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Hello T:
Not in the USA. If we did, then we wouldn't NEED Obamacare.. But, WITHOUT insurance, I'm afraid THIS girl would DIE.Quote:
Does anyone manage to get free medical attention and free medication if they don't have insurance and don't have any money?
Excon
This was explained to you in detail if you cared to read the Steve Brill article in Time magazine about not for profit hospitals making money hand over fist with a mark up system often 10,000 times over the costs from aspirin to surgery gowns.Quote:
“The requirements generally apply to any section 501(c)(3) organization that operates at least one hospital facility,”
Let me ask you then why you think the church run hospitals are exempt from the standards that hospitals everywhere have to comply with, and document the charity work they do. If they are doing all the charity work they and you claim, what's the problem?
If not, why are they exempt? Its simple Speech you cannot be a charity and have a few charity cases and then make big profits off insurance work. I know some churches already actively seek out people to help and should be commended for it, but a few do not yet reap the benefit of huge profits and no taxes.
To exes question about the poor girl with Crohns Disease getting care under Obama Care it depends what state she is in because as you know Republican governors are opting out of the Medicaid expansion, and yes Texas is one so I hope she isn't one of those millions that will fall between the cracks.
What world are you living in when its law they can receive treatment ?Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Emergency Medical Treatment and Active Labor ActEMTALA), passed in 1986 at the request of President Ronald Reagan.
Hello again, tal:
THIS is one of the areas where Obama COULD have explained it better... There is STILL major MISUNDERSTANDING about this... From what I understand, and I'm as ignorant about the law as anybody, Texas, along with other right wing states, refused to set up STATE exchanges where their residents could buy health insurance... BUT, the FEDS have exchanges that aren't as good, but STILL offer the benefits of Obamacare to EVERYBODY... Everybody, no matter where you live, will benefit from Obamacare..Quote:
as you know Republican governors are opting out of the Medicaid expansion, and yes Texas is one so I hope she isn't one of those millions that will fall between the cracks.
Now, I could be wrong.. I was wrong once last year..
Excon
Here's the rub ex, sure the feds will set up exchanges and Texas has many options in that regard that's true, but Medicaid expansion is a different animal that only deals with the poor who are covered under Medicaid. Typically that's define as a percentage of income over the poverty level,
This link can explain it better than I could,
States forgo billions in federal cash by opting out of Medicaid expansion - Jul. 1, 2013
Factor out the LEFT wing spin, and it's a lot of poor people will get screwed, some will die.Quote:
What happens to impoverished citizens in states that don't expand? The most likely answer is that they'll slip through the cracks and remain without health insurance.
Some of these folks will be eligible for subsidies to buy individual health insurance on state-based exchanges. But those with income below the poverty line cannot receive subsidies, because the Affordable Care Act intended for them to be covered through Medicaid. If their state opts out, they're stranded. (They also will not be subject to financial penalties for not having insurance. Those penalties begin at $95 per adult in 2014 and increase in later years.)
As it stands now, an estimated 11.5 million uninsured, non-elderly, poor adults live in states that have opted out, according to research from the Urban Institute.
State officials can change their mind and join the Medicaid expansion in the future. But next year, many poor Americans will not be able to participate in Obamacare. "They are giving up significant federal funding and the chance to cover their neediest citizens," said Kathy Gifford, managing principal at Health Management Associates, a research and consulting firm.
There has never been a day that I or any conservative I can think of has ever said our health care system was perfect or that people like her don't deserve care so on that we agree and you know that. We just disagree on the solution and thus far Zerocare is proving to be a train wreck. If you deny that after all we've shown by the facts and former supporters, including a principal architect, you aren't being honest. Not only that as shown Obama himself is perpetuating a two-tier system, one for the rulers and one for the rest of us unwashed.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Now, you answer my question. Why is Obama waging a war on the church and since when do we penalize people for being charitable, the exact kind of thing your example could use right now.
They've always denied this fact, everyone gets health care if they seek it.Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
That doesn't even apply to long term care just the bare bones minimum emergency care. The girl with Crohns is a good example of a poor person with no insurance who can't get treatment. Emergency rooms will stabilize her and send her elsewhere, or discharge her out right.
What you think a charity or church will pay for her treatments? SHOW ME. Better yet go to the post and explain to her to go to the emergency room. Guess you didn't notice her issue is with her MEDS.
They get care in my city, I don't know why they can't where you are.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Maybe the city where they live is run by democritics.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Doesn't matter what the city or the politics are most emergency rooms stabilize and won't admit people with no insurance. In Texas they transport you to a county hospital if they can. And you need a physician to admit you. No doctor, no insurance, no admittance except in a county hospital, in Texas. Its part of the triage and obviously you have never been to an emergency room and didn't have insurance.
Stop ignoring the holes in the law by pretending problems like this don't exist.
You really don't want to go there. I'm more familiar with penniless, uninsured people getting health care than I care to remember.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Hello again, Steve:
I'm not familiar with your personal story, but are you saying there ARE people in this country who are denied health care? That's not a right wing position. Right wingers think EVERYBODY gets all the health care they need. Is that NOT true?Quote:
You really don't want to go there. I'm more familiar with penniless, uninsured people getting health care than I care to remember.
Excon
Firstly. You are obviously a very generous and caring person.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Secondly. Going on your example the blight seems to be that there are so many.
But I bet allthese people with no health care... have cell phones.. computers... TV. DVD player... most have game boxes... and most even have more than one car. Nearly all could afford insurance if they gave up some of the dumb things they want so they can afford to buy what they need.
I gave up a LOT of stuff I wanted over the 32 years I've been out of college because I put Medical insurance at the front of the list with rent... car insurance... student loan payments etc...
I've got a good idea. Perhaps they can sell all of these things and by some health care they may never need.Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
Then they shouldn't be getting it free... at all. Because that's how insurance works... you don't wait until after you have a car accident to buy auto insurance... how many people are paying for auto insurance for accidendts they never have?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuttyd
You mean the working poor who work two job to be POOR?Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
I am assuming by, "it" you mean health care. If this is what you are saying then you don't buy auto insurance, you take the chance of not having an accident. If this is what you are saying then I agree. Best that the poor don't own a car and it is also best if they are uninsured in terms of health care.Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
Yes, it all sounds fairly simple to me.
No I'm not saying that at all and you know part of my story. I've witnessed firsthand one of the most precious people in my life get first class care with no money and no insurance... and she still is.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Then they get a third job then... if they got 8 kids they couldn't afford... thats their problem... not mine. Maybe she gets a job other than popping out one kid after another.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Who exactly is "she" in your second sentence?Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
The stay at home mom without a paying job.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuttyd
If "they" get a third job then "she" can't be a stay at home mum without a job.Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
Meanwhile, back to the OP. The emperor has delayed yet another feature of Obamacare, the oh so important feature of capping out of pocket expenses.
I thought Obamacare was supposed to bail us out...Quote:
First, there was the delay of Obamacare’s Medicare cuts until after the election. Then there was the delay of the law’s employer mandate. Then there was the announcement, buried in the Federal Register, that the administration would delay enforcement of a number of key eligibility requirements for the law’s health insurance subsidies, relying on the “honor system” instead. Now comes word that another costly provision of the health law—its caps on out-of-pocket insurance costs—will be delayed for one more year.
According to the Congressional Research Service, as of November 2011, the Obama administration had missed as many as one-third of the deadlines, specified by law, under the Affordable Care Act. Here are the details on the latest one.
Obamacare contains a blizzard of mandates and regulations that will make health insurance more costly. One of the most significant is its caps on out-of-pocket insurance costs, such as co-pays and deductibles. Section 2707(b) of the Public Health Service Act, as added by Obamacare, requires that “a group health plan and a health insurance issuer offering group or individual health insurance coverage may not establish lifetime limits on the dollar value of benefits for the any participant or beneficiary.” Annual limits on cost-sharing are specified by Section 1302(c) of the Affordable Care Act; in addition, starting in 2014, deductibles are limited to $2,000 per year for individual plans, and $4,000 per year for family plans.
Hello again, Steve:
If, like you, I believed that, in this great country of ours, nobody has ever gone without being treated for their ills, or ever would be, then I'd be squealing just like you are.
But, I don't believe that.
excon
I keep posting things like this hoping some day certain among us might see the parallels between their rants and the administration they defend.
Hello again, Steve:
Ok, what's YOUR plan? If it's to go back to what we had, as flawed as Obamacare is, it's BETTER than that.
excon
Scrap it all and start over.
Hello again, Steve:
If we did, would you STILL say that we don't need it because, in THIS great land, EVERYBODY gets treated? And, if you WOULD say that, then once it's scrapped, the "start over" crap you're spewing, isn't something you intend to do, is it?Quote:
Scrap it all and start over.
Excon
No it would not be feasible or advisable to scrap it all. But your question has been answered many times.
Hello again, Steve:What would you keep, and how would you pay for it?Quote:
No it would not be feasible or advisable to scrap it all.
Excon
I'd keep it private.
Hello again, Steve:
In other words what we had PRE Obamacare, and you wouldn't keep ANYTHING in the ACA...Quote:
I'd keep it private.
Excon
Oh yeah, I'd scrap Zerocare completely and keep health care private. I don't trust our federal government and thus far they've proven to be mostly incompetent at most everything, including and especially the ACA.
If your goal is better, affordable health care for everyone let's work together. But that isn't your goal, you want single payer and nothing less so what's to discuss? In the meantime we've been sold a bill of goods, a train wreck that was designed to fail and so far the only ones being left in the lurch here are the consumers.
You have had your chance over the years and decades to make things better, but you didn't. Not my fault you righties prefer to be exploited by the inure industry but you can if you want to, just keep what you got and be happy.
Oh that's right, they till kept jacking the price up before Obama Care, and during. What, are you afraid to tell the insurance companies enough already? Sure you are.
Things were better before Al Gore dreamed up HMO's. That's when all the middlemen started the money grab that has nothing to do with delivering health care to the pattient. And inflates the costs of everything.
Before that costs were lower because the patient paid the doctor... there wasn't 50 other people expecting their cut .
Time for an Obamacare experiment. Go to your favorite search engine and search for health insurance exchanges. Let me know which ones aren't legit.
The ones that I have looked up are spin offs of the major regional/local carriers from what I have seen. I have only checked Oregon, Utah, California, New York, and of course Texas.
Even the so called independent plans are underwritten by a larger insurance GROUP.
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