You sound like Zimmerman, walking home with candy is suspicious in your mind.
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You sound like Zimmerman, walking home with candy is suspicious in your mind.
Nope but walking home near the overhang of other people's homes instead of on the walkway would be suspicious to a neighhood watch person who joined and helped organize the neighborhood watch because of a rash of recent break ins.
It can be depending on the situation. And if the person is out of place for the environment they are in then there is justification for caution.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Hello again, dad:Quote:
And if the person is out of place for the environment they are in then there is justification for caution.
WHAT is out of place in the act of walking home with candy? Would being black in a white neighborhood be it?
Excon
Its could. But it can also be a young person in a retirement community. Or one of many situations. Don't forget the community this took place in was a gated community and the person walking through wasn't of known origin from the neighborhood.Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
There are many variables to it besides the black / white issue.
He died 60 feet from his dads home who was a neighbor of the shooter. How are you out of place at your dads home? I don't begrudge caution, but common sense dictates waiting for the cops you just called. He was told this by the 911 dispatcher. That's the first thing they teach you when you start a neighborhood watch, never pursue. He did the opposite.Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
He knew the cops were coming. Where was his caution? Where was his common sense in a mixed gated community?
As if the cops are always timely. Not in my neighborhood.
There is no video so I can't answer for that part. As far as him being close to "home" he wasn't living with his dad the whole time growing up it was a recent event. So there may have been circumstances that caused the situation / confrontation in the first place.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
If you believe what Zimmerman had said he was atacked on the way back to his car. Also at no time did Treyvon call the police.
The dead kid was visiting his divorced dad. Hardly a crime, and my point was the common sense thing to do when suspicious people are around is to wait for the cops and if he didn't have a gun, that's what he would have done.Quote:
Originally Posted by cdad
Your only guessing. Also maybe if he didn't have a gun this whole thing would have been a non issue as he would have been dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
The fact that was undisputed in this case was that Martin threw the 1st punch ;got the upper hand and was ponding Zimmerman. It is reasonable to conclude that Zimmerman felt his life was threatened . Self defense is the only reasonable outcome of this trial .
Now you are guessing as to whether Zimmerman would have been beaten to death.
News busters has it spot on.
Quote:
George Zimmerman Acquitted, Media Guilty | NewsBusters
Besides propelling the case into the national spotlight, the biased coverage of some media outlets did apparently have at least one other effect. One witness, Jeannee Manalao, stated that she had mistakenly believed Martin to have been younger than he was at the time of his death because the media had only shown older photos of the Florida teen.
The trial was marred by numerous incidents of sloppy and deliberately unfair reporting. NBC News is currently being sued by Zimmerman for editing the audio of a telephone call that Zimmerman made to 911 during the night of the altercation with Martin. In the NBC-edited recording, Zimmerman is made to sound as if he was following Martin because he was black. The false edit was first exposed by NewsBusters. It is highly likely that Zimmerman's victory today will increase his ability to win his suit against NBC.
CNN embarrassed itself by falsely claiming that on the 911 call, Zimmerman had used an archaic racial slur to describe black Americans. In fact, as even the prosecution later admitted, he had used the word punks. At least the cable news channel did not resort to fraudulent editing though.
One of the other persistent flaws in the media's coverage of the case against Zimmerman were reports claiming he was "white" when in fact, he is Hispanic, white, and also part black. For months on end, Zimmerman was repeatedly described as a "white Hispanic" even though other people of mixed race such as President Obama are never described as "white blacks."
Additionally, left-leaning media were fond of repeating false statements favorable to the prosecution such as the claim that Zimmerman got out of his car despite being instructed to remain in it. In fact, he was already out of his car when the 911 dispatcher told him "we don't need you to do that." According to Zimmerman, he turned around and tried to return to his vehicle and was subsequently confronted by Martin. Biased outlets almost always ignored the evidence which clearly suggested that it was Martin who initiated their conversation and Zimmerman's testimony that Martin initiated the violence. They also rarely reported the fact that Martin circled Zimmerman's car while he was in it, looking at him menacingly.
Additionally, viewers and readers were repeatedly subjected to hours on end of speculation and hypotheticals about how the fatal confrontation could have been avoided--but only if Zimmerman had acted differently. The speculators never discussed how Martin's father was providing almost no supervision to him, never talked about how the situation would have been prevented if Martin had not been suspended from school due to his own behavior. They also never discussed how the telephone evidence in the trial clearly indicated that Martin had more than enough time to return to his father's girlfriend's residence if he truly had been in fear of his life. Most Americans also likely were unaware of Martin's admitted love of fighting.
The public was also subjected to countless hours of ignorant pronouncements about if Zimmerman had started the fight, that would determine his guilt or innocence. Rarely were viewers ever told the truth that self-defense law in Florida is about whether the surviving person rightfully feared for his life, regardless of who started the physical confrontation.
While the public couldn't get away from information about Zimmerman's run-ins with local criminals who happened to be black, the public was rarely told about other facts about him such as that he fought successfully to get justice for an elderly black man who was beaten by the son of a white police officer, how he mentored black youth, or even that he was a supporter of Barack Obama and not some sort of far-right white nationalist.
The trial of Zimmerman would likely have remained strictly a local news story had it not been for the antics of MSNBC's Al Sharpton who was advising Martin's parents on how to gain more publicity (and also calling for Zimmerman's arrest) while simultaneously serving as a commentator for the Democratic network. Despite criticism from other media outlets, MSNBC never told Sharpton to choose between his dueling roles even though it harmed their overall reputation.
In the end, it is regrettable that Trayvon Martin died that fateful night. What is also regrettable is how America's elite news media willingly went along with a smear campaign designed by racist frauds like Al Sharpton who were looking to boost their own fortunes at the expense of an innocent man. George Zimmerman is not a perfect man. But he did not deserve to become a real-life version of Emmanuel Goldstein.
That's the shooters story, but hardly an undisputed fact. What if the dead kid was standing his ground against a strange stalker? Stand your ground is a lousy law.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
But Tom where you live profiling and shooting unarmed black people is an accepted practice, while you decry Chicago and Detroit. Little wonder why you see this as acceptable behavior and outcome.
No I'm saying it is reasonable to say that he thought his life was in danger.. And that is the only standard needed for a self defense defense.Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Maybe the standard for reasonable needs to be better defined, and raised. A gun owner and neighborhood watch captain, should have the highest standards of common sense and behavior, and sorry Zimmerman is scraping the bottom in both.
Why is it a lousy law?Quote:
Originally Posted by talaniman
Politicians are weighing in. My favorite is from the next mayor of NYC.
As opposed to what, a trial by media? Public opinion? What?Quote:
Anthony Weiner ✔ @anthonyweiner
Keep Trayvon's family in our prayers. Deeply unsatisfying verdict. Trial by jury is our only choice in a democracy
NationalJournal.com - GOP Congressman: We'll Be Talking About the Trayvon Martin Case 'For a Long Time to Come' - Sunday, July 14, 2013
Empowering and encouraging a gun owner to shoot because he feels in danger. You open the door for subjective thinking, without accounting for the part thinking and action of the shooter plays in the situation.
You cannot put yourself in a dangerous position, and then say you were defending yourself. If you cannot follow proper procedure or have one in place, it a lousy law.
Why not ?Quote:
You cannot put yourself in a dangerous position, and then say you were defending yourself.
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