Rumor has it there's a cute little trojan on all the "us.gov" sites that sets up monitoring your internet connections. Have you got really good Malware protection?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
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Rumor has it there's a cute little trojan on all the "us.gov" sites that sets up monitoring your internet connections. Have you got really good Malware protection?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Are you serious??Quote:
Originally Posted by Catsmine
The rumor exsists because of the way the law reads. The federal government is forbbidin by law to record your IP address without your knowlage.Quote:
Originally Posted by Catsmine
Its not true at all. It's a hoax.
Hello tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Uhhh, no you can't! Because if they can illegally snoop on SOME people, they can snoop illegally on YOU.
The only way to KNOW you're not being spied upon, is if you made sure your government does NOT spy on anybody. But, you're fine with them snooping on some people and you only TRUST that they're not snooping on you...
Me? I don't trust 'em.
excon
Hello again, wingers:
I'm confused. I thought you guys were the ones who're interested in RESTORING the Constitution... I hear that squawk all the time from the tea partiers.. I've even heard the words that smoothy recited about the Constitution NOT being a guideline.
I agree.
Then, in the next breath, as an excuse for violating that very document, you say, well other presidents did it, so it's OK... Therein lies the basis for my confusion. What happened to your "it's not a guideline" schtick?? In fact, not only doesn't it bother you that the Constitution is flouted, you support it 1000%. Then, you have the temerity to talk about restoring the Constitution... I'm blown away..
Now, I'll admit that I don't know if any other president, beside Nixon, illegally spied on us or not, so I'm not going to argue that. It's a red herring anyway. What I DO know is for more than 20 years, it was settled law, born of bitter experience, that the government may not eavesdrop on people in the United States without a warrant.
Until, that is, after the 9/11 attacks, when President George W. Bush ordered the National Security Agency to ignore the law.
Fortunately, a judge of the Federal District Court in San Francisco, ruled last week that the 1978 Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act was the law of the land, and that when Bush failed to get a warrant to wiretap, he broke the law. It's a FELONY.
There are fewer threats to liberty, as the Supreme Court said more than 40 years ago, “greater than that posed by the use of eavesdropping devices.” Being liberty loving patriots, I don't understand why you don't understand that.
excon
Try this. Let me know when you and a friend carry on phony phone conversations about a terrorist activity you two are cooking up, say, to blow up some government building in your area. I'll watch the news.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Happy Easter, Carol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
;)
excon
Happy Easter to you too, my dear friend. Did you hide all the eggs real good this time? ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
There is no logical reason for the government to be listening in to my conversations. In the al -haramain case they were a known funder of AQ and had funded and supported previous attacks on the country .They have since been disbanned by UN sanction . Let's keep this in the real world.
There is absolutely no reason why I would either plot an attack for real or make a punk call faking it.
But if someone is plotting to commit an attack or other act of war on the country I will not lose any sleep at all that the NSA was listening in.
That's why they haven't picked up keywords in your conversations and arrested you. But they're out there and listening.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Here are a few links on the matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Ref:
Electronic Surveillance
NSA warrantless surveillance controversy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Electronic Surveillance Laws
Any other hobgoblins I should be concerned about ? If they are listening in on me they are bored out of their minds. Oh the outrage!
To Ex's point ;the decision by this San Fran judge will be reversed if the Obama Justice Dept is so inclined to challenge it. The judges whole decision was based on a technicallity because both the Obama and Bush Justice Dept deemed the secrets that could've been revealed were worth protecting .
This is a position that Obama took as Senator also :
"This is also the reason why Obama will probably not appeal. He gets to keep the Bush program (Congress amended the law to get rid of any ambiguity about the President's inherent right to spy on the enemy. )while at the same time have the Obots howling at the moon about the "criminal "activities of his predecessor..Quote:
I think it is appropriate to say that there are going to be cases in which national security interests are genuinely at stake, and that you can't litigate without revealing covert activities or classified information that would genuinely compromise our safety. But searching for ways to redact, to carve out certain cases, to see what can be done so that a judge in chambers can review information without it being in open court-you know, there should be some additional tools so that it's not such a blunt instrument."
So nothing will happen to me if my brother and I have phone conversations about bringing down the Sears Tower (ooops, Wilis Tower) in Chicago?Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
There must be a sale on tinfoil hats this week.
Why would you have that conversation ? Are you and your brother employed by some front organization for jihadistan ?
If for some reason they are wasting their time monitoring your phone calls with your brother ,and the topic came up ,they know Shiite from shinola .
Most of the people with their panties in a knot about evesdropping on terrorists are people that were nowhere neer targets on 911.
You won't convince many that work in Manhattan, much less anyone who ever worked in the Twin Towers... and you won't convince anyone who knew people that died... or people that were almost victims themselves.
I fall in that last category. I am still breathing today because I was cranky, hungry and tired that morning.
I don't give a damn if terrorists or anyone they talk to are eavesdropped on... unlike most of the paranoid crowd... I actually know how this is done.
Since I'm not a militia member planning sopmething illegal, because I'm not one of them, I don't have to worry about being overheard replenishing my stash from the local drug dealer because I don't use anything illegal...
And most of the people who are saying things to others that will get them into trouble... also seem to be the same bunch that want to hand of Everyone's medical records to politicians to have them decide who gets a treatment, IF they get it and when they get it... yet doesn't trust them to overhear the very same conversations they have every day IN PUBLIC on their cell phones with dozens around them listening.
And yeah... quite often I can hear BOTH SIDES of those cell phone conversations.
I don't plan illegal stuff either and use my cell phone only at home or in my STOPPED car, and never in public. And the government and my insurance company already have all my personal information.Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
You are in the minority... I see people every day walking out into TAFFIC yapping on their cell phones oblivious to the fact there is a DO NOT WALK sign lit. And yeah... I actually see that at least once a day. Or pass someone yaping about something obviously highly personal on the sidewalk.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
I've actually heard both men and women talking with their lovers ABOUT their spouses... and once even heard them talk about possible pregnacies with their lovers... yeah, its been both men and women and more than twice over the last few years...
Do these people not know others can hear them ON THE SIDEWALK...
Hell once I heard someone giving their credit card info, address, full name, etc... on their cell, at lunchtime walking on the sidewalk with dozens near them.
Hello again, smoothy:Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
So, all your talk about restoring the Constitution, and about it NOT being a guideline, was just so much BUNK.
Let me be clear, if I wasn't already. The tea partiers, the birthers, YOU and/or whatever right wing wacko group you're fronting for, ARE ALL FULL OF CRAP! YOU KNOW NOTHING OTHER THAN WHAT GLENN BECK OR THE LIMP ONE TELL YOU.
Restoring the Constitution, hell. You have NO idea what it's about.
excon
Right... we all know God gave you the gift of knowing everything and being perfect in all possible ways.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
YOU are the one who doesn't have a clue...
And while we all know YOU have a Obama Poster you worship every night... MOST of the American Public is on to his scam.
And we also know that the Constitution was written in plain english... by Men who were very smart.
Not by today's democrats who twist every word to mean its opposite.
Why don't you grow up already...
You are seriously delusional iif you believe even 10% of what Obama says or 95% of what the DNC says... or anything at all Nancy Pelosi says. You obviously believe 100% of what they say... otherwise why do you get your panties in such a knot when those of us know better won't.
And incidentally... I've spent most of my life the last 25 years in and around communications offices of government offices, military instalations and Embassies (of over 40 countries) in two countries on two continents.
Not in PODUNK IOWA listening to CNN to get my information of there outside world.
And these people have given their young children cell phones "for emergencies." Sexting has become a huge problem among teens and even preteens. Where or where is this country going, smoothy? (At least we agree on ONE thing!)Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
Oh yeah... and there is THAT.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Imagine a unsuspecting father that loans his phone to his kid... and they do that... and well, you see where that's going legally.
I am FAR from being a prude... but heck, what ARE these kids thinking. They HAVE to understand once its out there... its out there, and will always be.
Hello again,
George Bush merely eavesdropped and/or detained American citizens without due process rights. I complained loudly about that stuff. My protestations, however, were disparaged on these boards. You supported Bush, when he claimed the powers of a King.
Yet here you have Barack Obama not merely eavesdropping on/and detaining American citizens without oversight, but ordering them killed with no oversight and no due process of any kind.
That ain't going to fly with me. But, I'll bet you righty's love it... If only it weren't coming from HIM.. How do you reconcile that?
excon
Are you talking about the order to wack Anwar al-Awlaki who is overseas waging war against the United States ? Yeah I say go go for it.
Does it matter where the "battle field " is in this war when one day it is in AfPakia ,the next in Yemen ;the next on a flight to Detroit ,or some diplomat testing our defenses by having a smoke in an airliner lavatory ?
This cleric is actively recruting jihadists to kill Americans . I don't care if he is an American citizen .As far as I'm concerned his citizenship should be revoked
Hello tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
You mistake my support for the Constitution and the Rule of Law to be support for our enemy. I understand the knee jerking. So did the founders. That's why they wrote the Bill of Rights.
I'm just like you. MY knee jerks too. But, I'm willing to let my knee jerk get filtered through the Constitution. Right wingers, like yourself (and Barack Obama, apparently), don't want to do that. I'm fine with this traitorous SOB getting killed in the normal course of battle. I'm NOT fine with the president targeting him.
excon
Why not ? It's no different than taking out any other jihadi leader ? What gives him special protection ? You are mistaking acts of war and criminal action. They are not the same.
Hello again, tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Ahhh, but he IS different. If I'm not mistaken, you regularly argue that jihadists shouldn't be covered by OUR Constitution. It, you say, should be reserved for American citizens.
Okee doakee, then. The CONSTITUTION gives him special protection.
excon
Typical George Bush bashing still, get over it... he's been out of office 14 months now. And he's NOT eligible to even run for it again. Time to get over it now.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
Bill Clinton did it... Jimmy Carter did it... Obamas doing it..
And realistically... it goes back further than Jimmy Carter. And snooping goes back before the telephone and the telegraph before it were ever invented.
Lefties love their right to conspire with communists and others... otherwise why the huge concern about Terrorists and their "rights" when they don't really give a damn about Americans and their rights.
Example being how they bash everyone Else's right to free speech or try to take away anyone's right to own guns...
And as far as Terrorists acting against the USA outside of American soil...
Too bad... they are fair targets. They forfited that when they took up arms against the USA... and doing so on someone else's sovereign land means they forfeit any legal protections. I support just killing the SOB rather than my taxdollars going to pay some liberal lawyer to defend him like the circus with KSM and the other terrorist lowlifes in Gitmo.
Pakistan or Yemen is NOT a USA territiory, and is not subject to our laws any more than we are subject to their laws here in the USA. Which is as it should be.
And it also shows a basic and complete lack of understanding about how and what this "evesdropping" really is.
It isn't someone sitting in a phone closet or on a pole outside listening to every word being said. That's TV. And has been mentioned by OTHER members who know the processes involved as well... real life ISN'T what you watch on CSI.
Sorry Ex ; the Supremes have said differently twice.
The Ex parte Quirin case in WWII and the Hamdi decision hold that American citizens who fight for the enemy in wartime may be treated as enemy combatants, just like aliens.
BTW ;the answer for people who don't like the President's wartime powers would be to convince Congress to rescind or sunset the 2001 Authorization Act (AUMF)
Obama seems to have delusions of adequacy.
His track record on our Allies seems to be working-
UPDATE 4-Netanyahu cancels trip to Obama's nuclear summit | News by Country | Reuters
The cancellation has nothing to do with Obama. You knew that, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by Catsmine
Other than Barry made a promise he knew he couldn't keep, sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Who is Barry?Quote:
Originally Posted by Catsmine
Barrak Obama is known as Barry to certain people.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Barack. Do we spell smoothy "smothy"?Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
Or, worse, "soothy"?
I don't care HOW he spells it. My nickname for him isn't appropriate on this site. And isn't as benign as "Barry".Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
And incidentally... I don't have a spell checker that functions on this machine, and no I can't put one on. You can thank Active Directory for that. Even Admin rights on a machine can be trumped by a higher authority on a Domain via policies that can't be modified locally.
Ask a system administrator about this if you don't understand what I am talking about or believe me.
I'm an engineer, not an English Major. And I certainly am NOT a good typist.
The reason Bibi is going to miss the meeting is that Obama has the US -Israeli relations at the lowest point it's been since the Suez Crisis .
He isn't going because he doesn't plan on being the piñata at an anti-Israel bash fest . Instead of it being about proliferation violations by the Mahdi-hatter and the 12ers in Tehran they plan on using the meeting hammer Israel instead.
Deputy Prime Minister Dan Meridor will attend ;which should be good enough for the President who had no issue meeting Putin's sock-puppet Medvedev this week to sign a START treaty.
This is Barry. Sigh...Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/ap/20100412/ca...RpZtR03CoBUA--
AGAIN: President Obama bows to foreign leader - China Pres.
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