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That's an exaggeration of the liberal position Tom, and while you think it's not your position to be an absolutist, what would you call your reaction to legal guns being used in mass killings of innocent men, women, AND children?
Exactly which mass shooting was NOT with a legally purchased and registered gun?Quote:
You think I'm an absolutist ....I am not . But I know that in the most controlled states ,illegal guns are still used in crimes ;while registered guns are not .
hillarious ;the bumpstock was approved by the Obama ATF so the handicapped would have an easier time firing a gun. Even though they knew it turned semi-auto into defacto automatic weapons ,they did nothing to changed the regulations to ban them as other automatic weapons had been banned since the 1930s and again in 1986 .
Other cases were guns legally purchased by a mom and illegally used by a psycho kid ;and another case where a psycho kid obtained them because the vaunted regulators dropped the ball.
Oh yeah and there was that case in Fort Hood where a jihadist went on a shooting rampage at a base where the military was not permitted to carry their firearms . It was called 'work place violence ' by the emperor .
The question isn't really the rate of fire, it is the killing power of the weapon that has made these mass shootings so deadly. Why do the handicapped need automatic weapons, some falsehoods there.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Hilarious ;the bumpstock was approved by the Obama ATF so the handicapped would have an easier time firing a gun. Even though they knew it turned semi-auto into defacto automatic weapons ,they did nothing to changed the regulations to ban them as other automatic weapons had been banned since the 1930s and again in 1986 .
What's stopping them NOW?
Other cases were guns legally purchased by a mom and illegally used by a psycho kid ;and another case where a psycho kid obtained them because the vaunted regulators dropped the ball.
Yeah we can't do a thing about psycho's and criminals can we?
Oh yeah and there was that case in Fort Hood where a jihadist went on a shooting rampage at a base where the military was not permitted to carry their firearms . It was called 'work place violence ' by the emperor .
Naw, he was a psycho too, like all the rest floated below the radar, and snuck a legal handgun illegally unto a military base because anybody could have with bases being so open. You can't tell the difference between a jihadist and a criminal, only the politics separates them. He was an officer in the military....an American.
So your solution is the same as Trumps... condolences and prayers... and excuses why NOTHING changes even when a loony shoots up elected law makers.
bump stock will be banned . Even the NRA has spoken in favor of it . It wasn't that long ago that kids were bringing their guns to school and having target practice after school. There were no where's near as many restrictions and there were less gun violence. So you tell me what changed. Guns are harder to get for people who are responsible gun owners and just as easy as ever for criminals to obtain.
It's not a matter of what has changed but what hasn't changed, sooner or later the public has to realise that mass shootings for the sake of preserving some imagined liberty isn't worth it, absolute liberty is tyranny, in this case the tyranny of the gun and the mindless idiots who think they have a right to kill in the name of some mindless ideologyQuote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
The Australian model looks better all the time doesn't it? Clete may be surprised at the number of legal guns floating around but the absence of record mass shootings has to be a great trade off. What has changed? Look around you and see all the uncertainty and lack of equal treatment as well as the trauma of wars that have lasted for decades now, and the economic upheaval that has disrupted lives all over the country. Add to that the social impact of changes in attitudes and we have a lot of fear, and resentments that have been stoked up for YEARS for political and economic gain, with the influence of special interest money has us all unnerved and reaching for a gun.
While lefties and righties butt heads all the loonies have come out of the woodwork hollering about one thing or another and made for a very unstable country where anything goes. Throw in a few foreign actors all over the world and we have EVERYBODY crazy and afraid of what's next with no relief in sight. Then there is TRUMP, the lying savior of the right wing loonies. Spreading his disruptive crap like a wild fire. the worst hurricane in history that has united the bible thumpers and racist into a lethal witches brew for normal civilized folks to choke on.
Mother Nature ain't helping for sure, and capitalist want MO"MONEY, YO"MONEY. Everybody is pissed off Tom, that's what's changed. Should I go on?
Just a perspective Tal, I have looked around me, freedom is not abridged, no doubt any person with a legitimate reason for owning a gun can possess one, a recent gun amnesty didn't yield huge numbers but what it did yield was interesting. But what our regulation has yielded is that the gun isn't the weapon of choice and while a knife may kill mass murder is rarer than rocking horse manure. You say that has to be worth something and it is worth a great dealQuote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
My perspective is Australia saw a problem and fixed it. You had no NRA to block any logical, common sense solutions either. Boggles my mind how an entity can circumvent the will of the American people. Goes to show the true power of MONEY.
NRA has nothing to do with it... WE have a second amendment RIGHT to be armed.. they did not. What we do have a serious need of is seriously restricting the over abused freedom of speech. After all that is no more sacred than any of the other rights.
That dodge doesn't work since a vast majority of Americans AND NRA members support common sense solutions to the problem of mass murders in this country. The constitution also calls for a well REGULATED militia, so your opposition to that seems patently unconstitutional, and distracting us with that first amendment excuse shows YOU have no common sense solution to offer, which PROVES without a doubt YOU are part of the problem.
And the militia members carry muskets, one bullet every minute.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
If the writers of the Constitution had had any idea about what would be happening in 2017....
Hardly.. since the Democrat are establishing Sanctuary Cities to protect criminals and MS-13 gang Members... thats NOT a Republican thing..Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Laws are ALREADY on the books.. and besides... Criminals don't NEED guns to kill people... that's been abundantly clear to most of the planet since 9/11. Recent news Truscks, knives, cars, etc... improvised explosives a 10 year old can make...
We can't even keep most of the known mentally ill off the streets since the Democrats worked to turn them loose back in the 70's.
Can blame that on guns.. but you can blame that on people who otherwise should #1. Not be in this country, or #2 Should have been in a mental health facility, or #3 Should have still been in jail for other crimes they have committed.
Can't lay blame on the NRA... those are almost all part and parcel to Democrats policy and agenda for a long time.
I think they did have an idea that things would get more complicated with new innovations, and changing attitudes. They also wrote "ALL men are created equal" while slavery was the norm.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Hardly.. since the Democrat are establishing Sanctuary Cities to protect criminals and MS-13 gang Members... that's NOT a Republican thing..
That's your twisted version of the truth. Sanctuary Cities protect the ordinary people who are NOT criminals and gangsters from the right wing loonies and inhuman policies.
Laws are ALREADY on the books.. and besides... Criminals don't NEED guns to kill people... that's been abundantly clear to most of the planet since 9/11. Recent news Truscks, knives, cars, etc... improvised explosives a 10 year old can make...
Should the law include protection against crazy homicidal maniacs? Why are YOU protecting THEM?
We can't even keep most of the known mentally ill off the streets since the Democrats worked to turn them loose back in the 70's.
Republicans control ALL branches of government NOW!! What's the SOLUTION?
Can blame that on guns.. but you can blame that on people who otherwise should #1. Not be in this country, or #2 Should have been in a mental health facility, or #3 Should have still been in jail for other crimes they have committed.
Can't lay blame on the NRA... those are almost all part and parcel to Democrats policy and agenda for a long time.
Republicans control ALL branches of government NOW!! What's the SOLUTION?
All the Needed laws are already on the books.. its the retards in Democratically controlled areas that are choosing to NOT enforce existing laws.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
First off you CAN'T commit someone against their will unless it can be PROVEN they pose a threat to themselves and others.. legal precident on that practically REQUIRES they have done something before that can be established. Liberals feel the criminally insane have a greater right to freedom than the law abiding public has to be protected from them... one of those you can't have it both ways situations.
Every Illegal has already broken laws to get here, if they were working, add a few more laws they broke, if they weren't working they were stealing money making even more laws they were breaking... that makes them a criminal. Many if not most MS-13 gang member are illegals.. and even ones that did immigrate broke laws and can have that citizenship revoked, or green cards revoked. But Liberals are protecting them. That's a fact.. and no twisting anything.
Chicago... More people get killed in any given week than happened in Las Vegas... Liberals are happy about that because they don't get upset about it. THey have unconstitutional draconian gun laws there... lot of good that does anyone there... the law abiding citizens effectively aren'y allowed to legally protect themselves and their families from the thugs. Another fact that doesn't require twisting...
So you have NO solution for the homicidal loony with a gun.
do you have any for the homicidal looney in a truck, in a car, with a knife... mixing up chemicals?Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
If there was National Reciprocity laws for Conceal carry under the SAME pretext other states have to recognize Drivers license, School transcripts etc...many if not most can be severely limited....but you will never stop every loon out there. A baseball bat, shovel, 2x4 almost anything can become a weapon.
I'll take my chances with guy wielding a bat or shovel or 2x4. Especially if he's on the 32nd floor of a hotel. Or if I'm in a crowd of 22,000 people.
Good luck if you are in a crowd on the ground.. you won't even see him coming with the truck until its too late. Ask the people in Madrid, France or London.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
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