I apologize... I should never use words like "never". However, I will say that your words will fall on many a' deaf ear. Not because they are "Christ-haters" but because of the "un-Christly" way in which you present yourself.

I am very open to gentle conversation, sir. It was, in fact, your very first response to me that dragged us out of "gentle", as I have witnessed you doing with others.

And Mr. Jackson, you do not know what I believe.

Back on topic... what was it again? Oh yes...

If we found life on another planet, it would definitely throw a kink in the teachings of the Christianity. They would be sinners... for ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. However, they would not be saved for God has sent His ONLY begotten Son to Earth to die for OUR sins. Well, I suppose He may have a Daughter to die for theirs:confused:

[QUOTE=DrJizzle]I apologize... I should never use words like "never". However, I will say that your words will fall on many a' deaf ear. Not because they are "Christ-haters" but because of the "un-Christly" way in which you present yourself. QUOTE]

Even the words of Christ, Himself, fell on many-a-deaf-ear. He and His followers were most definitely the minorities of their time. But there was great power in them-those words.

Apparently, my words aren't falling on too many deaf ears because numerous non-believers continue answering my words and following me into areas that I go to remove myself from the constant nagging. My words must have some kind of an effect, wouldn't you agree? Christ was no wimp. Christ is my example; therefore, I am no wimp. I boldly proclaim what I believe. Christ went into a temple once and found the money changers doing business in the temple (I believe it was on the Sabbath day). He turned all the tables over and began whipping the money changers, sending them on their way. Christ stood up for the truth and was a righteous Man. Peter, though later rebuked by Christ, chopped the ear off a Centurion soldier who was in the process of capturing Jesus Christ. The Apostles weren't wimps either. If Christ, Himself, preached the gospel today as He did in His day, people like you would most likely call Him, "un-Christly."

If this was an islamic thread, I'd jump on their dogma also. Although by definition to my understanding there is no difference between christianity and islam. But If I was an alien visiting Earth I would be afraid of all humans just because because it seems they only holler and fight each other.

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Originally Posted by talaniman

If this was an islamic thread, I'd jump on their dogma also. Although by definition to my understanding there is no difference between christianity and islam. But If I was an alien visiting Earth I would be afraid of all humans just because because it seems they only holler and fight each other.

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Kind of like you're doing now.

Big differences between Chrsitianity and Islam

Don't worry about the aliens and their perspective and feelings... if they come here it will be because they're hungry or need to stop for fuel.

What if they were hippies from another world just looking to party?? Or just being neighborly. What if they were just checking the human seeds they planted eons ago?? The possibilities are endless.

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Big differences between Chrsitianity and Islam

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You both emphasise following tradition as sheep, and forget that a personal relationship with the Creator comes before the books and scriptures of ancient man. There is no difference. Humans make one for their own purposes.

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

....If we found life on another planet, it would definitely throw a kink in the teachings of the Christianity. They would be sinners... for ALL have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. However, they would not be saved for God has sent His ONLY begotten Son to Earth to die for OUR sins. Well, I suppose He may have a Daughter to die for theirs:confused:

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Why do you assume that they obligatorily must have sinned?

The scripture you quote refers to the descendents of Adam and Eve and no one else.
There are angels, for example, who have remained as they were created--sinless.

Psalms 103:20, "Angels, that excel in strength, that do His commandments, hearkening unto the voice of His word."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by talaniman

You both emphasise following tradition as sheep, and forget that a personal relationship with the Creator comes before the books and scriptures of ancient man. There is no difference. Humans make one for their own purposes.

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Islam rejects Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour and Muhammed is the central figure. In Christianity, Jesus Christ is central and all important. Different histories. Different prophecies. Different promises. Different traditions and customs. Much historical conflict. Islam believes that Christians are infidels worthy of death simply for rejecting Muhammed.
Simply put, not the same.

Question, if you are so vehemently opposed to Christianity, why do you continue attaching yourself to a Christian thread? You reject Christ and His teachings. Just be honest, are you simply here to argue? Would you consider yourself a good representative of your belief system?

[QUOTE=talaniman]If this was an islamic thread, I'd jump on their dogma also. QUOTE]

Look towards the top of your screen. You will see a list words. "Home>Society&Culture>Religion>Christianity>Is Earth the only populated planet?" all in that order. See it? Okay. Click on Religion. That will take you to a list of various religions. Islam is listed along with some others. Click on Islam. Bye bye.

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Question, if you are so vehemently opposed to Christianity, why do you continue attaching yourself to a Christian thread? You reject Christ and His teachings. Just be honest, are you simply here to argue? Would you consider yourself a good representative of your belief system?

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I never considered debating as being vehement, nor have I ever said I was against christianity, and that was explained in a previous thread. And yes I consider myself a fairly good representative of my belief system, and in being so can go where ever I want, and state what I believe with the same rights you have. Does it offend you? To bad, get over it. I find those who get defensive have something to hide, so relax and explore the possibilities, before you make me suspicious.

Quote:

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Islam rejects Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour and Muhammed is the central figure. In Christianity, Jesus Christ is central and all important. Different histories. Different prophecies. Different promises. Different traditions and customs. Much historical conflict. Islam believes that Christians are infidels worthy of death simply for rejecting Muhammed.
Simply put, not the same.

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Actually its merely a different perspective, The tree has many branches.

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Islam believes that Christians are infidels worthy of death simply for rejecting Muhammed.

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Until you find evidence of this, don't expect me to take your word, as this is akin to bearing false witness against your brother. Almost as bad as assuming aliens would only come here to eat us.

Aliens wouldn't only come here to eat us, you have to consider our ski slopes, and the unique fun of cow tipping, which is unique to earth, which are among our many attractions.
Seriosuly now, talanimans right. Don't say that they hate christians, unless their religious texts say things to make us seem bad, otherwise it could just be some factions of the religion, not all.

Haha cal, how do you know, there might be other species on other planets that survive being eaten because it's so funny when you tip them over! Any predators can't stop laughing! Talk about evolutionary advantage!

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Originally Posted by ActionJackson

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

I apologize... I should never use words like "never". However, I will say that your words will fall on many a' deaf ear. Not because they are "Christ-haters" but because of the "un-Christly" way in which you present yourself.

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Even the words of Christ, Himself, fell on many-a-deaf-ear. He and His followers were most definitely the minorities of their time. But there was great power in them-those words.

Apparently, my words aren't falling on too many deaf ears because numerous non-believers continue answering my words and following me into areas that I go to remove myself from the constant nagging. My words must have some kind of an effect, wouldn't you agree? Christ was no wimp. Christ is my example; therefore, I am no wimp. I boldly proclaim what I believe. Christ went into a temple once and found the money changers doing business in the temple (I believe it was on the Sabbath day). He turned all the tables over and began whipping the money changers, sending them on their way. Christ stood up for the truth and was a righteous Man. Peter, though later rebuked by Christ, chopped the ear off a Centurion soldier who was in the process of capturing Jesus Christ. The Apostles weren't wimps either. If Christ, Himself, preached the gospel today as He did in His day, people like you would most likely call Him, "un-Christly."

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I don't know what gave you the idea that I thought Christ was a "wimp". Again, that is you assuming that you know me and what I believe. And we all know what happens when one assumes anything.

And don't, not even for a second, pretend that you are Christly. If you existed in Christs day, you would certainly have joined the masses and crucified Him, just as you are so quick to crucify anyone that challenges your beliefs today.

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Originally Posted by Starman

Why do you assume that they obligatorily must have sinned?

The scripture you quote refers to the descendents of Adam and Eve and no one else.
There are angels, for example, who have remained as they were created--sinless.

Psalms 103:20, "Angels, that excel in strength, that do His commandments, hearkening unto the voice of His word."

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Interesting theory. Is there anything that states that the words of the Bible are meant for the descendants of Adam and them only?

Also, you are comparing aliens to angels. If we don't make the distinction between the two, then that could also go to show that Heaven is just like another planet that is populated by aliens (angels).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

Interesting theory. Is there anything that states that the words of the Bible are meant for the descendants of Adam and them only?

Also, you are comparing aliens to angels. If we don't make the distinction between the two, then that could also go to show that Heaven is just like another planet that is populated by aliens (angels).

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Here are the differences:
Only a third of all angels have sinned, Revelation 12:4
While, in contrast, all humans have.

Angels are spirits and we are material.

Psalm 104:4
Who maketh his angels spirits;...

Hebrews 1:7
And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits,.

And more powerful..

2 Peter 2:11
Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.

But there are also very important similarities which far outweigh the physical. For example. Both were created sinless and fully capable of maintaining that sinless condition if they so wished.

"You were blameless in your ways from the day you were created till wickedness was found in you. Through your widespread trade you were filled with violence, and you sinned. So I drove you in disgrace from the mount of God, and I expelled you, O guardian cherub, from among the fiery stones." -- Ezekiel 28:15-16


"This only have I found: God made mankind upright, but men have gone in search of many schemes." -- Ecclesiastes 7:29

Both angels and humans are referred to as God's progeny made in his image. So we are spiritual siblings as it were. The angel which gave John the Revelation made this clear.

Rev 22:
8And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which shewed me these things. 9Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.

There are words in the Bible which might very well be applied to all his other intelligent material creatures if such exist. But the one quoted is directly referring to the Gentiles and Jews[mankind] and doesn't lend itself to universal extrapolation.

To understand the twenty-third verse we have to consider what is written immediately before it. The context of the scripture quoted indicates that it was written for and referring to humans, specifically to the Roman Christians and natural Jews. It was intended as an explanation of the new relationship or of the creation of a spiritual Israel via the New Covenant which came into effect via Jesus' death. The All, mentioned refers to both Jews and Gentiles who are described as equally sinful and equally dependent on Jesus' Ransom sacrifice for forgiveness of sin. This is made clear in the following verses.


Romans 2:
28For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: 29But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Romans 3:
20Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin. 21But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
22Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: 23For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;


Book of Romans - Bible Survey

Are angels aliens?
Well, some might view them that way since they definitely aren't of this Earth as humans are. But the word alien seems to convey a spiritual barrier that doesn't exist between the righteous angels and obedient mankind. I can imagine that it also would become a term that just wouldn't fit in with the discovery of other material creatures who are righteous. Perhaps the horror films have contributed to this negative connotation although I strongly suspect that the word per-se has always been rather harsh toward those it's applied to. Because of this I personally would not think of them that way but rather as our elder spiritual brothers who were present and cheered when God created the Earth.

Job 38
1Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,

2Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?

3Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me.

4Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? Declare, if thou hast understanding.

5Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? Or who hath stretched the line upon it?

6Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? Or who laid the corner stone thereof;

7When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?



Is heaven a planet?

This reminds me of the Star Trek film where a Vulcan, [Spock's brother] goes searching for God on a deserted planet surrounded by some typew of barrier. No, there is no biblical basis to believe that heaven is a planet. Actually, I fail to see how a partial comparison of angels to humans can lead to that drastic conclusion. Can you explain how?

Wow... great post, very insightful.

Lets see... I made that comparison because of the comparison of Angels to aliens. Aliens basically being a material being not of this planet. Angels are similar but, as you said, are spiritual, or on another plane of existence.

Heaven could be considered the same way... another planet but one that is spiritual, or on another plane of existence.

[i better say, I am not well versed in Mormonism... what I say next is based on what I know of Mormonism... it may or may not be true or exact... or may just be specific sects of the religion]
What about the Mormon aspect to this. They believe in Jesus Christ and they believe that Heaven is, in fact, another planet. They also believe that if they live a good enough life that they can become a God and will rule their own Heaven, or planet. And I think they believe it will be populated by their children's heavenly bodies, which is why it is custom to have many children.

While I think that religion is a ways off the mark, it can't be that absurd of me to make that comparison.

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

wow... great post, very insightful.

Lets see... I made that comparison because of the comparison of Angels to aliens. Aliens basically being a material being not of this planet. Angels are similar but, as you said, are spiritual, or on another plane of existence.

Heaven could be considered the same way... another planet but one that is spiritual, or on another plane of existence.

[i better say, I am not well versed in Mormonism... what I say next is based on what I know of Mormonism... it may or may not be true or exact... or may just be specific sects of the religion]
What about the Mormon aspect to this. They believe in Jesus Christ and they believe that Heaven is, in fact, another planet. They also believe that if they live a good enough life that they can become a God and will rule their own Heaven, or planet. And I think they believe it will be populated by their children's heavenly bodies, which is why it is custom to have many children.

While I think that religion is a ways off the mark, it can't be that absurd of me to make that comparison.

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Which comparison are you referring to?

I have just recently become better acquainted with the LDS viewpoint which is completely opposite to that of mainstream Christianity. You are right. They believe the biblical God almighty was once a mortal man who was glorified to Godhood and is now actually just one among many other Gods almighties who were also glorified to the position. Of course they do not rely just on the NT and OT to support this view but also on other writings--especially those of their prophet John Smith.

But coming back on subject, under such a theology then, of course the universe would be teaming with multiple universes ruled by multiple procreating married Gods and populated by humans who also aspire to become Gods almighties themselves.

Here is a site which clarifies the LDS doctrine a bit:
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

Apology offered:
Provided official site as requested:

Also, I did not say that the LDS considered these other "Gods" above the biblical one.
But if there are any other LDS doctrinal errors you feel I made feel free to point them out.

BTW
It is estimated that there are more stars in our universe than all the grains of sands on all the beaches on Earth put together--which makes it rather difficult to imagine that they are completely devoid of planetary life.

Is your edit in regards to Laceys comment?

Anywhoo...

Im getting a little confused but I believe the comparison that I was referring to is the one which you questioned here:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Starman

Actually, I fail to see how a partial comparison of angels to humans can lead to that drastic conclusion. Can you explain how?

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And yes, I agree about Mormonism. It is not based on what we know as the OT and NT now but other "lost" scriptures of the same Bible.

I find it odd how these scriptures can be so much different that the "accepted" ones.

So if that were true and our universe is somehow mingled with these other universes, then would they lie on the same plane or realm? Or are they spiritual? If they are just spiritual (not meaning that in a derogatory way whatsoever), then is it even fair to acknowledge them as another planet as intended in the opening post?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

Interesting theory. Is there anything that states that the words of the Bible are meant for the descendants of Adam and them only?

Also, you are comparing aliens to angels. If we dont make the distinction between the two, then that could also go to show that Heaven is just like another planet that is populated by aliens (angels).

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If you would actually read the Bible you would know beyond a shadow of a doubt that the words of the Bible were written to, for, and about them. Just read "the begats" found in Genesis.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by talaniman

Until you find evidence of this, don't expect me to take your word, as this is akin to bearing false witness against your brother. Almost as bad as assuming aliens would only come here to eat us.

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One post you're all about perspective, then you want evidence and proof, then you're about perspective, then facts, then perspective, then facts. Whew... If I had only had your mood swings as a teen... I wouldn't have needed all those drugs.

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Originally Posted by rr man

Has God created beings on other planets besides Earth? And if so, are there also sinners in those worlds?

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Actually, when our astronauts landed on the moon, there were sinners there. About as close and anyone can ever prove that sinners (or life of any kind) existed anywhere other than earth.

Thanks Starman for the edit. WE LDS sometimes get misquoted and misunderstood and I appreciate your willingness to seek the truth about us. There is not a whole lot of discussion in the church about other Gods although we do strive to be worthly to become one after this life.WE take this scripture literaly: Romans 8: 17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. Of course we will never be equal with Jesus. He is the only begotten son and we can never have the glory that he has. Also I have never heard of the other planet idea. May be taught somewhere but as a life long member not familiar to me. WE do however believe that other worlds have been created but again not much more than that is discussed. It is not a large part of our doctrine. I have to assume that there are many things that I don't know about this creation and any others and my salvation really doesn't depend on that anyway. Great posts. I have enjoyed the discussions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

Is your edit in regards to Laceys comment?

Anywhoo....

Im getting a little confused but i believe the comparison that i was referring to is the one which you questioned here:


And yes, I agree about Mormonism. It is not based on what we know as the OT and NT now but other "lost" scriptures of the same Bible.

I find it odd how these scriptures can be so much different that the "accepted" ones.

So if that were true and our universe is somehow mingled with these other universes, then would they lie on the same plane or realm? or are they spiritual? If they are just spiritual (not meaning that in a derogatory way whatsoever), then is it even fair to acknowledge them as another planet as intended in the opening post?

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Yes, the edit was in response to Lacy's feedback.


I'm not certain what the LDS teachings are in respect to these universes. But below is a very informative article on the multiverse subject.

Multiverse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



There's also the theory which attempts to explain the Big Bang as being a consequence of the collision between as branes [short for membranes] or dimensions. Some scientists who prefer this explanation don't rule out the possibility of life in these other dimensions if they do exist.

The following site offers an explanation about the this.

'Brane-Storm' Challenges Part of Big Bang Theoryt

Actually, God's heaven itself seems to fit the description of another dimension since it seems reserved for nonmaterial things and humans who are said to be admitted there must undergo a transformation.

"flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God" (1 Cor. 15:50).


BTW

One thing to keep in mind is that the definition of a planet is one which necessitates three dimensionality. So strictly speaking, residents of other dimensional realms might live in or on places which don't fit the spherical requirements of the planetary category.

Starman, I tried reading the Wikipedia seemed very complicated to me even with a college education. BUt I can except another plane or dimension that we can't see. I believe we can't see it because it is a spiritual existence and has humans we don't have the perception of that plane. Best explained maybe as a veil. Very thin and sometimes you can almost feel there is more out there but never fully able to see. I believe that is where our spirits go after our earthly death. I am not sure I explained myself very well here. Just my thoughts and they are worth what you paid for them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lacey5765

Starman, I tried reading the Wikipedia seemed very complicated to me even with a college education. BUt I can except another plane or dimension that we can't see. I believe we can't see it because it is a spiritual existence and has humans we don't have the perception of that plane. Best explained maybe as a veil. Very thin and sometimes you can almost feel there is more out there but never fully able to see. I believe that is where our spirits go after our earthly death. I am not sure I explained myself very well here. Just my thoughts and they are worth what you paid for them.

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Although Christ was visible after His resurrection and Thomas was able to put his hand in the pierced side of Christ. Somehow that plane on the other side can be visible but it would seem that only under miraculous conditions.

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Originally Posted by ActionJackson

If you would actually read the Bible you would know beyond a shadow of a doubt that the words of the Bible were written to, for, and about them. Just read "the begats" found in Genesis.

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There you go assuming things once again.

Interpretation of the Bible is key. The way that you interpret the Bible, or rather the way that you were taught to think the Bible should be interpreted, I assure you is quite different than my interpretation.

This is where Christians like you make assumptions about the Bible because, "well, thats just the way it is," and "if you actually read it, you would just know that." Rather than actually having any real insight on the matter. And yet, you discount other interpretations simply because that's the way that your "Religion" has taught you to think of it.

I did not say that I disagree with anything that you believe. And yet you continue to assume that I do. I have, however, asked you why you believe the way that you do. But your mind is closed to that as so many others are.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Starman

Actually, God's heaven itself seems to fit the description of another dimension since it seems reserved for nonmaterial things and humans who are said to be admitted there must undergo a transformation.

"flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God" (1 Cor. 15:50).


BTW

One thing to keep in mind is that the definition of a planet is one which necessitates three dimensionality. So strictly speaking, residents of other dimensional realms might live in or on places which don't fit the spherical requirements of the planetary category.

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I could not agree more. And due to this, we cannot assume that Angels are then, in relation to "aliens". Would that be correct?

If so, then we know of no other intelligent beings (of this dimension?) that are capable of life without sin. This is one of the attributes which we so highly regard of Jesus Christ, himself.

Either way, we do not know whether they would be without sin or not. But if they were not without sin, is there a chance or a way in which they could ever be saved?


**side note... and not to bring you into anything that you are not a part of... but Starman is one of a handful of strong and intelligent Christians on this board, capable of intelligent thought, supportive information, and open-mindedness. I appreciate that.

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

There you go assuming things once again.

Interpretation of the Bible is key. The way that you interpret the Bible, or rather the way that you were taught to think the Bible should be interpreted, I assure you is quite different than my interpretation.

This is where Christians like you make assumptions about the Bible because, "well, thats just the way it is," and "if you actually read it, you would just know that." Rather than actually having any real insight on the matter. And yet, you discount other interpretations simply because thats the way that your "Religion" has taught you to think of it.

I did not say that I disagree with anything that you believe. And yet you continue to assume that I do. I have, however, asked you why you believe the way that you do. But your mind is closed to that as so many others are.

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There you go again "assuming" you know what I think.

I believe in Cause and Affect. I believe that there can only be 1 first cause and that Cause is God. God was uncaused for if He had been caused, He would not be the first Cause. Therefore, God is eternal.

I believe that God created the world in a literal 6 day period for the Bible says that the evening and the morning were the first day and the evening and the morning were the second day... etc.

I believe that God had a specific plan or blueprint for creation and that all was created perfect and that He looked on His Creation and found it to be good.

I believe that the first sinner was the archangel, Lucifer. I believe that Lucifer was as subtle as a serpent and that he deceived Eve into disobeying God's direct command not to partake of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. I do not believe that the fruit of that tree was a literal apple or orange but rather a philosophy that was contrary to God's plan for Adam and his posterity.

I believe that by disobeying God, Adam and Eve suffered the consequences; were cast out of the garden of Eden; and were bound to live in an unperfect world.

I believe that the "man" and "woman" created in the 1st chapter of Genesis were created simultaneously and that they were created from thin air, fiat. I believe that Adam was later formed from the dust of the ground after God had rested on the seventh day and that Eve was subsequently formed from one of Adam's ribs. Adam was formed from pre-existing matter unlike those "created" from thin air. "Created" and "formed" are two different words with two different meanings.

I believe that the Bible is a history of Adam's posterity specifically that portion of his seed that is traced through Seth through to Heber to Noah then through Shem to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (later called Israel), then to the twelve sons of Israel who's posterity is the twelve tribes of Israel.

The Bible is full of history (His Story); life lessons; guidelines for living in the form of moral law; prophecy; examples of blessings and punishments. I believe that the Old Testament is the rock solid foundation on which the New Testament stands. I believe that the New Testament is the continuing history of the Old Testament. I believe that Jesus was an Israelite Who's lineage is traceable to the tribes of Judah (the King tribe) and Levi (the priest tribe). I believe that all 12 Apostles were also Israelites of one tribe or the other. Paul proclaimed to be of the tribe of Benjamin.

I believe that there is much of the Bible that has been fulfilled and some that has not been fulfilled. I reject the "rapture" theory that says that right before the end time tribulation, Christians will be raptured away. I believe that earth is a testing ground for mankind. God is looking for the faithful and steadfast believers who can withstand the trials to come (just as the Christians of the Dark Ages or the Christians persecuted by the Bolsheviks during the Russian Revolution withstood those trying times).

Should I continue? Much more that I could say but don't want to bore anyone.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DrJizzle

I could not agree more. And due to this, we cannot assume that Angels are then, in relation to "aliens". Would that be correct?

If so, then we know of no other intelligent beings (of this dimension?) that are capable of life without sin. This is one of the attributes which we so highly regard of Jesus Christ, himself.

Either way, we do not know whether they would be without sin or not. But if they were not without sin, is there a chance or a way in which they could ever be saved?


**side note... and not to bring you into anything that you are not a part of... but Starman is one of a handful of strong and intelligent Christians on this board, capable of intelligent thought, supportive information, and open-mindedness. I appreciate that.

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Righteous angels aliens? I have difficulty viewing them that way. More like friendly big brothers.

Angels

However, rebel angels, with their self-destructive unrepentant hate-motivated behavior, which can even take the form of possession of humans and animals, and their eagerness to produce hybrid nephilim during the pre-flood days comes across as very alien to me.

I agree, that we can't assume anything in relation to any other possible creature made in God's image except that it was created sinless and that if it is now in sin it is because it willingly chose that path or was born into sin as humans are now. The following scripture describes God's creation as perfect not sinful.

Deuteronomy 32:4
He is the Rock, his work is perfect: for all his ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he.

Those in sin would be in need of redemption. I would say that there would be a way to redeem such creatures by using the same method that was used to redeem us--a life for life sacrifice. In my opinion

BTW

Thank you for the commendation.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lacey5765

Starman, I tried reading the Wikipedia seemed very complicated to me even with a college education. BUt I can except another plane or dimension that we can't see. I believe we can't see it because it is a spiritual existence and has humans we don't have the perception of that plane. Best explained maybe as a veil. Very thin and sometimes you can almost feel there is more out there but never fully able to see. I believe that is where our spirits go after our earthly death. I am not sure I explained myself very well here. Just my thoughts and they are worth what you paid for them.

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Ultimately our perception is simply the interpretation of neural impulses sent in coded fashion and interpreted by the human brain in a predetermined way. So as long as we are fettered by our senses, the nomena --ultimate reality], will remain beyond our grasp. But this would apply to all other creatures as well, both terrestrial and extraterrestrial. What is red to us might seem green to them. What feels rough to us might feel smooth to them. What is bitter to us might taste sweet to them. What is pleasure to us might be pleasurable to them. What appears as bright to us might appear dark to them. This can be said of all the senses. In short, we could have a universe of creatures each species living within its perceived universe which to the other species either doesn't exist or is completely out of sensorial range. Imagine an attempt to reason with such creatures! If indeed such is the case, then that would perhaps explain the reason why God chose to create the vast distances which keep us apart. In my opinion


BTW
I agree, the article is not an easy read and sometimes scientists and science writers aren't very lucid in their explanations. I personally have difficulty with the dimensionality concept due to its ultimate location paradox requirements which physicists accept tongue-in cheek via hypothetically imagining all these universes within a dimension which contains them. But that sets up the problem of what contains that dimension ad infinitum. Only God knows the truth.

Luke 18:27
And he said, The things which are impossible with men are possible with God.

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In short, we could have a universe of creatures each species living within its perceived universe which to the other species either doesn't exist or is completely out of sensorial range. Imagine an attempt to reason with such creatures! If indeed such is the case, then that would perhaps explain the reason why God chose to create the vast distances which keep us apart. In my opinion

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Very good post Starman, and I think it can apply to humanity today, as we know the world is covered with humans who have evolved with many interpretations of their limited universes, to explain life as they see it. This changes as there is more interactions with those of opposing views, and the free exchange of methods or ideas take place. As humans all the tribes of the earth are caught in the conflict of promoting their own particular view point, as history tells us many wars, and much blood has been spilled, in the pursuit of extending influence, and gaining power, through Control of resources under the guise of religious belief, and divine power assumed by those to control the masses. All the religions of the Earth have used God as their battle cry to exterminate or dominate other humans, in this push for power and control. I imagine the same thing plays out on other populated planets in the same way, and someday we on Earth will stop the killing, to rise above the restraints of our own boundaries, and meet new life among the stars that have hopefully gone through the same changes and have bridged the distance you have mentioned. But first we must bridge the differences here on earth.

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Originally Posted by talaniman

As humans all the tribes of the earth are caught in the conflict of promoting their own particular view point, as history tells us many wars, and much blood has been spilled, in the pursuit of extending influence, and gaining power, thru Control of resources under the guise of religious belief, and divine power assumed by those to control the masses. .

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Under the guise of religious beliefs like Bolshevik Communists (who believed in the religions of humanism and evolution) or under the guise of non-religious beliefs i.e. Nazism, Fascism, or even ultra-Capitalism. Not all the woes of the world can be blamed on some religion run amuck

You missed my point. Its not the religion, but the peole who use it to justify their actions at the expense of human life and suffering. There is always some excuse to justify the mass killing, and carnage, and it always traces back to human greed, and not having a value, or respect for life.

Anyone who blames religion for all the earths wars, is overimplifying the matter, different wars are created by different things, and its not religion that causes wars of faith, but difference of religion, or religion being used to justify illogical and immoral behaviour.
I also believe that war is just another way of humanity expressing its hate for its own kind, its discontent with the fact that we do not have that one thing that we think will bring happiness, that maybe they are holding it back from us, and that we must take from them to be happy, also the misguided and selfish belief that they are other nations, and that we must be the superior nation, and that we are always right. When the truth is, we are all descended from the same, we are in fact all a huge family, any differences among us just caused either by will of god, or tiny mutations and chance within or genes. We are in fact, all human, and we all share the same loneliness, the same feelings that we are right, and the same misguided belief that we can be truly happy and satisfied by things other than god. Thankfully, there is a god, and he has shown us a path to happiness, and provided us all with a purpose, and he loves us, regardlesss of race, creed, intent, desire or nation.

Auttajasi agrees: Yep. If there are others out there, I think it is very likely that there are atheists.

I would just like to point out that I didn't say that at all. In fact I was saying that I wasn't sure if I agreed with talaniman on the atheism front.

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Originally Posted by Capuchin

Auttajasi agrees: Yep. If there are others out there, I think it is very likely that there are atheists.

I would just like to point out that I didn't say that at all. In fact I was saying that I wasn't sure if i agreed with talaniman on the atheism front.

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Yea, I realized that you were ambiguous about it. Unfortunately, I didn't write the "Auttajasi agrees" part. I was merely stating that I believe there are other atheists out there. Maybe I should have said it in the form of a new post rather than a reputation point. Sorry if my post made it seem that you were taking a stance.
Lesson learned. :-)

Hehe, I don't mind the extra rating, esspecially with all the people reading things into what I have said tonight.

I don't think that one data point is enough to extrapolate what other beings would be like from.

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Originally Posted by Autajasi

Auttajasi agrees: They are not that different from the Bible. Nothing in LDS scripture directly contradicts that which is in the Bible. Again, the reoccuring theme in this forum is that we all read, see, hear, and think things each from our own lens of life.

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Hmmm... that can be arguable... Simply based on interpretation. Then again, there are many books that some may consider blasphemous that can be said to not contradict anything in the Bible.

And I agree 100% to your last statement ;)