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Originally Posted by paraclete

I think BO has spelled it out, there are more important things to do right now. What we could do when we had 4,000,000,000 people becomes much more difficult when we have 7,000,000,000 or 9,000,000,000

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Speaking of Luddite vote-buying politicians. It won't make our narcissitic President look good on camera, so it won't happen.

It's less difficult now than it was in '69. All it will take now is a Murdoch or a Branson willing to make his grandson richer than Croesus.

Here is the luddite response .

But does Murdoch or Branson know what the gods have in store for them ? They could be Icarus incarnate .:D

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Originally Posted by tomder55

Here is the luddite response .

But does Murdoch or Branson know what the gods have in store for them ? They could be Icarus incarnate .:D

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Almost got it, Tom. Your spelling is too good to be a proper Luddite, however.

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Originally Posted by Catsmine

Speaking of Luddite vote-buying politicians. It won't make our narcissitic President look good on camera, so it won't happen.

It's less difficult now than it was in '69. All it will take now is a Murdoch or a Branson willing to make his grandson richer than Croesus.

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What it takes cats is EGO, Murdoch is too old now and Branson is already on the way but it does take more than these men possess, what's needed is another Howard Hughes, a person who thinks big, but isn't interested in the politics

Strange no one has talked about the 6 billion dollar NASA budget increase over 5 years.

http://www.nasa.gov/pdf/420994main_2...or_Remarks.pdf

Fight for NASA's Future! - What We Do | The Planetary Society

The Launch Pad: 2011 NASA Budget Proposal
"One will likely be a lunar mission to demonstrate tele-operation capability from Earth and potentially from the International Space Station, including the ability to transmit near-live video to Earth. This will also result in investigations for validating the availability of resources for extraction. NASA will provide opportunities to participate in the payloads and observation teams, and potentially portions of the spacecraft, through open competition."

But by far this was the most informative site that's out there, as it explains that though the Constellation and Aries programs will be streamlined, I doubt that any of the 7000 engineers, scheduled for job cuts will go to McDonald's, or Burger King anytime soon, as private industry pays a lot more.
FY 2011 NASA Budget Request

Actually, NASA has been expanded in a very significant way is my take on things with private industry as a resource to many things that NASA, and us cannot financially support.

I think some of you guys watch too much Fox News, and not enough CNN. Its not about going to the moon and kicking dust or collecting rocks, we have been there done that. Time for a more focused plan.

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Originally Posted by paraclete

What it takes cats is EGO, Murdoch is too old now and Branson is already on the way but it does take more than these men possess, what's needed is another Howard Hughes, a person who thinks big, but isn't interested in the politics

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I'm with you there. Spot me a couple billion and I'll do it. How's 25 years at 12% per annum, payable as a balloon sum?

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we have been there done that.

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That is what the Spaniards said after Columbus' voyages.

What pray tell was the earth shattering proposal the President floated ? Back to the OP... hitch a ride on an asteroid?. or other fuzzy references to future projects that will not be concrete proposals while he's in office. Don't you see that all he did was float vagarities to get Congressmen who promote the American space agency off his back ?
The man has no vison of a future in space. It interferes with his reorganization of America plans .

Look ;I have no problem with private industry taking over the transport to and from ISS ,and even doing the space tourism thingy .

There is a lot more of the moon to explore .Going back to the moon is not recreating the Apollo missions and "kicking rocks". It is setting up permanent basing .It is a logical next step in the progression of human space exploration .

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Originally Posted by Catsmine

I'm with you there. Spot me a couple billion and I'll do it. How's 25 years at 12% per annum, payable as a balloon sum?

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Nope, I'm into short term returns, with a project like that and the usual cost/time overruns I don't think you will have even $16 Billion in 25 years. Now if you could find the fountain of youth as Murdoch seems to have done, I might be interested

What's logical to me is keep upgrading our capabilities so we can one day colonize the moon, in which we will need to be able to survive for long periods in space. That was outlined in his speech.

I think we have to look beyond the moon, and set our goals higher to someday explore the moon in dept, and that what its about. Expansion of capabilities by including ideas from a lot of resource (money, and people), besides NASA.

As I posted before, lunar landings are not off the table but will be more research orientated not only for resources but developing technology, that get us further into deep space.

Can't argue with forward thinking . But a lunar colony is doable now and would help inspire kids to get into engineering and the sciences etc. It's not good enough to say been there and done that when all the combined landings were equal to no more than 2 weeks of planting flags,collecting rocks ,hitting golf balls and riding in a souped up quad.
We have the capability now even if it means building a couple of Saturn rockets for the mission and depositing the components for construction of a colony on unmanned missions .

Even with your plan that takes people to be able to survive in the lunar environment for long periods, and that's a part of the whole glitch that has to be worked out.

That's exactly what the President said, the lessons learned from long range plans make short term goals achievable. The list of things that space explorations has brought to the world are endless, and have changed us humans dramatically, and not just with technology, but for medical science as well. I see more of that coming, as we broaden our goals beyond the moon.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

...when all the combined landings were equal to no more than 2 weeks of planting flags,collecting rocks ,hitting golf balls and riding in a souped up quad.

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That's the made-for-tv stuff, there was hard science being done when the cameras were not running.

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Originally Posted by NeedKarma

That's the made-for-tv stuff, there was hard science being done when the cameras were not running.

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I agree with that... We the public ony see a fraction of what they actually do. Mostly because most people can't grasp what it is they are doing... what it means, and why its good to know what you don't already know.

Like I've said before... I know enough people there.. and I've spent enough time in one of the space centers to get a good idea how much they do (a LOT), vs how little merits the Oooooo Wow stuff like some of the Hubble pictures that have been released.

Everything worth knowing... or doing isn't based on how popular would it be on the Discovery Channel, nor should it be.

Well said smoothy.

Here's a great website that shows how busy the astronauts were: Apollo Missions click on any mission number.

All the more reason to go back. For one thing to poles were not visited and that is where the real action is .

Hello:

I just watched the shuttle Discovery land. As boring as the shuttle program was, it STILL gives me chills.

Project Mercury was our first human spaceflight program. It ran from 1959 through 1963 with the goal of putting a human in orbit around the Earth. My ship was operating in the Atlantic off Florida back then, and we were part of the recovery program. I saw several capsules plunge into the water.

We were working hard to attain the goal our president set for us. We were ALL behind it, and we loved it. I remember looking up at the moon the day man first walked on it. It brought tears to my eyes - because we did it - and because I revered my president.

I WISH we could find that spirit again.

excon

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Originally Posted by excon

Hello:

I just watched the shuttle Discovery land. As boring as the shuttle program was, it STILL gives me chills.

Project Mercury was our first human spaceflight program. It ran from 1959 through 1963 with the goal of putting a human in orbit around the Earth. My ship was operating in the Atlantic off Florida back then, and we were part of the recovery program. I saw several capsules plunge into the water.

We were working hard to attain the goal our president set for us. We were ALL behind it, and we loved it. I remember looking up at the moon the day man first walked on it. It brought tears to my eyes - because we did it - and because I revered my president.

I WISH we could find that spirit again.

excon

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If you could make things happen in under 2 minutes then you might see that spirit again. But it seems today's generation isn't interested in anything that takes that long. It seems sad that the national interest seems to be only the internet.

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Originally Posted by excon

I WISH we could find that spirit again.

excon

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Now maybe if Iran gets a space program, or the Chinese announce a manned mission to Mars, you might see the spirit arise again, but sadly, you have no one to compete with

And our leadership lacks the vision. But you are correct. The space race was part of the cold war .I think it is a major part of the reason the Cold war was won.
Defense Contractors were a major part of both the arms and space race.

On Long Island where both Rick and I originate Grumman was an integral part ,and I'm proud to say ,so was my father .

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Originally Posted by tomder55

and our leadership lacks the vision. But you are correct. The space race was part of the cold war .I think it is a major part of the reason the Cold war was won.
Defense Contractors were a major part of both the arms and space race.

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Yes the space race bankrupted the Soviet Union but they must have done something right they are earning Dollars from it.

So what do the defence contractors do now?

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Originally Posted by paraclete

yes the space race bankrupted the Soviet Union but they must have done something right they are earning Dollars from it.

So what do the defence contractors do now?

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They already have and should be test flying next month their own shuttle except it will be unmanned. That's what they are currently into as far as telling the public.