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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

NY Times op-ed clears up 'Defund the police' confusion: 'Yes, we mean literally abolish the police'


https://www.foxnews.com/media/ny-tim...ish-the-police

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One voice in that piece:

"Anti-criminalization activist Mariame Kaba attempted to settle the debate with the op-ed, "Yes, we mean literally abolish the police ... The only way to diminish police violence is to reduce contact between the public and the police."

I disagree. Better vetting, psychological testing, and training would go a long way to solve the problem.

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Better vetting, psychological testing, and training would go a long way to solve the problem.

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That might be, and I think it's a valid enough point, but my understanding is that many PD's around the country are having trouble just finding even fairly good candidates. Numbers are a problem, and all of this anti-police rhetoric will not make it any better.

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They are using a mis-understood word. By "defunding" is meant defunding non-police activities and put them to mental health workers or social workers. One has actually promoted dismantling the police and starting over. She is a victim of her enthusiasm.

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ask All Out Crazy if she thinks she is being misunderstood when she talks about defunding . Ask the protesters at CHAZistan what they mean by defunding . WE in NY went through this crap in the 70s . NYC was unlivable .

The way I see it ,the elected officials are embracing this because they know that they are going to be on shoe string budgets for a long time . Sandinista Bill wants to cut a billion dollars from the police budget . What he isn't telling you is that besides the lining of his wife's pockets ,that money is not going to shift to so called social services .

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I disagree. Better vetting, psychological testing, and training would go a long way to solve the problem.

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aint going to happen . All these municipalities police forces have the same public unions that keep predator teachers in rubber rooms for decades rather than getting rid of them .

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

That might be, and I think it's a valid enough point, but my understanding is that many PD's around the country are having trouble just finding even fairly good candidates. Numbers are a problem, and all of this anti-police rhetoric will not make it any better.

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Then PR also needs to be improved (especially with visits to and encouragement of high school and college students) with more hiring of PoC and women.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

ask All Out Crazy if she thinks she is being misunderstood when she talks about defunding

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AOC is a young woman who is very bright and very dedicated. In her early 30s I look for her to mature over the years - years in which she is almost guaranteed to be re-elected considering her constituency (my 'hood growing up).

An effective fund raiser, she has excellent leadership qualities which is a commodity sorely needed in Congress.

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The way I see it

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We all see it the way we see it. Time will tell.

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All these municipalities police forces have the same public unions that keep predator teachers in rubber rooms for decades rather than getting rid of them .

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Not all have the same, but unions have become a problem in the way some see no evil when their members are bad actors. This is especially true of the police unions. Another hurdle for good people to overcome. Nobody is saying it will be easy.

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Not all have the same, but unions have become a problem in the way some see no evil when their members are bad actors. This is especially true of the police unions. Another hurdle for good people to overcome. Nobody is saying it will be easy.

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it is public union collective bargaining that brought us policies that purge personnel records of police misconduct. So they are the enemy of transparency .Do you think the AFL CIO will drop them ? Nah they will defend them.

That leads to the question .... will the Democrats that are the big beneficiary of public unions largess demand these reforms . doubtful .Lip service and deflection is all you will see of this reform movement once the protests peter down and they can deflect blame on Trump.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

That leads to the question .... will the Democrats that are the big beneficiary of public unions largess demand these reforms

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No. It will be like shooting themselves in the foot. To repeat, I never said it would be easy. Maybe a start with Citizens United would be in order.

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they can deflect blame on Trump.

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Trump needs no deflection of blame. He gets all he needs just by being Trump.

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Then PR also needs to be improved (especially with visits to and encouragement of high school and college students) with more hiring of PoC and women.

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How's the PR looking right now?

Big difference between AFL-CIO, and a cops union. One is armed to the teeth and the authority to arrest and kill!

nope all police unions are affiliated with the AFL-CIO . AFL-CIO could drop the police unions in a second if they had real concerns about the police unions creating policies that protect cops who abuse their authority . They won't and the Dems who benefit from public union $$$$$$$$$ won't press it .

A distinction with a difference Tom, and we just don't know where this will go if public sentiments fueled by more "isolated" incidences keep happening. Not restricted to just cops either any more, and such outrage is as justified as the cruelties and atrocities that started them and keep it going.

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such outrage is as justified

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That's a really questionable statement. People were outraged in the Michael Brown incident. Stores were burned. Property was destroyed and lives were negatively effected, only to find out that the cop was actually in the right. And that was by no means an isolated incident. Remember Tawana Brawley and the innocent detective whose life was destroyed???

How about all those lives affected when the cops were wrong? Or those that witnessed those atrocities on tape, or worse, all the ones affected that weren't caught on tape? I mean terrorized and brutalized for jaywalking on a street with NO sidewalk???*

*See other thread.

In Atlanta we have video proof of a felony assault on a police officer while resisting arrest ;stealing an officer’s taser weapon and pointing the taser at officers & firing it at officers.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

In Atlanta we have video proof of a felony assault on a police officer while resisting arrest ;stealing an officer’s taser weapon and pointing the taser at officers & firing it at officers.

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What would have happened if he had been white?

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What would have happened if he had been white?

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I gave you the stats already . Other than that I can't answer a hypothetical .

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Originally Posted by tomder55

In Atlanta we have video proof of a felony assault on a police officer while resisting arrest ;stealing an officer’s taser weapon and pointing the taser at officers & firing it at officers.

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Tasers aren't lethal weapons, and they knew he was drunk, unarmed, and until the cuffs came out cooperative. None of those is a reason to shoot the dude in the back twice. They had his car and ID, and knew where he lived (Down the street). Now the officer gets charged, dude is dead and that Wendy's is burnt. A phone call to his wife or relative would have made a big difference in that outcome.

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Originally Posted by tomder55

In Atlanta we have video proof of a felony assault on a police officer while resisting arrest ;stealing an officer’s taser weapon and pointing the taser at officers & firing it at officers.

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You left out the fact that the man was running away and was shot twice in the back, killing him. There's video proof of that also. It's called felony murder.

And we certainly appreciate your support of the local police.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

And we certainly appreciate your support of the local police.

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Unlike you, I don't support murderers.