disagree with the answer of another member, please explain why politely."
I explained myself numerous times, justified my answer, supplied my source and attempted to get back on topic only to be accused of deliberate deception by you anyway. I think being called a liar, especially after having shown I'm not, definitely qualifies.
I'm done with this thread, obviously having a mature discussion is out of the question.
I disparaged you? Called you a liar? I tried to keep the discussion fair.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Does that rule apply to yourself as well? Or just to us?Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
That's just the President voting ' present' again. Mitt said that the adm sends mixed signals.. there you go.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Hello again:
I don't know what's troubling you righty's so much... I thought you didn't LIKE the Muslim Brotherhood... Now that Obama is moving AWAY from them, you think they're great...
I can't figure you out..
excon
Sort of like this? "I really enjoy reading your posts, Tom, but sometimes I want to reach into my monitor and strangle you, but then, as I get to know you better, that may change."Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
What makes you think he's moving away from them ? That phone call he made to Morsi ? Lol .Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
This is the White House version :
"The President made his point that we've been committed to the process of change in Egypt, and we want to continue to build with the Egyptian government"
That doesn't sound like he moving in his position at all . That sounds like Candidate Obama being aware that the melt down in the ummah ; and the fervent anti-Americanism is a direct threat to his reelection theme related to foreign policy that he has restored American prestige and defeated the jihadists.
Morsi is a committed member of the Brotherhood .The Brotherhood instigated the protests (and cooperated in the commando style raid that killed Amabassador Stevens ). The immam at Cairo University (where the President made his address during his apology tour ) endorses the protests and the pogroms against the Copts . The President is delusional to think that a phone call to Morsi from Air Force One ,in between campaign stops, can turn back the rising tide.
And words have real meanings in diplomacy .Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Was I diplomatic? :) Good example?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
No ;the President's words. Romney's charges was the adm is sending mixed signals . He's correct. In one sentence ,the President proved his point.
The recent middle east unrest reminds me of the struggles of another young new nation that had challenges to build after years of being told what to do, and how to do it. The Good Old USA! How quickly we forget all the blood we ourselves have shed, on the path to freedom.
Of course you righties have no sympathy for the growing pains of new democracies, and think that unless its an instant success, it's a failure. They just have a ways to go, and indeed, so do we.
So you are OK with our embassies being over-run and our Ambassador ambushed and murdered ? Ok
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Quoting out of context, contextomy-call it what you like but it does not excuse it.
If it was his intention to send, "mixed signals" then the second part of the quote should be included to demonstrate this point.. The partial quote gives the impression of a concrete position.
Tut
I never said it was okay, those are your words.I said it was COMMON for new governments to go through this period of chaos. That's why I used us as an example because we had our own history of senseless violence and mistakes.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Lets be real as there is a vacuum of authority, and responsibility that's being exploited by dissidents in the middle east, fostered by decades of dictators, who took no prisoners, and they are no longer there. The new governments are weak and we have seen this in all governments through out history.
Have you forgotten the struggles of Eastern Europe when the Soviets splintered?
The complete quote was the mixed signal. It doesn't take much.. Ambassador April Gilespi once told Saddam Hussein that the US had no opinion on his border disputes with Kuwait .That sent a wrong signal . Had she said that the US would not tolerate his move on Kuwait ,then the Gulf War may have been prevented .Quote:
Originally Posted by TUT317
In context ;out of context... his statement was feckless and weak... not a strong leader at all.
And I'll remind you in case you have forgotten that I was more than willing that we assist the new democracy in Iraq in their infancy ;but it was Obama and Evita that cut the rug out of our assistance to them .I'll also remind you that it is Obama who threw his support behind the Brotherhood ;a terrorist organization .Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Hi Tom,
I'm not disputing your judgement on the politics. In fact I would tend to agree with you.
Out of context it is a definitive statement. In context it would be a mixed message.
Tut
They were ready to deal with things on their own in Iraq, they didn't need us, and we didn't need there condition. Case closed. American businesses is all over Iraq.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
You didn't go there to stay and in any case you being there didn't stop them bombing each other senseless, you made no real difference to the life of the Iraqi, just helped them exchange one tyranny for another and they have proven themselves incapable of western style democracy
What the hell this has to do with us I don't know
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/police-gas-sydney-protesters-20120915-25yrb.html
I expect muslims are just looking for an excuse
So america, do us a favour, keep your trouble in your own back yard and please decide soon that making hate films isn't and never was free speech
The blue helmet UN Multinational Peace Keepers were attacked and overrun in the Sinai . There were wounded casualties. The attackers threw hand grenades, fired rpg's,entered the peacekeepers camp, and raised a black Islamist flag.
The peace keepers have been there since the 1979 Camp David Accords peace treaty was negotiated and brokered by Jimmy Carter .The deal remained in place for almost 25 years until the Brotherhood took over Egypt with the tacit approval and support of President Zero.
Morsi pays lip service to the accords of course. He isn't stupid enough to come right out and scrap them... not with US bucks on the line. But he has been very open in his intent to "amend " the accords. His advisor ,Mohammed Esmat Seif Al-Dawla,says that the amends must include an Egyptian remilitarization of the Sinai... in other words ;a signiicant military mobilization on the Israeli border .
Meanwhile our allies /non-allies depending on the hour ,have organized anti-American demonstrations/riots /attacks throughout the ummah . In Bengazi ,the Airport has been closed because of all the ani-aircraft fire by our "allies " in Libya .
The President's foreign policy is in ruins,and requires at the minimum an explanation to the people's House... Congress about what went wrong,and where he plans on steering the ship of state going forward.. But I'm hearing from Congressman Devin Nunes that the State Dept is refusing to send a spokesperson to Capitol Hill to testify to the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence.
Perhaps they can't defend the President's 'shoot first-aim later' blunder about our relationship with Egypt. Oh I'm sure our relationship is begging for reevaluation. But for now ,Egypt is an ally ,and has been for decades .The US and Egyptian militaries still communicate and still work together. We still hold Egypt accountable for its peace treaty with Israel. The US has just pledged even more aid . That looks like a duck and quacks like a duck to me .
Until there is a formal declaration to the contrary ,the President is bound to that reality. His comment was contradictory mixed signals that does not help clarify the US position at all. Had he been a staffer at the State Dept ,and made such a public comment he likely would've been fired. Keep that in mind in November .
Have you seen the video ? I haven't.. all I've seen is a 3rd rate trailer that has the quality of a D grade high school project. You really think this is about an alleged video insult ? Please ! You are smarter than that.Quote:
so america, do us a favour, keep your trouble in your own back yard and please decide soon that making hate films isn't and never was free speech
The "peaceful religion" has slandered Judaism and Christianity with blasphemies for years and you don't see these orchestrated mock outrage riots.
The fact that Aussies have come under the cross hairs should tell you it has nothing to do with the video. Go ahead ;retreat into your island fortress and pretend that it can't happen to you if you cower under cover.
Hello tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
So, Obama should prostrate himself in front of the obstructionist Republican House, and tell them what went wrong?? Really?? He should DO that?? Bwa, ha ha ha ha.
The closer we get to the election the more desperate you sound...
Obama by a Huge, HUMONGOUS margin, and it's getting LARGER.
excon
This is what I am noticing as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Hello NK:Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Our right wingers apparently believe the same thing Romney does. Here's what his campaign says,
Resolve... RESOLVE? He said it was our lack of RESOLVE!! That means if they were AFRAID of us, like they would be under a Romney administration, they wouldn't be demonstrating...Quote:
“There's a pretty compelling story that if you had a President Romney, you'd be in a different situation,” Richard Williamson, a top Romney foreign policy adviser, told The Washington Post..
In Egypt and Libya and Yemen, again demonstrations — the respect for American has gone down, there's not a sense of American resolve,
That is SO stupid, and SO outrageous on SO many levels that, even I have no comment on it...
Excon
So did Jimmy Carter . Carter had double digit leads,and a huge lead as late as Oct 26 1980. Now what did Carter in?. The Islamist Revoution in Iran , a poor debate performance ,high gas prices (they have more than doubled in the Obama term) ,and pure arrogance dismissing his opponent as a lightweight.Quote:
Obama by a Huge, HUMONGOUS margin, and it's getting LARGER.
Hello again, tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Well, history MIGHT repeat itself, or it MIGHT not... My bet is not.
Romney IS a lightweight. He'd be the MOST dangerous president we've ever had...
excon
And the President is incompetent . The security at the Benghazi Consulate was a lock and key. The administration "explains" this by saying it was an "interim facility." But why should they be concerned ? It's not like the city was a hotbed of radical Islamist activity... right ?Quote:
Romney IS a lightweight. He'd be the MOST dangerous president we've ever had...
LibyaQuote:
The Department of State warns U.S. citizens against all but essential travel to Libya. The incidence of violent crime, especially carjacking and robbery, has become a serious problem. In addition, political violence in the form of assassinations and vehicle bombs has increased in both Benghazi and Tripoli.
Hello again, tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
If our consulates and embassy's become armed fortress's and no longer accessible by the people, we might as well close them down and bring the people home...
You didn't respond to Romney saying if the Muslims were AFRAID of us, they wouldn't be demonstrating... I think you BELIEVE that too. Otherwise you wouldn't blame Obama for EVERY bad thing that happens to us in the world... If Romney were running things, there WOULDN'T BE bad things happening to us..
To him (and you), Iraq was a triumph over a nuclear-armed Saddam Hussein, Barack Obama has spent the last three and a half years on an endless apology tour, an invasion of Iran is long past due, and the United States should resume torture as soon as possible.
THAT is why he'd be the MOST dangerous president we've ever had..
excon
Yes Tom I have seen the video, a rambling piece of crud that you really have to be looking to work out what it is on about, poor photography, virtually no script, RS editing, something about extortion and underage sex. The people working on it must have thought it was a porn film.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
The average muslim knows nothing but what they are told, mere cannon fodder for the nut cases, this why we have Them running loose in Sydney. I haven't heard of them running loose in the US. The american embassy is in a tall building, no opportunity to force entry there, unlike the poorly protected hacienda in Benghazi
Tom we know it can happen to us we arrested a muslim terror cell the other day, really upset the good citizens of Melbourne it did and we don't cower, but we don't need your problems here, we have our own, mainly imported under a misguided humanitiarian program and we still keep taking these people from these war zones. You guys perpetrated many of these wars and you should open your doors to the millions of refugees you created, God knows you have enough empty houses to house them all
And if the local host nation cannot protect them then it is up to us to protect them .What we have here is a 9-11 truther in Egypt who's government is complicit in instigating the attacks. Morsi and his government should be held personally responsible for the safety of American Embassies and consulates in their nation.. and that is the same for every other nation where our staffs are threatened .Quote:
If our consulates and embassy's become armed fortress's and no longer accessible by the people, we might as well close them down and bring the people home...
Clete ,I have little sympathies to the morons sensibilities who have listened to their clerics slander and defame Judaism with 'blood libel' and other outrageous charges since the founding of their religion.If they dish it out they should expect to get some in return. But instead of defending our freedom of expression and thought ;this adm has gone on with it's apology tour ;and is actively seeking to prosecute the author.
Hello again, tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
I can only repeat what I said above.. Romney says the problem is America's lack of Resolve... RESOLVE? That means if they were AFRAID of us, like they would be under a Romney administration, they wouldn't be demonstrating...
Apparently, you and Romney think we need a couple MORE Mid East wars... That'll teach 'em! Let's start with Iran.
That is SO stupid, and SO outrageous on SO many levels that, even I have no comment on it...
excon
No I don't want no more Middle East wars .But it is the weakness on display that will lead to them.
There's no weakness on display. You want us to bomb the Mideast?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
I watched the first minutes of that movie. It's worse than LaHay's Left Behind! Can't believe anyone would throw an RPG at anything except the movie screen
No I want the embassies protected ;or close down the missions . Let me ask you ;what will the UN do about it's forces being assaulted ? Don't answer... I'll tell you . They will meet in NY soon and make hate speeches against Israel.
Its almost funny how you condemn them for talking about us, but say nothing when the loonies talk about them.
Seems you should know better, being free and all. They aren't free yet, and have no clue about what free is. While Obama may not be perfect, Mitt is clueless on everything except his tax cut!
You righties here seem to want what those righties there want, the church to make the rules and tell the people what to do. So what's the difference between Christian and Muslim fundamentalist right wing loonies? You guys just know how to look normal and be sneakier, and can get quietly elected!
OOPS so do they, my bad! Oh wait,I know the difference, silly me, you guys run to kiss Netanyahu butt, even when his own people are a lot more cautious about listening to his right wing pandering.
I love you loonies, but you guys are crazy, and completely out of step with reality! And don't expect an apology!! Expect a MUD slide you so richly deserve.
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