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Originally Posted by MoonlitWaves

It matters not what other people of other religions or even the same religion think, feel or believe. What we as individuals think, feel and believe is our own evidence. Be it the belief in God or not. The point is that no one can refute what each of us feels to be true and correct because it is our own. Tatertot said, "That is the real evidence." And he is correct. The Bible alone is not all the evidence Christian's have. Matter of fact the Bible as we all know is not undeniable evidence. Our undeniable evidence comes from God within us revealing the Truth. This evidence cannot be refuted.

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Also, you're saying the evidence is subjective to the individual, & not objective. It's not very good evidence if it can't be objectively verified.

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Originally Posted by deist

Also, you're saying the evidence is subjective to the individual, & not objective. It's not very good evidence if it can't be objectively verified.

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Again, it does not matter whether you think it is good enough evidence or not. The proof I see and feel is all the evidence I need to know that God exist. It's good enough for ME. Whether it is good enough for you or anyone else means nothing to me.

I can talk until I am blue in the face. I can explain and show you all day long how and why I believe the way I do, but if you are not open to it you will never see it. God can not show you truth if you do not want to see it. This is what tatertot was saying in his earlier post.

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Originally Posted by MoonlitWaves

Again, it does not matter whether you think it is good enough evidence or not. The proof I see and feel is all the evidence I need to know that God exist. It's good enough for ME. Whether it is good enough for you or anyone else means nothing to me.

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How many times do I have to tell you christians that I believe in a God, just not your evil bible god or the evil Muslim god.

Most believers have a lot of trouble discussion Christianity without being overly emotional.

Have a good weekend, deist!

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Originally Posted by Choux

Most believers have a lot of trouble discussion Christianity without being overly emotional.

Have a good weekend, deist!

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Wouldn't you get "over emotional"?

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Originally Posted by Choux

Most believers have a lot of trouble discussion Christianity without being overly emotional.

Have a good weekend, deist!

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You have a good weekend too.

Positive thinking has never been shown to account for such life transformations as those that Jesus does. Positive thinking does not take the addict from the gutter and make her into a good mother with a college degree. Only Jesus is able to make such dramatic changes in lives.

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Originally Posted by deist

The changes in your life can be attributed to positive thinking. People who follow different religions have also experienced a change in life. How do you account for that ? They feel their particular religion has made them better people too.

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What do you belive in? What helps you get through your day? what makes it all ok so that you sleep at night? What will happen to you when you die? Do you know where you are going to spend eternity?

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Originally Posted by deist

Yes that evidence can be refuted. Positive thinking can do many things to a person's life, so can faith, which is just another form of positive thinking. I can worship a cow or a tree, & if I have enough faith in it, & believe it is somehow witnessing to my spirit, that can affect all kinds of changes in my life. In fact, if I pray to the cow or the tree, I'll get just as many alleged answers to my prayers as christians get from their god.

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Originally Posted by savedsinner7

What do you belive in? What helps you get through your day? what makes it all ok so that you sleep at night? What will happen to you when you die? Do you know where you are going to spend eternity?

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I'm not worried about eternity at all. I'm concerned with living this life. Eternity will take care of itself. If there is a heaven, it will be filled with good people whether they were Muslim, Christian, Jehovah's Witness, Agnostic, Atheist, Deist, Pantheist, or any other religion of man.

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Originally Posted by savedsinner7

Positive thinking does not take the addict from the gutter and make her into a good mother with a college degree. Only Jesus is able to make such dramatic changes in lives.

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I've noticed that the ones that are the biggest bible thumpers are the ones that abused drugs or alcohol yet the atheists never seem to have made those choices. I wonder if there's a link.

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Originally Posted by deist

I'm not worried about eternity at all. I'm concerned with living this life. Eternity will take care of itself. If there is a heaven, it will be filled with good people whether they were Muslim, Christian, Jehovah's Witness, Agnostic, Atheist, Deist, Pantheist, or any other religion of man.

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Matt 7:13-14
13 "Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. 14 Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.
NKJV

John 14:5-6
6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
NKJV

Daily Devotional by Max Lucado

"the One who came still comes and the One who spoke still speaks"



October 13
If people want to follow me, they must give up the things they want. They must be willing even to give up their lives to follow me.

Mark 8:34


On one side stands the crowd. Jeering. Baiting. Demanding.
On the other stands a peasant. Swollen lips. Lumpy eye. Lofty promise.



One promises acceptance, the other a cross.
One offers flesh and flash, the other offers faith.


The crowd challenges, "Follow us and fit in."
Jesus promises, "Follow me and stand out."


They promise to please. God promises to save.
God looks at you and asks, "Which will be your choice?"



A Gentle Thunder
Max Lucado

©2000 - 2007
Courtesy
Oak Hills Church

San Antonio, Texas

And NET-IMS, Inc.

“Listen to advice and accept instruction, and in the end you will be wise. Many are the plans in a man's heart, but it is the LORD's purpose that prevails.”- Proverbs 19:20-21

The efforts of this world will all fail in the end. Not all will enter Heaven.

Matthew 7:13-1413 “Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. 14 Because[a] narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.

John 12:25
He who loves his life will lose it, and he who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life.

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Originally Posted by deist

I'm not worried about eternity at all. I'm concerned with living this life. Eternity will take care of itself. If there is a heaven, it will be filled with good people whether they were Muslim, Christian, Jehovah's Witness, Agnostic, Atheist, Deist, Pantheist, or any other religion of man.

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Originally Posted by savedsinner7

“Listen to advice and accept instruction, and in the end you will be wise. Many are the plans in a man's heart, but it is the LORD's purpose that prevails.”- Proverbs 19:20-21

The efforts of this world will all fail in the end. Not all will enter Heaven.

Matthew 7:13-1413 “Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. 14 Because[a] narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.

John 12:25
He who loves his life will lose it, and he who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life.

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This all coming from a book that says the earth is flat, covered over with a dome, & doesn't rotate.

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Originally Posted by deist

This all coming from a book that says the earth is flat, covered over with a dome, & doesn't rotate.

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Again, you make these unjustified, unvalidated claims, and no matter whether you are shown otherwise, you keep coming back to the same claims.

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Originally Posted by deist

How do christians explain Jesus' failed prophecies ? Here are only two among several.
Matthew 10:23, Jesus told his disciples that he would return before they could go over all the cities of Israel with the gospel. The gospel has since been preached all throughout Israel, & continues to be so with christian television now, & still Jesus hasn't returned.
Mark 14:62, Jesus told the high priest that he would live to see Jesus' second coming. Of course the high priest died before Jesus returned.
So there is two false prophecies made by Jesus. Any explanations ?

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Back to your original question: Let me give you short answers to both prophecies. Unfulfilled prophecies is not the same as failed prophecies. The high priest will see Jesus at whichever resurrection he is in. The Apostles didn't get to all the villages in Israel in their lifetimes because persecution scattered them over all the known world. Now how about you explaining the fulfilled prophecies that Jesus gave? Only God knows the future. Just off the top of my head without giving you a lengthy list of scripture references try these on for size. Jesus fortold: His death; the way He would be killed; that He would be betrayed by one of His Apostles; He indicatated who that would be; He fortold Peter's denial; He fortold how long He would be in the tomb; He fortold the general time and method of Peter's death; In Matthew ch. 24 He plainly said that earthquakes, famines, wars, etc were not the sign of the end, but that the gospel would be preached in all the world, which has happened and continues to happen; He fortold the destruction of Jeursalem and the Temple; He told how believers in Jerusalem could escape that destruction (they did) He said the time frame for that destruction was to be in their generation (it was); He told them that His followers would receive the Holy Ghost (they did). There! If Jesus is not God the Son, how did He know these things? And if He is not alive, how have the Penetcostals historically and currently been filled with the Holy Spirit, healed the sick, and in some instances raised the dead? You have nothing but an empty argument. I've answered your question. You're welcome!

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Originally Posted by deist

I show the absurdities of the bible for two reasons. One is to get christians to think about what they believe, the absurdities of it. God didn't give us a reasoning mind just so we would reject it in favor of taking things on faith alone. God gave us a mind to gather knowledge of his creation through observation & questions for the purpose of learning of God through It's only revelation, creation itself. The second & more important reason is because I'm battling the far right for freedom. The far right has an agenda, & it is to turn America, indeed, the world, into a totalitarian theocracy, getting rid of separation of church & state, free speech, freedom of religion, & where it's illegal to be anything but a christian. I have read direct quotes from the far right stating that they want to deny religious liberty to all non-christians. I read of at least one far right proponent who wants to bring back stoning to death of rebellious children. I don't mind freedom of religion & free speech, something we all have an inalienable right to, but the christian far right wants to get rid of both.

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All you people on the far left seem to share the same "Rosie" mentality. You have a paranoid fear of evangelical Christianity. Homeland Security is not busy protecting us from militant Christians, but militant Muslims who have openly told us that if they get their way we will either convert or die. Your paranoia is selective and hypocritial. You know all this. Christians have no plans to form totoalitarian governments, but Islam sure wants to put you under their totalitarianism! But you are not concerned about that, right? Enough of this right-wing conspiracy garbage. Get real.

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Originally Posted by Tj3

Again, you make these unjustified, unvalidated claims, and no matter whether you are shown otherwise, you keep coming back to the same claims.

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Apparently you don't know what a firmament is in the bible, & you're not aware of the many verses in the bible that says the earth is established that it cannot move. Go back to school & learn some more.

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Originally Posted by Galveston1

All you people on the far left seem to share the same "Rosie" mentality. You have a paranoid fear of evangelical Christianity. Homeland Security is not busy protecting us from militant Christians, but militant Muslims who have openly told us that if they get their way we will either convert or die. Your paranoia is selective and hypocritial. You know all this. Christians have no plans to form totoalitarian governments, but Islam sure wants to put you under their totalitarianism! But you are not concerned about that, right? Enough of this right-wing conspiricy garbage. Get real.

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Apparently you have never heard of the reconstructionists, also called the dominionists. You get real. Wake up & see reality. And while you're at it Google dominionists or reconstructionists.