Their refusal is the only thing preventing the end of the Covid pandemic in the US.
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Their refusal is the only thing preventing the end of the Covid pandemic in the US.
It is not that simple . The virus seems to mutate at a high rate . The vaccine does not prevent all infections or transmissions. Epidemiologists in 28 countries predict that the vaccines will be obsolete in a year .Quote:
Their refusal is the only thing preventing the end of the Covid pandemic in the US.
Two-thirds of epidemiologists warn mutations could render current COVID vaccines ineffective in a year or less | Oxfam International
The incubator for the virus is in the developing world ;not the US . Delta and Lambda did not develop here . But here is where they landed and will land (Lambda aided by the Dem open border policy.)
The fight has to be at the source . So if anything the emphasis of vaccine distribution should be in the developing world . Also a new emphasis should be placed on treatments along with vaccines and boosters .
This virus is endemic similar to the flu and common cold and humans will have to adapt to that reality .
Yeah, it's pretty simple.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
The vaccine prevents 96% of the Delta variant. Not having a vaccine prevents ZERO infections.Quote:
The vaccine does not prevent all infections or transmissions.
The infection rate is higher in the US than in any other country.Quote:
The incubator for the virus is in the developing world ;not the US
White Republicans make up the largest demographic of people in the U.S. who remain vaccine-avoiders with 53% saying they were not getting the vaccine. Democrats who have received the vaccine are 88%, far higher than Republicans.Quote:
Lambda aided by the Dem open border policy.
The fight is here and NOW. The possibility of a huge surge is looming, and will happen unless the vaccination rate accelerates. The emphasis for the US is in the US.Quote:
The fight has to be at the source . So if anything the emphasis of vaccine distribution should be in the developing world
You'll be forever chasing your tail . The Delta ravaged India and other nations well before it came here . Vaccine protection remains very strong against severe disease and hospitalizations. But evidence is mounting that the Delta variant is capable of infecting fully vaccinated people at a greater rate than previous versions, and concerns have been raised that they may even spread the virus. You know this is true . Why would they not exclude the vaccinated from the mask mandates if vaxed people can't get it ?
The virus doesn't discriminate, what vaccination does is lessen the chances you will die from it
That's true, but it's also true that the vaccines are very effective in preventing Covid. Not 100% by any means, but still very effective.Quote:
what vaccination does is lessen the chances you will die from it
It doesn't prevent it with all variants, who knows with your attitude you might have it now
Very few things work all the time.
So let's make sure things don't work all the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
You're complicating something that is very simple.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
GET VACCINATED AND SAVE LIVES AND DEFEAT THE COVID EPIDEMIC IN THE US.
The vaccines are not the problem. The problem is those who won't get vaccinated. Republicans are the largest group refusing vaccination. They are politicizing a deadly disease that should never be politicized.
Masks are required because the unvaccinated can't be trusted to not wear them. The arguments about liberty and freedom are total nonsense. The non-vaccinated do NOT have the freedom to injure and possibly kill others.
Since the vaccine seems to be effective, then the only people the non-vaxed are putting at risk are others who are non-vaxed. So if they choose to not take the vaccine, how is that anyone's business but their own?
I would encourage anyone over forty to take the vaccine, but I would not support the government forcing people to take it.
No i am being a realist ;and the science backs that upQuote:
You're complicating something that is very simple.
The coronavirus is here to stay — here’s what that means (nature.com)
From pandemic to endemic: COVID-19 could be around forever, professor says | CBS 17
Here's the good news . As more people get it ; herd immunity kicks in and it will become a less potent illness.
Tom has a good point. This is something we are going to have to learn to live with. Already the death rate for infected people is much lower as more is learned about how to manage treatment. For otherwise healthy people under forty, the death rate is very, very low. In South Dakota, as has been already pointed out, the death rate has been zero for the past several weeks, so panicking would seem unwise. A great number of early deaths occurred in nursing homes and among the elderly, most of whom are now, I would think, vaccinated.
The great danger we currently face is out of control government spending and fiscal policies.
https://www.economist.com/graphic-de...risk-estimator
What the science backs up is GET THE DAMN VACCINE.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Yes not the complete answer, but any port in a storm
They are refusing because unfortunately they are extremely vulnerable and they believe everything negative thing which is said about the vaccines, no matter who produces them.
There are a very few people who suffer side effects from the vaccine and I'm afraid that a very few have died but when we consider the millions upon millions worldwide who have had the vaccine and suffered absolutely no problems I believe those
people who won't have the vaccine should realise that the possibility of dying from the vaccine are millions to one.
and yet I know people who have had mRNA vaccines who have had horrible side effects ;both short term and long term. I know one person who received the DTP as a child who had to be put in a bath of ice to reduce the fever . I know another person who has suffered for over 2 years from side effects from the tetanus mRNA vaccine . Doctors quick conclusion is that it is all in their head.
My point for a long time is that covid 19 as a coronavirus is going to be endemic and we will be dealing with new strains for some time . Some of the strains will be vaccine resistant . Delta may be one in that it doesn't protect against either infection or transmission. What the vaccine probably does is reduce the severity of the infection .
DTP has a mRNA vaccine?
So we should follow your anecdotes rather than the science? Gimme a break.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Your point is pointless! Everything you have said on these pages serves nothing but purely political purposes.Quote:
My point for a long time is that covid 19 as a coronavirus is going to be endemic and we will be dealing with new strains for some time
The vaccine will enormously reduce the pandemic - that is not in dispute. So GET THE DAMN VACCINE and stop lobbying against it.
Just wait! In about two weeks, far too many vaccinated but unmasked Lollapaloosa (Chicago, this weekend) attendees will be testing positive.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
So think about what you're saying. "Far too many vaccinated but unmasked...attendees will be testing positive." Considering that masking does but little to prevent Covid, then the vaccine must not be so effective?? Well, the good news is this. If that turns out to be true, all the liberal dems on this board will immediately begin to call it the Trump vaccine.
Masking prevents the variants from causing grief.Quote:
Originally Posted by jlisenbe
Marginally. It's practically impossible to find a study that says wearing masks does much more than a little to stop the spread of Covid UNLESS it's an N-95 mask which practically no one wears.
Your link shows that the delta variant is so dangerous that even those vaccinated can transmit the disease. Deaths among those were non-existent. The number who were asymptomatic was very low.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
And you think this is funny?
What's funny is that you can't even read your own link to get the facts. And that you expect the readers to conclude something nefarious by posting only the link with an idiotic lol.
Nobody's laughing.
The best way to defeat the disease is, as everybody but you knows by now, is GET VACCINATED.
Back to the original question; perhaps it is that people have woken to the dangers of the new technology in vaccines, the catastrophic long term after effects from these untested drugs rushed into manufacture to deal with a disease that is no worse than the flu we have been existing with for years. Yes, it is a pandemic, wide spread infections and many deaths but the death rate from this disease is no worse than the death rate from the flu, it is just the medical profession are running scared because the hospital systems cannot deal with the number of infections presenting
The coronavirus is not at all unknown to scientists and medical professionals. It's the variants that are causing so much of the problem. I think we're at variant Lambda now, a new mutation.Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/th...cid=uxbndlbing
https://www.chicagotribune.com/coron...6cu-story.html
And the SARs we have been vaccinated against for years has new variants every year and it goes on killing people. Yes the answer is vaccination, but with a vaccine that doesn't have long term side effects. Who knows perhaps being vaccinated will usher in the mark of the beast, where only the vaccinated can move freely and transact business. The plans for a vaccination passport are a thinly disguised move
Deaths from COVID-19 are far worse than deaths from the flu. COVID 605,000 deaths and counting compared to about 35,000 on average for the last several years for the flu.Quote:
Originally Posted by paraclete
We must be getting better at treating the disease. Three states to look at are South Dakota, Alabama, and Florida. All three have been experiencing serious spikes in confirmed cases, but relatively few deaths. In SD, active cases are up somewhat, but there have been no deaths in over two months, so we are clearly learning how to manage cases better. In the long run, vaccinations and efficient med treatments for those who do get ill could be the answer. Considering that the vaccination is turning out to be far from 100% effective, it would seem clear that vaccinations alone will not be the complete answer. Reducing the number of cases to manageable levels and finding effective treatments is likely the best we can hope for, which is essentially what Tom has been saying.
74 percent of the 469 cases in an outbreak in Barnstable County, Mass., following the July 4 weekend were in vaccinated people . But you still believe in the vaccine panacea . The relevent information is that few patients were hospitalized and none died.
Strangely, it would seem that the non-vaxed people in Barnstable were less likely to become infected. At any rate, I imagine part of what we are seeing is that once we get vaccinated, we start getting bolder. I know I have. You kind of feel armor-plated.
There is no doubt that the vaccines have been effective to a degree . The real question is for how long ? The Israeli's have the most effective vaccination program in the world . But now they are going to initiate a booster program for the most vulnerable.
Eventually we will come to the realization that the only way to deal with an endemic virus is to protect the vulnerable and to let the rest of the people get on with their lives .
The Spanish Flu infected a third of the world killing millions . Various mutations of it(H1N1) still exist and infect people today with a new strain every season. Some are more problematic than others(remember the 1968 pandemic ? No ? That's because so many other more interesting things were happening that year ) . Over time a virus becomes less deadly because the Darwinian science says it is not in the interest of the virus to kill off it's hosts .Quote:
https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/custom...quote_icon.png Originally Posted by paraclete https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/custom...post-right.png
Yes, it is a pandemic, wide spread infections and many deaths but the death rate from this disease is no worse than the death rate from the flu,
Deaths from COVID-19 are far worse than deaths from the flu. COVID 605,000 deaths and counting compared to about 35,000 on average for the last several years for the flu.
Darwinian science, Darwin was not a "scientist" none of his theories can be proven in the scientific manner
Wrong and wrong. His observations about adaptations and natural selection, for instance, can very easily be observed to be true. They are so clearly true that basically no one argues against them. I don't agree with his major premise, but fair is fair.Quote:
Darwin was not a "scientist" none of his theories can be proven in the scientific manner
The only way to deal effectively with the COVID pandemic is to get vaccinated. Those who refuse endanger everyone else. I have no idea why you're so blind on this issue, tomder.Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Flatly untrue. If the vaccine is effective, then those who are vaccinated are not endangered at all. If the vaccine is not effective, then your statement simply falls apart. Either way, it is NOT TRUE. I'm all for the vaccine, but it is not, by itself, a complete answer.Quote:
Those who refuse endanger everyone else.
This alone clearly demonstrates that. "74 percent of the 469 cases in an outbreak in Barnstable County, Mass., following the July 4 weekend were in vaccinated people." So about 350 vaccinated people caught Covid and were, at that point, quite capable of passing it on to someone else. Thus they, "endanger everyone else".
If we believe public policy; (which is different from science ); then we are being told by the suggestion that vaxed people should also wear masks ;that the vaxed do endanger others . There have been 350 million jabs in the US .Another 35 million have gotten covid and have antibodies . What we don't know yet is how long immunity from the virus and the jab lasts .
You want to know what public policy would be the most effective to controlling the virus ? Stopping the flow of illegals crossing the borders . Quid is keeping the travel ban. Why doesn't he close the border too ? What makes it even more hypocritical is that vaxed Canadians cannot enter the US . But thousands of unscreened people cross the border .Over 1 million apprehensions of illegal aliens this year already . Detainees are tested after they are transferred to other locations ,bringing the virus across the border with them . Covid cases are surging in detention centers and one can only imaging how many successfully crossed with out being detained .
Remember that Commissar...er, Vice President Harris is now in charge of the southern border, so I'm sure that in just a few more decades she'll have it all under control.Quote:
Stopping the flow of illegals crossing the borders .
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