Ask Me Help Desk - Democrat aversion to reality

I live in Texas where 25% of the population is uninsured and know for fact that those 25% go to the state subsidized COUNTY ER's that gets its reimbursements from the federal government already.

Texas hospitals are scrambling as we speak to expand the Medicaid roles while the state is opting out of the federal matching dollars outlined in Obama Care. This has led to hospitals trying to make up for lost revenue.

Medicaid waiver | Denton Record Chronicle | News for Denton County, Texas from

Directive may affect hospitals

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Steve Love, president and CEO of the Dallas-Fort Worth Hospital Council, a group that works with 80 hospitals in North Texas, said the waiver is creating two funding pools: an uncompensated care pool — costs of care provided to individuals who don't have Medicaid funds; and delivery system reform incentive payments.

Texas has the potential to receive up to $29 billion over the five years of the waiver, which is more than the $14 billion in funds that are available under the upper payment limits program, according to the Texas Hospital Association's website.

Translation- If the state won't do it hospitals will. Why won't the state do it?

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Originally Posted by J_9

I totally beg to differ. People with "government insurance" use the ER as a clinic. I can even pinpoint what days and times they use it. I would also like to point out that they have learned how to work the system so that they don't have to wait hours. They come in with complaints of chest pain, they come in with complaints of shortness of breath. They know that these complaints will get them seen within 10 minutes of arrival.

You don't experience the system, but I do.

Ask the expert on the frontlines

Are you saying they don't have medical issues and are just goofing off? Why do you think they come to the ER and not see a doctor?

Quote:

Originally Posted by excon

Hello again, Steve:
Buck up Righty.. You're SCREWING people as bad as you think we're screwing you..

Sniveling doesn't help.

excon

Really? Hear is a news flash for you. Obamacare is going to ruin things as we know it. Many are barely making it and living paycheck to paycheck and are now mandated to pay yet another bill. The extra costs of Obamacare is about shifting responsibility from government hands since they want to spend it in other ways and shoving up the publics butt. Talk about a big time screwing. Anyone responsible for child support may not be able to live after this fully rolls in.

That's not true since 85% of us already pay that other bill, AND for the 15% that don't/or won't. But you hit on the root cause of most peoples woes, that paycheck hasn't grown in a long time, but the bills sure have.

That's great logic, our paychecks haven't grown so let's stick people for another few hundred bucks a month. Do you really not think about what you're saying?

If you cannot grasp the concept of what I write that's too bad. In simple terms, you have already been a victim of gouging as have we all, yet you cannot see it, but blame the easy target, and not the true target, and that's the broken business model that has failed us in the time of need.

Tal, stop pretending we're stupid and you know what's best for us. Your logic is illogical and we know when we're getting hosed in spite of your bullsh*t.

You were getting hosed long before this administration came along. Or the last. Crap is hitting the fan and a logical plan is needed aimed at the root cause of the problem. You ain't got enough money to meet the rising cost of every damn thing.

More of your logic, because we were getting hosed before we should just shut the hell up and enjoy getting hosed even worse?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wondergirl

The point of young people getting health insurance is that those insured young people will then get those periodic exams they don't want to pay out of pocket for now as uninsureds. They will do the preventive dance (or at least have the coverage to do it) to guard their health and not end up with prostate cancer or breast cancer or some catastrophic illness that they have ignored symptoms of and that will cost us (i.e., Medicaid) tons of money when they show up uninsured at the ER.

The point of young people getting health insurance is to dilute the universe of the insured so that premiums are reduced.

The young, insured or not insured, don't get preventive exams.

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Originally Posted by Athos

The young, insured or not insured, don't get preventive exams.

I should have added that "The hope is that..." We all know most won't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Athos

The point of young people getting health insurance is to dilute the universe of the insured so that premiums are reduced.

The young, insured or not insured, don't get preventive exams.

They will when they are no longer young and dumb and priorities change. I didn't get many check ups in my younger years either, and had insurance. Time changed that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by talaniman

They will when they are no longer young and dumb and priorities change. I didn't get many check ups in my younger years either, and had insurance. Time changed that.

Preventative medicine is something pushed by the profession, and whilst it may show up a problem, the general population doesn't need to spend unnecessary time in a doctor's office. Pathology (tests) has been one of the greatest ripoffs perpetrated on a gulliable public and has escalated medical costs for no other reason than covering the doctor's backside in a litageous society

Quote:

Originally Posted by talaniman

They will when they are no longer young and dumb and priorities change. I didn't get many check ups in my younger years either, and had insurance. Time changed that.

I guess that's why they have to sell it as "hosurance."

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BY4367DCEAEyALI.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by talaniman

They will when they are no longer young and dumb and priorities change. I didn't get many check ups in my younger years either, and had insurance. Time changed that.

That will be too late to affect premiums. I think you may have missed my point.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Athos

That will be too late to affect premiums. I think you may have missed my point.

I didn't miss your point. Why would a young person that's pre prime, even be interested in health insurance? Or twice a year check ups? Add to that all the hollering and screaming, gloom and doom?

We'll see in 6 months won't we?

Why would anyone WANT to increase their premiums, deductibles, copays, out of pockets and decrease their choice of physicians?

Quote:

Originally Posted by speechlesstx

Why would anyone WANT to increase their premiums, deductibles, copays, out of pockets and decrease their choice of physicians?

Now that is the essential question, isn't it? Could this be an unintended consequence of listening to the insurance companies and lobbyists, could this be the consequence of a market that is being regulated in the wrong way? or could it be the consequence of restructuring the market to open it to a larger number of participants who present a broader risk profile?

Could this be the unintended consequence of a lie? Could this be the unintended consequence of ramming sh*t through without knowing what was in it? Could this be the result of incompetence? You tell me what it is.

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Originally Posted by paraclete

Now that is the essential question, isn't it? Could this be an unintended consequence of listening to the insurance companies and lobbyists, could this be the consequence of a market that is being regulated in the wrong way? or could it be the consequence of restructuring the market to open it to a larger number of participants who present a broader risk profile?

Here is what it is. The true fact that no one was ever denied healthcare is true. And for those seeking insurance with pre existing they did have a place to go to through the states they lived in that offered expanded form of medicaid. Now with Obamacare they are taking those that have been on medicaid rolls and push them into private insurance. The money that they were spending on medicaid will go to suppliment premiums because they are going through the roof. But there is a cut off to getting a supplement. So while the new law purports to make things cheaper they really arent when you add the supplement. Also with Obamacare they are creating a brand new dependent class of people to scare when it comes election time. Its all down to simple politics and money. And the poorest of the poor are going to be hit the hardest.

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The true fact that no one was ever denied healthcare is true.

The question isn't whether a person is denied health care, but whether they have the ability to access it.

It would appear that a number of people have been denied care by an insurer for various reasons so this "true fact" you speak of may be true and therefore a fact, or false which is the more likely scenario.

Quote:

Originally Posted by speechlesstx

More of your logic, because we were getting hosed before we should just shut the hell up and enjoy getting hosed even worse?

The reason you are getting "hosed worse" is because you are paying the price for historical health inequality. It makes little difference as to who provides the health care. Historically, this has predominately been the private health care system and this system is fine so long as is capable of addressing the problem of equity. But is hasn't.

In other words, the system is too inflexible to monitor and address the problem of inequality. Inequality in terms of health over time means that it becomes increasingly difficult for more and more sections of society to access health care that is satisfactory. A typical example, would be Tom's scenario whereby young people need make a choice between health care and lifestyle.

You are being forced to undergo a revolution in health care as a direct result of the historical inability to address the ongoing problem of equity because of the problem of the increasing problem of inequality.

Quote:

Originally Posted by paraclete

The question isn't whether a person is denied health care, but whether they have the ability to access it.

It would appear that a number of people have been denied care by an insurer for various reasons so this "true fact" you speak of may be true and therefore a fact, or false which is the more likely scenario.

It is not false at all. What I had said is that some were denied insurance through the private system and then went to the government sponsored system for their healthcare insurance (a form of medicare at the State level).

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Originally Posted by cdad

It is not false at all. What I had said is that some were denied insurance through the private system and then went to the government sponsored system for their healthcare insurance (a form of medicare at the State level).

I took your meaning to be different, you are saying that everyone can access a doctor and a hospital and the cost will be met. I don't think that is a fact otherwise there would be no need for the ACA. as far as I am aware the problem was/is that people could not meet their health care costs, either because coverage was denied by insurers, or because they lacked the financial ability to have insurance and could not meet the costs

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdad

Here is what it is. The true fact that no one was ever denied healthcare is true. And for those seeking insurance with pre existing they did have a place to go to through the states they lived in that offered expanded form of medicaid. Now with Obamacare they are taking those that have been on medicaid rolls and push them into private insurance. The money that they were spending on medicaid will go to suppliment premiums because they are going through the roof. But there is a cut off to getting a supplement. So while the new law purports to make things cheaper they really arent when you add the supplement. Also with Obamacare they are creating a brand new dependent class of people to scare when it comes election time. Its all down to simple politics and money. And the poorest of the poor are going to be hit the hardest.

Yup.

Your facts are in error and high risk pool insurance is expensive. Don't be a laid off worker and trying to afford cobra, or a state run insurance in a red state, that hasn't expanded Medicaid. And the dirty little secret is that most state insurances are subsidized by the federal government any way. But Nikki Haley, and Rick Perry will never tell you that but just look it up for yourself.

I dare you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by talaniman

Your facts are in error and high risk pool insurance is expensive. Don't be a laid off worker and trying to afford cobra, or a state run insurance in a red state, that hasn't expanded Medicaid. And the dirty little secret is that most state insurances are subsidized by the federal government any way. But Nikki Haley, and Rick Perry will never tell you that but just look it up for yourself.

I dare you.

Ok, here you go. One Red State as requested.

TennCare - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

TennCare

Also when I made my post I did credit the government aide that went with the State program as a expanded form of medicare.

From the site:

In Tennessee, the Pre-Existing Condition Insurance Plan (PCIP) is run by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. The PCIP is designed to make insurance available to those without insurance who have or have had a medical condition, disability or illness. Members of the PCIP must pay monthly premiums. To qualify for coverage you must:
•Be a citizen or national of the United States or lawfully present in the United States.
•Have been uninsured for at least the last six months before applying.
•Have a pre-existing condition or have been denied coverage because of a health condition.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdad

Ok, here you go. One Red State as requested.

TennCare - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

TennCare

Also when I made my post I did credit the government aide that went with the State program as a expanded form of medicare.

From the site:

In Tennessee, the Pre-Existing Condition Insurance Plan (PCIP) is run by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. The PCIP is designed to make insurance available to those without insurance who have or have had a medical condition, disability or illness. Members of the PCIP must pay monthly premiums. To qualify for coverage you must:
•Be a citizen or national of the United States or lawfully present in the United States.
•Have been uninsured for at least the last six months before applying.
•Have a pre-existing condition or have been denied coverage because of a health condition.

yes you see the condition that excludes, pay a monthly premium, the main disqualification from health insurance appears to be the inability to pay among the poor

Quote:

Originally Posted by paraclete

yes you see the condition that excludes, pay a monthly premium, the main disqualification from health insurance appears to be the inability to pay among the poor

And that's what Medicaid is for. Could we not have improved on that instead of hosing 85 percent of the country who liked their health care and weren't imposing on others?

Expansion of Medicare is the improvement to cover more people is the improvements and saves the state billions. Especially in a red state like Texas where a million people have no health insurance.

Unfortunately Red States governors don't want the funds that come with the expansion even though they currently have severely underfunded Medicaid programs. Less choice, less benefits, and higher costs.

Hello again,

The website sunk Obamacare. He did it himself. Why some of you think he'll be given a second chance at it, baffles me.

The end of Obamacare ALSO spells the END of the Democratic party as we know it, the end of universal health care, and the ascendance of Ted Cruz to the presidency.

It's gonna be right wing HEAVEN.

excon

Quote:

Originally Posted by talaniman

Expansion of Medicare is the improvement to cover more people is the improvements and saves the state billions. Especially in a red state like Texas where a million people have no health insurance.

You mean Medicare for all. We don't want your government run health care, why can you not understand that?

Quote:

Less choice, less benefits, and higher costs.

Sounds like what we just got stuck with to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by excon

Hello again,

The website sunk Obamacare. He did it himself. Why some of you think he'll be given a second chance at it, baffles me.

The end of Obamacare ALSO spells the END of the Democratic party as we know it, the end of universal health care, and the ascendance of Ted Cruz to the presidency.

It's gonna be right wing HEAVEN.

excon

The shoddy, incompetent, partisan way it was passed started it. The website disaster compounded it, sticker shock piled on, the habitual lying about it didn't help and when everyone realizes the next sticker shock of higher copays, deductibles and out of pocket and the loss of their doctor that will be all she wrote. But I don't see Cruz as the nominee.

Hello again, Steve:

Quote:

The shoddy, incompetent, partisan way it was passed started it.

Nahhh. It was a simple website. If IT had worked, Obamacare would have worked. The Democrats are fleeing the sinking ship like a bunch of rats.

Yes, I think the picture of Bush looking out the window upon the devastation Katrina wrought, SUNK his second term. I believe this was Obama's watershed moment, and he got caught looking out the window..

I'm like Cronkite, you know.. Once Obama looses me, he's LOST everybody.

excon

There is no basis of fact in your post and the "we" you define is in error. You obviously have not explored the 60 plus plans on your own state website. Nor have you read the link I have provided you to how Texas hospitals are pooling to expand there own programs to advantage the federal dollars for Medicaid that the state doesn't want.

OK, show me the numbers that say "we" want government run health care.

Hello again, Steve:

Quote:

OK, show me the numbers that say "we" want government run health care.

Let's review, shall we?

Bout a year ago we had an election.. It was the LAST time EVERYBODY was counted. One of the candidates said he was gonna repeal Obamacare on his first day.

He LOST, and he lost BIG. "WE" spoke on that day, and "we" spoke LOUDLY!

I dunno WHY you don't think THOSE numbers count.. But, they're the ONLY ones that do..

excon

PS> Look. I gave up the fight. But we didn't lose it because the people didn't want it. They CLEARLY wanted it, your denials notwithstanding. The reason it failed is because of their inability to run a website.

and the fact that "we " were lied to .

Quote:

Originally Posted by excon

Hello again, Steve:
Let's review, shall we?

Bout a year ago we had an election.. It was the LAST time EVERYBODY was counted. One of the candidates said he was gonna repeal Obamacare on his first day.

He LOST, and he lost BIG. "WE" spoke on that day, and "we" spoke LOUDLY!

I dunno WHY you don't think THOSE numbers count.. But, they're the ONLY ones that do..

excon

PS> Look. I gave up the fight. But we didn't lose it because the people didn't want it. They CLEARLY wanted it, your denials notwithstanding. The reason it failed is because of their inability to run a website.

Let's review. Voters did not approve of Obamacare even though they elected him.

I'm not the one in denial.

Poll: Most Look To A Rosier Future - CBS News

Quote:

On the matter of health insurance ... Nearly half of all Americans now want the government to provide it for all problems. That's up from just over a quarter in 1979.

Healthcare-NOW! - Another Poll Shows Majority Support for Single-Payer

Quote:

A New York Times/CBS News poll released last week shows, yet again, that the majority of Americans support national health insurance.

The poll, which compares answers to the same questions from 30 years ago, finds that, “59% [of Americans] say the government should provide national health insurance, including 49% who say such insurance should cover all medical problems.”

Only 32% think that insurance should be left to private enterprise.

The pols reflect what I have been saying. Screw the for profit market based pandering and cut out the middle man.