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Originally Posted by BillNi

Can you explain briefly exactly how a lawyer will "protect her interests" BEFORE being charged?

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Hello again, Bill:

Let me give this a try... I don't disagree with your premise that she doesn't need an attorney BEFORE she's charged, IF she knows how to act in the face of PENDING charges... The problem is, MOST people don't.

You're a PERFECT example of that. In the FIRST instance, you believe a citizen SHOULD visit a police station because they were summoned, but they SHOULD NOT SAY ANYTHING while there... You STILL haven't said WHY you think they should go... Simply the fact that you suggest she be put in that circumstance, is EVIDENCE of your inexperience...

In any case, and for whatever reason, you believe that a citizen can, in the face of a trained police interrogator, keep his mouth shut... It SOUNDS easy, doesn't it? But, it's plain that you have NEVER experienced something like this, and your advice comes from your OPINION, rather than your EXPERIENCE...

Now, I'm not going to argue with you about your premise... You believe it. I can only tell you this... I, myself, HAVE been in those situations, and I'm a VERY sophisticated animal when it comes to interacting with the cops... I've done it MORE times than I care to remember. Having said that, I would NEVER consider allowing myself to be put under police interrogation, because I KNOW how good they are. They KNOW how to get somebody to talk...

So, by hiring a lawyer BEFORE she is charged, she WILL get the proper legal advice, which is, DON'T TALK TO THE COPS.

This board is NOT for the OPINIONATED. Somebody can really get HURT if they follow BAD advice. This isn't school.. These are real people..

excon

Hello again, Bill:

If my parents were 6' 10", I could be playing basketball.

excon

PS> By the way, our cops don't torture...

It works like this, the cops will get you in a room and tell you that they have it on video, or that they have y our finger prints and that the DA has already pressed charges for some highly serious charge. They tell you that they want to help you and that if you will just confess to this, you can just go home and that they will talk to the DA to get your probation.

Or they will tell you that they understand you needed the money and that the judge understands how hard it is, and that if you just give them a written confession now, nothing will happen.

They will also give you an impression that you can't leave, locked door perhaps with a uniform officer standing there with his gun on his hit.

They do this to scare you, to make you feel locked up.
They may say that they will have to cuff you and put you in lock up or even say prison if you don't work with them.

So no you should not go in and "say nothing" you have no obligation to go in, and they want you to say something and most people can not just sit quietly. They will start talking. So you can't talk if you are not there.

And if you are there, with an attorney, he talks, allowing you the relief of all of the lies.

And I have worked it from the police side, and unless a person is a serious gang member more scared of death than talking, we can normally get them talking, we start by being nice, telling them we understand that they most likely were not the one, but we need to clear it up, we ask them to tell us who they think may have done it, ( get them talking and lying)
Then we may ask them about details of their job.

Then we produce a fake folder and tell them that we already have the evidence and wanted to arrest them here instead of on the job, or in front of family , we try to find their weakness, and will watch their body language and eyes to tell when we are getting to them.

Then we may threaten, and yes even use the good cop, bad cop, idea, or just bad cop, worst cop ( easy for some of the cops)

Since Clair is from Winnepeg, MB,Canada, The Canadian Bill of Rights applies:

Seems even the Canadian justice system recommends a lawyer be hired quickly.

An excerpt from, note the bold:

Canada's system of Justice

Legal rights
The Charter also protects the individual and ensures fairness during legal proceedings, particularly in criminal cases. The rights to habeas corpus, or the right to challenge being detained or held, and to be presumed innocent until proven guilty – always recognized as part of our law – are now guaranteed in our constitution.

No one can be deprived of the right to liberty and security of his or her person except through proper legal procedures. Canadians are protected against unreasonable searches and seizures, and against police using excessive force, even when a search or seizure is authorized by law. We are also protected against being detained or arrested arbitrarily. In other words, a police officer must have a reasonable suspicion that we have committed a crime before holding us in custody.

The Charter also protects us against arbitrary actions by law enforcement agencies. It guarantees our rights to be told why we are being arrested or detained, to consult a lawyer without delay, to be informed of this right, and to have a court determine quickly whether the detention is lawful.

If you are charged with an offence under federal or provincial law you also have the right

* to be told promptly of the offence,
* to be tried within a reasonable time,
* not to be compelled to testify at your own trial,
* to be presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt in a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal,
* not to be denied reasonable bail without cause,
* not to be subjected to any cruel and unusual punishment,
* to be tried by a jury for serious charges, and
* not to be tried or punished twice for the same offence.

OK I agree if you think you will confess or start talking to the cops, then hire a lawyer.

But that is just the issue, the person always goes in , thinking they are smarter than the cops ( and may well be) but the cops are trained in getting a person to talk.

In the case of some people, we could get them to confess to things they did not even do, we could scare them that badly

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Originally Posted by BillNi

OK I agree if you think you will confess or start talking to the cops, then hire a lawyer.

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This shows how clueless you are about this. Of course no one goes into this thinking they will confess. They are usually as arrogant as you appear to be. And then they learn how little they know and how unprepared they are.

Remember, also, the OP has admitted guilt. So this is not some innocent person who doesn't have anything to hide.

But a guility person is normally nervious and worried about going to jail, and normally easily fooled and tricked

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Originally Posted by ScottGem

Remember, also, the OP has admitted guilt. So this is not some innocent person who doesn't have anything to hide.

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Can you please quote from OP where he stated he "admitted guilt"?

Sorry, if you meant to say he admitted guilt to us, then yes. But he hasn't admitted guilt to anyone but us.

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Originally Posted by BillNi

Can you please quote from OP where he stated he "admitted guilt"?

Sorry, if you meant to say he admitted guilt to us, then yes. But he hasn't admitted guilt to anyone but us.

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Look at the title and the first post.

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Can you please quote from OP where he stated he "admitted guilt"?

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Here you go.

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I'm 21 live in winnipeg mb I stole from my job due to desprate circumstances. Its my first offence, I stole 9500$.

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BillNi does not find this helpful : Silent

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Also, you should be aware of the rules of this site, rules you agreed to when you joined. Unhelpful ratings are for factually incorrect info only, not for opinion. Your rating of Chuck's post is against the rules of this site.

He did not like my post since as moderator I have had to issue him a warning, and also delete a few of his posts. They often take it out on my posts when I do my moderation job here.

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Originally Posted by BillNi

You should not delete my posts because you don't agree with the opinion or advise I am offering to the OP.

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I haven't. Your "opinion" remains in this thread along with your arguments for and the many other arguments against. They have been removed because you keep arguing the same bad advice after being told it won't be tolerated. This site takes pride in the quality of the advice given here.

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Originally Posted by BillNi

It is NOT illegal to go into the police station without a lawyer present and invoke your right to remain silent.

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No one has said it was illegal. But something can be legal and still a dumb and dangerous thing to do.

I don't want to close this thread in case the OP needs some more advice, but I will if you continue to to argue about this.

{MOD note: the quotes above are from removed posts, removed for the reasons stated.-<>}