Ask Me Help Desk - The "Complentarianism" of White Evangelicals

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

What is your source for saying the husband and wife are equal partners?

It's 2021. They are equal partners. Both drive. Both care for the children. Money is controlled by both as a unit. Both do household chores, cooking, laundry, grocery shopping. The success of the marriage doesn't (shouldn't) depend on one or the other, but depends on them working together as a team.

Uhm…I meant from the Bible.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Uhm…I meant from the Bible.

We've come a long way from Bible mandates, written millennia ago in a totally different culture, regarding marriage.

So you don’t accept the Bible.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

So you don’t accept the Bible.

Do you still ride a donkey? Does your wife fetch water several times a day at the village well? Were your sons circumcised when they were eight days old? How many long, flowing robes do you own? Do you attend services at the temple every Saturday? How many fish did you catch this week?

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Originally Posted by Wondergirl

Do you still ride a donkey? Does your wife fetch water several times a day at the village well? Were your sons circumcised when they were eight days old? How many long, flowing robes do you own? Do you attend services at the temple every Saturday? How many fish did you catch this week?

Lololol......

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Your comments on this board do not carry the weight of scripture.

Her comments carry far more weight than MISINTERPRETED scripture.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Oh well. Enough of this lunacy.

Sez the chief lunatic here.

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Do you still ride a donkey? Does your wife fetch water several times a day at the village well? Were your sons circumcised when they were eight days old? How many long, flowing robes do you own? Do you attend services at the temple every Saturday? How many fish did you catch this week?

So in your world, the wearing of robes and fetching of water are somehow the moral equivalents of how God views marriage? Why am I not surprised?

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Sez the chief lunatic here.

Still cranky after being called to task on your complete misrepresentation of complementarianism and your foolish comments about the 1 Timothy passage? Poor Athos. Being wrong seems to bother you so much.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

So in your world, the wearing of robes and fetching of water are somehow the moral equivalents of how God views marriage? Why am I not surprised?

Keep up! You misrepresented my post and changed the subject yourself.

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Women may assist in the decision-making process, the ultimate authority for the decision is the purview of the male in marriage, courtship, and in the polity of churches.

Dude, if we had tried to live by that we would have starved to death. I'm terrible at making money, always have been. I have two degrees. I wouldn't trade the knowledge for anything but so far their earning power has been about $25 a year in royalties from a book I wrote in 2005.
My wife has three degrees, one in dietetic technology and two in nursing. She's been the breadwinner since 1986. I, on the other hand, excelled at caring for the kids. We hade a bipolar daughter and I was much better at handling her than my wife was. So I was the stay-home parent for 20 years. I became one of the girls in town and buddied around with the other moms. Since my wife was the one bringing home the bacon, she was the primary decider about how it got cooked, so to speak. I was fine with that and she has a wisdom that I could only dream of.
Both Moses and Jesus said the two are "one flesh." How often does your left nostril lord it over your right one?
One flesh = equal partners.
And I thank God for that.

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Dude, if we had tried to live by that we would have starved to death. I'm terrible at making money, always have been. I have two degrees. I wouldn't trade the knowledge for anything but so far their earning power has been about $25 a year in royalties from a book I wrote in 2005.
My wife has three degrees, one in dietetic technology and two in nursing. She's been the breadwinner since 1986. I, on the other hand, excelled at caring for the kids. We hade a bipolar daughter and I was much better at handling her than my wife was. So I was the stay-home parent for 20 years. I became one of the girls in town and buddied around with the other moms. Since my wife was the one bringing home the bacon, she was the primary decider about how it got cooked, so to speak. I was fine with that and she has a wisdom that I could only dream of.

In what way did that violate a wife submitting to her husband?

My wife and I share in the decision making. She defers to me frequently, and I do the same with her. It helps a great deal that we share a genuine commitment to Christ and so wish to walk the same path.

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Keep up! You misrepresented my post and changed the subject yourself.

So you do realize there is a difference. Thank goodness for that. Of course it does make your response seem rather strange.

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Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Poor Athos. Being wrong seems to bother you so much.

Lololol. Besides being so wrong and so nasty on so many matters, you are a great source of comic relief on these pages. Thank you.

Below quote - Jl asking DW re DW post above.

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In what way did that violate a wife submitting to her husband?

Answer from DW.

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she was the primary decider about how it got cooked, so to speak. I was fine with that and she has a wisdom that I could only dream of.

Sorry, DW, for answering on your behalf but I didn't want to wait a month for you, and Jl has trouble comprehending writing.

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They are equal partners.

Eve is not addressed as a separate person until after the Fall. Adam naming Eve conveys his authority over her and in turn over all the living. Man and wife become Adam and Eve

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Originally Posted by waltero

Eve is not addressed as a separate person until after the Fall. Adam naming Eve conveys his authority over her and in turn over all the living. Man and wife become Adam and Eve

What happened to Lilith? In Genesis 1, man (Adam) and woman (Lilith) are created at the same time, but then Genesis 2 establishes Eve as the product of Adam's rib.

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What happened to Lilith?

I'm not into fiction. But it looks as if she is Making Her Mark In Popular Culture

There is nothing in the general topic of submission that would preclude the wife making decisions. "she was the primary decider about how it got cooked, so to speak. I was fine with that." But even at that, DW (or anyone else, for that matter) describing his family situation does not establish God's plan for the family. For those of us who are Christians, we turn to the Bible to settle that issue.

You still have not addressed why you purposely distorted the meaning of complementarianism. If the past in any indicator, I imagine that you won't. Nor have you explained why you are so intent on bashing only WHITE evangelicals. How about black or Latino evangelicals? Why did you reserve your criticism for those WHITE evangelicals, but you failed to include Muslims who are genuine oppressors of women, and also failed to mention orthodox Jews?

Excuse me, but your bias is showing.

Ad hominem:
A rhetorical strategy where the speaker attacks the character, motive, or some other attribute of the person making an argument rather than attacking the substance of the argument itself. This avoids genuine debate by creating a diversion to some irrelevant but often highly charged issue.
-Wikipedia

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Originally Posted by Athos

White evangelicals made up a large portion of the Jan 6 insurrectionists.

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Originally Posted by Athos

Also, your loving Trump is noted.

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Originally Posted by Athos

Your reading comprehension hasn't improved.

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Originally Posted by Athos

Now I must send you back to your room in the basement.

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Originally Posted by Athos

I wonder why I ever bother to explain things to you when you are so bad at reading comprehension...

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Originally Posted by Athos

...note how these are all ad hominem statements - the refuge of the defeated.

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Originally Posted by Athos

Sez the chief lunatic here.

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Originally Posted by Athos

Besides being so wrong and so nasty on so many matters, you are a great source of comic relief on these pages.

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Originally Posted by Athos

Jl has trouble comprehending writing.

These are there parts where you are attacking the character of the person, would you like another list showing where you have created diversions?

Me calling you a hypocrite would not be ad hominem but rather a statement of fact about your actions regarding this debate.

Me saying you are misinformed are not ways to attack your character, but to show you where you information is fallacious.

Me saying you are confounded, is not a diversion, but rather to emphasize the point of confusion you authored.

Info, you summed it up very well with this statement. "Athos has many unanswered questions. It must be easier to not think through your ideas than to have them critiqued." Athos becomes practically enraged any time his statements are challenged. That's unfortunate. We all make mistakes and have to backtrack at times. The best solution is a simple, "I was wrong."

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Originally Posted by waltero

I'm not into fiction. But it looks as if she is Making Her Mark In Popular Culture

Lilith was depicted as Adam's first wife in the Alphabet of Ben Sira, a work that became part of Jewish tradition sometime around 1000 CE. According to this interpretation, their marriage eventually failed and she left, prompting God to create Eve.

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Originally Posted by InfoJunkie4Life

Ad hominem:
A rhetorical strategy where the speaker attacks the character, motive, or some other attribute of the person making an argument rather than attacking the substance of the argument itself. This avoids genuine debate by creating a diversion to some irrelevant but often highly charged issue.
-Wikipedia

And introducing the AskMeHelpDesk champion ad hominem poster -- JL!

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And introducing the AskMeHelpDesk champion ad hominem poster -- JL!

You might note that Info, unlike you, could show MANY examples. Now it's your turn. Hint: Pretty sure you won't be able to, but we'll see.

Can you not see that your statement is a perfect example of an ad hominem attack??? That's priceless. In your attempt at a personal attack, you have become the personal attackER.