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Originally Posted by tomder55

Article II Sec for is specific …"

The President, Vice President and all civil officers of the United States, shall be removed from office on impeachment for, and conviction of, treason, bribery, or other high crimes and

misdemeanors."

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Every legal scholar consulted incl Dershowitz has explained the meaning of the Constitution re impeachment. You don't seriously think your lone voice is going to be more credible than dozens of lawyers including the very guys who wrote the clause? Dream on.

How about Rudy getting the ambassador fired for being in the way of his re elect scheme. Naw that's no crime but it's certainly an abuse of power. There is still that bring in a foreign country to influence an election as if that's not enough.

oh I follow the framers closely , Like in

Federalist 65,Hamilton wrote that impeachment “will seldom fail to agitate the passions of the whole community, and to divide it into parties more or less friendly or inimical to the accused. In many cases it will connect itself with the pre-existing factions, and will enlist all their animosities, partialities, influence, and interest on one side or on the other.”And: “In such cases there will always be the greatest danger that the decision will be regulated more by the comparative strength of parties, than by the real demonstrations of innocence or guilt.”
What demonstrates his point more than the Dems holding a star chamber show trial and impeaching on a strict party line basis ?
Democrat Law professor Jonathan Turley said in testimony that frivolous articles of impeachment is the abuse of power . He was right in his assessment

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Originally Posted by tomder55

Law professor Jonathan Turley said in testimony that frivolous articles of impeachment is the abuse of power . He was right in his assessment

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Turley confirmed that impeachment does NOT require a crime.

When it comes to the dufus and his shenanigans it's just so wrong on many levels to exploit an ally engaged in a hot war to serve your political re election. I think it's even worse though that these antics are condoned by the right and that included the cover up after getting caught. So if some winger can explain why it's okay to engage in this sort of corrupt behavior please have at it.

sorry Tal .....Trump made it clear long before he became President that he was opposed to foreign aid in general ;and specifically to corrupt governments . There is no basis to assume that his holding up the aid had anything to do with the 2020 election cycle. The Dems have tried to make that case ,but failed to prove it . Long before his conversation with Zelensky;Trump attempted to make sweeping cuts in foreign aid . His latest attempt was rebuked by Congress last year before his call. You see what really happened is that Schiff convinced Madam Mim that Trump would never release the transcripts so they could get away with their Ukraine hoax. But once the transcripts were released ,proving Schiff to be a liar ,then all they had left was the testimony of the foreign policy "experts " and the diplomatic corp who opposed Trump's policies in general .

I think the evidence is pretty clear Tom in that the dufus zeroed in on the Bidens and used taxpayer money to try and get a smear job going. You add the antics he had to go through and around the government process and procedures we have a cover up of what was supposed to be a quiet secret operation known to only a few in his close circle. We know a lot thanks to the dems, and it doesn't bode well that even more is coming to light.

If I was a repub, I would be very careful going out on a limb for this dude, even though their futures are closely tied to the dufus getting away with this caper. I have no sympathy though for the rock and hard place repubs are stuck between. Or the twisting in the wind they find themselves caught up in.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

There is no basis to assume that his holding up the aid had anything to do with the 2020 election cycle.

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Except for the testimony of everybody and his brother in his Administration. Throw in Rudy and his pals for good measure.

Where the hell have you been, Tom?

Please, get over it: Trump is going to squash the hell out of ANY DEMO CANDIDATE YOU PUT UP AGAINST HIM IN THE NOV. 2020 ELECTION: The Demos have no worthy candidate! All of them are bums and radical leftist. Bernie is straight-up Bolshevik! Demos are DOOMED! Repubs will probably take the Congress back, too: Then the Repubs will IMPEACH Pelosi and Schiff!

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I think the evidence is pretty clear Tom

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and I think that Trump's lawyers dismantled the Dem argument effectively today by introducing the evidence the Dem team conveniently ignored from their OWN witnesses .

I can see where you would latch onto that notion as you and repubs have to be pretty desperate about now. Maybe they'll elaborate more Monday.

RIP Kobe

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Originally Posted by tomder55

RIP Kobe

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And his 13 year old daughter.

Wasn't Kobe a rapist? When you got millions of $$$s, the Justice System treats you differently...and it doesn't matter what color your are, either. Kobe bought his way out of a rape conviction, not to be fooled.....and how many other women experienced his savagery and DIDN'T come out to say anything. NO, rapist ain't getting pity.

because the women must always be believed . He admitted to an adulterous encounter which he said was consentual . The woman refused to testify against him so charges were dropped .The woman filed a separate civil case which was settled out of court with no admission of fault .But he did apologize to her . He actively participated in 7 charitable causes including After School All Stars ;which provides free after school programs for children He and his daughter were going to one of this organization's events when their helicopter went down.

tomder55: No, not a "Me Too" movement follower but this accusation of rape by Kobe was long before all that Me Too jazz. When a man pays a woman money AND apologizes, he has something bigger he's hiding: big time guilt. Believe it that he BOUGHT his way out....and believe he did it before and never got caught.

One of my brother's wife was raped while they were stationed overseas: Its a horrible experience for the woman, her husband, her kids, and everyone in the family and friends. She ended up having a nervous breakdown and chronic depression...became a real basket case.

Charities and good will aside, as well as the innocence of his daughter, Kobe was a rapist....nothing changes that.

You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear and you can't make a Saint out of Kobe Bryant.

You could apply that same logic to the dufus who was accused of raping his wife until she recanted her story. He didn't apologize either, to any female he was accused of assaulting of which there were many.

Apologizing for something you didn't do? UNNATURAL! A man should never apologize for something he did not do. To apologize connotes guilt as charged.

I agree and he is presumed innocent until proved guilty in a court of law in which this didn't go to. He never apologized for raping her and admits he had consensual sex. Opinions don't really matter now do they? He may not be a saint, but neither is he a rapist.

Point is that NO MAN will apologize for something they didn't do....and they won't pay-out for an infringement that they didn't commit.

This world is really fouled-up and you only have to look at how MANY abroad and HERE, IN THE U.S., attempted to soften the facts and present an IRANIAN TERRORIST as a DECENT GUY...and this guy was responsible for killing U.S. Servicemen! So, if a portion of society will go to that length, which means suspension of all moral code, then I guess its not too much of a stretch to think that they would elevate a rapist into a good guy figure. The Laws Of Affinity can extrapolate any desirable outcome. We really are sheep to be led to conclusions.