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Originally Posted by excon

Hello again,

So, NO answers?? Just more complaints, huh? Figured.

excon

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First off the only way we are going to save anything is to start with the basics.

1) Find something - anything that can be agreed on and start there.

2) Stop spending so much money.

3) Actually form a budget that takes in more then it spends.

I know Im dreaming but this country is in the worst shape it has been in during my lifetime.

So you think the solution relies on politicians being responsible and being signed on to the big picture, good luck with that

Hello dad:

You get it. I don't disagree with anything you said.

excon

I think the nation will continue but I think the pendulum has swung very far to the left and there will need to be an adjustment. We have already lost one of the pillars of democracy which is a balanced, free press. It was not balanced in our early founding years - it was riddled with lies and propaganda. Hopefully we will see the wisdom of demanding more of our media as happened a century and a half ago, and raise the bar again.

Hopefully we will also see the folly of overlooking the balance of powers. Our current president, whether you support him or not, has flouted the boundaries of his role. Bush steamrolled over the Geneva Conventions, Obama continued it. So - we will need to put each branch of our government back in their own role. Obama is the most politically divisive President in my lifetime. Whether his policies are good, this divisiveness is a hazard.

I think the greatest danger to our government is when we fall in love with our leadership and idolize any members thereof. This is a hallmark of every repressive government in history - always starts that way. The love for Obama is really strange. I see that people will support their candidate, but the level of infatuation is a new thing in the modern American era and is dangerous.

And Fr. Is right - when we eliminate all sense of faith and morals from our nation, we loose the point. The idea in founding of our nation was to permit everyone to openly practice their religion without fear of reprisals. Many misunderstand this foundation and think that our government and nation must be atheistic. The growing intolerance for Christianity in particular is very concerning. It is one of many signs that we are turning on our history and ourselves.

We need tolerance combined with a common ethic and we are throwing away the ethic, and tolerating only those on the edges of society.

Hello don't:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.. I've heard that right wing claptrap before. That isn't what this post is about. I COULD complain about the right wing, like you and Steve do about the left, but that ISN'T what this post is about.

I'm looking for SOLUTIONS, if there are any. I KNOW what the complaints are.

excon

The solution ex is consensus, each side compromising until agreement is reached and then abiding by the result

Hello clete:

That's it? All we have to do is agree? Well, shut my mouth. How come I didn't think of that?

excon

Wa'll ex tis cause you ain't aducated in group thunkin, y'all want it your ainway or the highway. When's the last time you called the nation together to tell the Prassidant what he ought to do? No, you let him tell you what you ought to do and it don't come out right.

You see you got it all backwards, the executive is about getting things done, the legislature is about deciding what should be done, and the courts, well, they is just along for the ride

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Originally Posted by dontknownuthin

Many misunderstand this foundation and think that our government and nation must be atheistic. The growing intolerance for Christianity in particular is very concerning. It is one of many signs that we are turning on our history and ourselves.

We need tolerance combined with a common ethic and we are throwing away the ethic, and tolerating only those on the edges of society.

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It has happened before and we have the example in Nazi Germany of one possible outcome, in that case those on the edges of society were the victims. It is the inevitiable outcome that they must find a scapegoat and usually it is the one who says we don't like your agenda. The Christains have always said no to abortion and homosexuality, so now they are targets of scorn in a society in which anything goes

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Originally Posted by excon

Hello clete:

That's it? All we have to do is agree?? Well, shut my mouth. How come I didn't think of that??

excon

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The reason you didn't think of it is probably because you realized that it isn't the solution to the problem.

Unfortunately the ability to compromise may have nothing to do with healing divisions. It depends on the disagreement, but most political compromises come out of necessity. The divisions still remain as large as ever. As I said in an earlier post, most divisions run a lot deeper than politics... it seems no one was interested in that avenue.

Tut

Come on Tut they don't know that, you give them too much credit, they haven't though about compromise

Yes we have... our history is full of examples of compromise . The current impasses will be solved the same way.

H'mmmmm!

Here's the great divide according to a new Gallup poll. 27% of Republicans/leaners have a negative image of the federal government, while 75% of Democratsa/leaners have a positive image of federal government. 53% of Dems also have a positive view of socialism.

http://sas-origin.onstreammedia.com/...wy71vegriw.gif

Not quite sure how 88% of Dems can reconcile having a positive view of free enterprise and 84% of entrepreneurs based on these numbers, but there you have it in a nutshell. Dems LOVE big government. Personally I think they just don't want to take responsibility for anything except how to spend my money.

Hello again, Steve:

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Not quite sure how 88% of Dems can reconcile having a positive view of free enterprise and 84% of entrepreneurs based on these numbers,

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That's probably because Democrats UNDERSTAND what socialism IS and we don't demonize the word like you wingers do. You know that we have PLENTY of socialism built into our system, and it works FINE. You know, things like your police and fire departments, the military, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, your local ER for example.. Stuff like that...

And, because they LIKE stuff like that, doesn't mean AT ALL that they don't also like capitalism. They seem to work together pretty good.

Excon

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Originally Posted by excon

Hello again, Steve:

That's probably because Democrats UNDERSTAND what socialism IS and we don't demonize the word like you wingers do. You know that we have PLENTY of socialism built into our system, and it works FINE. You know, things like your police and fire departments, the military, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, your local ER for example.. Stuff like that...

And, because they LIKE stuff like that, doesn't mean AT ALL that they don't also like capitalism. They seem to work together pretty good.

excon

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Only 55% like capitalism. The larger point I put in bold letters, 75% LOVE big government while only 27% of Republicans have a positive view of the federal government. It's not any better understanding of anything it's a mindset, I want to take care of myself and my family and help out where I can - PERSONALLY.

You want government to take care of everyone via legalized theft and I think that's not only LAZY but HARMFUL to the very ones you think you're protecting. Not to mention the damage it does to the country and our freedoms.

And by the way, the military, police and fire are socialist, they are not part of the production and distribution segment of our economy. And when you guys get done with it the INSURANCE I paid for in SS and Medicare will be gone.

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Originally Posted by speechlesstx

You want government to take care of everyone via legalized theft and I think that's not only LAZY but HARMFUL to the very ones you think you're protecting. Not to mention the damage it does to the country and our freedoms.

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So you're against "police and fire departments, the military, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, your local ER for example"?

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

So you're against "police and fire departments, the military, Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, your local ER for example"?

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Did you not even bother to read my last answer?

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Originally Posted by speechlesstx

Did you not even bother to read my last answer?

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Yes, I even quoted it in my response.

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Yes, I even quoted it in my response.

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Well you obviously missed the point. Police, FD and military are not part of the production and distribution segment of our economy, i.e. it is not socialism to have police, fire departments and an army. They are government SERVICES, and in the case of police and fire and ERs they are LOCAL concerns. Many fire departments are VOLUNTEER, some actually charge for services.

SS and Medicare are insurance policies I'm paying for which big government is squandering. I would much rather have been able to decide where my money went towards my retirement.