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Originally Posted by
dwashbur
Seriously? What does this have to do with anything? In terms of what I said, it's meaningless. I have no idea what your point is.
It has to do with identifying the Real Christ by looking at His mother's new species of humanity who bore a new species of Adam.
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Again I have to say: seriously? I never mentioned "original sin" because as far as I'm concerned, there's no such thing. It's a Catholic invention that has no basis in the Bible, and I see no reason to buy it. You referred to the "stain of Adam." As Romans 5 tells us, in Adam all die. That's what this "stain" is. Not some speculative "original sin" that's separate from everything else; that's so much theological straw-grasping. It was through Adam that we were born fallible. Not Adam and Eve, just Adam. That's why Jesus could be sinless without Mary having to be anything special, because that "taint" comes through Adam, i.e. the father. Jesus didn't have a human father. QED. There's no need for Mary's human sinfulness to enter into it at all.
Roman 5 teaches that sin entered the world which by extension brought death. It is explicit in Romans 5:12, ". . . sin entered into this world, and by sin death" The first cause of death is sin. Death didn't enter the world and cause sin. If we don't include Eve in the equation how do we get from Adam to you? Obviously, the natural laws require Eve. Sin isn't transmitted through bodily like a genetic defect, rather it is transmitted generationally. Sin transmitted by genetic material could be done away with by creating an antibody, an anti-sin serum.
John Eck writes of the lack of original justice:
Original Sin is that men are born without the fear of God and without trust in God, is to be entirely rejected, since it is manifest to every Christian that to be without the fear of God and without trust in God is rather the actual guilt of an adult than the offence of a recently-born infant, which does not possess as yet the full use of reason, as the Lord says "Your children which had no knowledge between good and evil," Deut 1:39. (Johann Eck, The Confutatio Pontificia, 1530)
At one time Adam and Eve communed with God, Adam spoke to God and God spoke to Adam, like Moses, they spoke "face to face". Adam having freewill was one with God (oneness such expressed in John 6:57 and John 17:21-22). "God saw all the things that he had made, and they were very good." God did not, and does not, make evil. Expulsion from Eden is God's justice for original sin was done through a privation of abiding in God and God abiding in us.
The transmission isn't through the blood, it is not physically inheritance. That's because we bear the fault of sin as a member of the community of humans:
"An individual can be considered either as an individual or as part of a whole, a member of a society . . . . Considered in the second way an act can be his although he has not done it himself, nor has it been done by his free will but by the rest of the society or by its head, the nation being considered as doing what the prince does. For a society is considered as a single man of whom the individuals are the different members (St. Paul, 1 Corinthians 12). Thus the multitude of men who receive their human nature from Adam is to be considered as a single community or rather as a single body . . . . If the man, whose privation of original justice is due to Adam, is considered as a private person, this privation is not his 'fault', for a fault is essentially voluntary. If, however, we consider him as a member of the family of Adam, as if all men were only one man, then his privation partakes of the nature of sin on account of its voluntary origin, which is the actual sin of Adam" (De Malo, 4, 1).
That is to say, if we were members of a kingdom and the king unjustly makes war against the emperor and loses. The entire kingdom suffers a just retribution of atonement and contrition. The small children of the kingdom who were incapable of making war have an atonement levied against them, as well as a contrite attitude toward the emperor or they are expelled. Quod Erat Faciendum
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This whole thing collapses in on itself when we realize one simple fact: there is no such thing as a "new Adam."
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And "original justice" is just as unbiblical as "original sin." Which is to say, there's no such thing. It's another Catholic invention that the rest of us reject. You are welcome to keep throwing your Catholic talking points at us, but very few are going to buy them.
I've shown otherwise.
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Oh, and as for the whole "word made flesh" as opposed to "flesh and blood"? Have you ever read Luke 24:39? They're all perfectly good Greek figures of speech, and they all mean the same thing.
In the cited passage of Luke is found the Person of Christ risen. The same body hung on the Cross with the same Divine Soul, the Second Person of the Trinity who is wholly God and wholly man, Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity the Real Christ.
