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Originally Posted by mountain_man

If you don't believe in the so called "evil bible God" than why are you even asking questions about the Bible, Jesus, and prophesies?

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I show the absurdities of the bible for two reasons. One is to get christians to think about what they believe, the absurdities of it. God didn't give us a reasoning mind just so we would reject it in favor of taking things on faith alone. God gave us a mind to gather knowledge of his creation through observation & questions for the purpose of learning of God through It's only revelation, creation itself. The second & more important reason is because I'm battling the far right for freedom. The far right has an agenda, & it is to turn America, indeed, the world, into a totalitarian theocracy, getting rid of separation of church & state, free speech, freedom of religion, & where it's illegal to be anything but a christian. I have read direct quotes from the far right stating that they want to deny religious liberty to all non-christians. I read of at least one far right proponent who wants to bring back stoning to death of rebellious children. I don't mind freedom of religion & free speech, something we all have an inalienable right to, but the christian far right wants to get rid of both.

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Originally Posted by deist

I show the absurdities of the bible for two reasons. One is to get christians to think about what they believe, the absurdities of it. God didn't give us a reasoning mind just so we would reject it in favor of taking things on faith alone. God gave us a mind to gather knowledge of his creation through observation & questions for the purpose of learning of God through It's only revelation, creation itself. The second & more important reason is because I'm battling the far right for freedom. The far right has an agenda, & it is to turn America, indeed, the world, into a totalitarian theocracy, getting rid of separation of church & state, free speech, freedom of religion, & where it's illegal to be anything but a christian. I have read direct quotes from the far right stating that they want to deny religious liberty to all non-christians. I read of at least one far right proponent who wants to bring back stoning to death of rebellious children. I don't mind freedom of religion & free speech, something we all have an inalienable right to, but the christian far right wants to get rid of both.

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Thank you. The "far right agenda" that you describe is insane; I am completely against those things as well. Although I don't believe the Bible is at all absurb and still use my reasoning mind daily. We are all free to choose and live in a free country with certain rights.

I am only semi-familiar with Deism; what God do you believe in and who is Jesus to you? I am not concerned with the rules, etc just personally?

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Originally Posted by mountain_man

Thank you. The "far right agenda" that you describe is insane; I am completely against those things as well. Although I don't believe the Bible is at all absurb and still use my reasoning mind daily. We are all free to choose and live in a free country with certain rights.

I am only semi-familiar with Deism; what God do you believe in and who is Jesus to you? I am not concerned with the rules, etc just personally?

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I Believe in a God whose only miracle was in creating the universe. It doesn't intervene in the affairs of man. It hasn't given us any holy books, those are all man-made for the purpose of controlling others through fear. There was no Adam & Eve, more than two humans evolved simultaneously. So there is no original sin & no need for a savior. There is no devil or angels or demons, & Jesus is not God's son. I don't know if there is life after death or not, some deists believe there is, some don't. I believe that what is important to God is how well we treat one another & not what we believe. If you're a good person God doesn't care if you're a christian, a deist, a buddhist, or an atheist. If there is to be a judgment I believe it will be based on this.

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Originally Posted by deist

I Believe in a God whose only miracle was in creating the universe. It doesn't intervene in the affairs of man. It hasn't given us any holy books, those are all man-made for the purpose of controlling others through fear. There was no Adam & Eve, more than two humans evolved simultaneously. So there is no original sin & no need for a savior. There is no devil or angels or demons, & Jesus is not God's son. I don't know if there is life after death or not, some deists believe there is, some don't. I believe that what is important to God is how well we treat one another & not what we believe. If you're a good person God doesn't care if you're a christian, a deist, a buddhist, or an atheist. If there is to be a judgment I believe it will be based on this.

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OK. Why would God create a earth/universe and then just abandon it; not to care about the people or anything on it again.

That doesn't make sense to me, that would be like an artist creating an exquiste work of art and then covering it and putting it in the corner, never to look at again?

What reasoning brought you to this conclusion/your belief?

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Originally Posted by mountain_man

OK. Why would God create a earth/universe and then just abandon it; not to care about the people or anything on it again.

That doesn't make sense to me, that would be like an artist creating an exquiste work of art and then covering it and putting it in the corner, never to look at again?

What reasoning brought you to this conclusion/your belief?

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I find that reality as it really is lines up more with the teachings of deism than with those of the bible. I've been a christian, & I learned over more than 27 years of personal experience that the bible doesn't line up with reality.

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Originally Posted by deist

I find that reality as it really is lines up more with the teachings of deism than with those of the bible. I've been a christian, & I learned over more than 27 years of personal experience that the bible doesn't line up with reality.

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Maybe not the reality as we see it in our finite minds? How does the Bible not line up with reality? You say you were a christian (follower of Christ) for 27 years and abadoned it and now don't believe that Jesus is the son of God, then did you ever believe in that? Do you believe in "once saved always saved"

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Originally Posted by mountain_man

Maybe not the reality as we see it in our finite minds? How does the Bible not line up with reality? You say you were a christian (follower of Christ) for 27 years and abadoned it and now don't believe that Jesus is the son of God, then did you ever believe in that? Do you believe in "once saved always saved"

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Seeing as I no longer believe in the bible I do not believe any longer that Jesus is divine in any way. As a christian I believed in the perseverance of the saints, but as I said, I no longer believe the bible. The bible says if you pray to the bible god according to his will he hears & answers. That was not my experience, in reality as it really is not one of my thousands of prayers prayed over those more than 27 years were answered. Deism answers for me the questions that the bible couldn't answer.

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Originally Posted by deist

Seeing as I no longer believe in the bible I do not believe any longer that Jesus is divine in any way. As a christian I believed in the perseverance of the saints, but as I said, I no longer believe the bible. The bible says if you pray to the bible god according to his will he hears & answers. That was not my experience, in reality as it really is not one of my thousands of prayers prayed over those more than 27 years were answered. Deism answers for me the questions that the bible couldn't answer.

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It sounds like it was a difficult 27 years for you? I know it sucks that prayers sometimes don't come when and how we want them to or for what we think are the most important things.

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Originally Posted by deist

Seeing as I no longer believe in the bible I do not believe any longer that Jesus is divine in any way. As a christian I believed in the perseverance of the saints, but as I said, I no longer believe the bible. The bible says if you pray to the bible god according to his will he hears & answers. That was not my experience, in reality as it really is not one of my thousands of prayers prayed over those more than 27 years were answered. Deism answers for me the questions that the bible couldn't answer.

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I would be interested in why you believe that your prayers were not answered. Remember, God is not a slave who must do what we ask, so often the answer is not the answer that we hoped for. I have had many times in my life when the answer that I wanted did not come, but God answered in a way that I would have never thought about.

Also, the answer may be "no". Do you have children? Have you ever seen a case where they wanted something so badly that they thought that they needed it, but you knew that it would not be good for them, so you said no? God, as a good and caring God, know what is best for us also, and often, despite our pleading, also has to say "no".

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Originally Posted by Tj3

I would be interested in why you believe that your prayers were not answered. Remember, God is not a slave who must do what we ask, so often the answer is not the answer that we hoped for. I have had many times in my life when the answer that I wanted did not come, but God answered in a way that I would have never thought about.

Also, the answer may be "no". Do you have children? Have you ever seen a case where they wanted something so badly that they thought that they needed it, but you knew that it would not be good for them, so you said no? God, as a good and caring God, know what is best for us also, and often, despite our pleading, also has to say "no".

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See the thread "christian prayer" & my question there which started the thread.

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Originally Posted by deist

How do christians explain Jesus' failed prophecies ? Here are only two among several.
Matthew 10:23, Jesus told his disciples that he would return before they could go over all the cities of Israel with the gospel. The gospel has since been preached all throughout Israel, & continues to be so with christian television now, & still Jesus hasn't returned.
Mark 14:62, Jesus told the high priest that he would live to see Jesus' second coming. Of course the high priest died before Jesus returned.
So there is two false prophecies made by Jesus. Any explanations ?

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Consider the possibility that Jesus was referring to his resurrection. You look at things with a closed mind trying to relate millennial prophesies to other prophesies

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Originally Posted by deist

I show the absurdities of the bible for two reasons. One is to get christians to think about what they believe, the absurdities of it. God didn't give us a reasoning mind just so we would reject it in favor of taking things on faith alone. God gave us a mind to gather knowledge of his creation through observation & questions for the purpose of learning of God through It's only revelation, creation itself. The second & more important reason is because I'm battling the far right for freedom. The far right has an agenda, & it is to turn America, indeed, the world, into a totalitarian theocracy, getting rid of separation of church & state, free speech, freedom of religion, & where it's illegal to be anything but a christian. I have read direct quotes from the far right stating that they want to deny religious liberty to all non-christians. I read of at least one far right proponent who wants to bring back stoning to death of rebellious children. I don't mind freedom of religion & free speech, something we all have an inalienable right to, but the christian far right wants to get rid of both.

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Friend, this statement is utterly ridiculous! You have exposed your ageda. If Christians wanted to have enforced "Christianity" they could have done so at the founding of this nation, in as much as nearly all of the founders believed in Jesus Christ. It is absured to think that Christians would attempt to enforce their beliefs on olthers, because it is impossible to be a Christian unless one wants to be one. Is it possible that you want is to silence any voice that dares to point out your sin for what it is?

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Originally Posted by Galveston1

Friend, this statement is utterly ridiculous! You have exposed your ageda. If Christians wanted to have enforced "Christianity" they could have done so at the founding of this nation, in as much as nearly all of the founders believed in Jesus Christ. It is absured to think that Christians would attempt to enforce their beliefs on olthers, because it is impossible to be a Christian unless one wants to be one. Is it possible that you want is to silence any voice that dares to point out your sin for what it is?

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You have a skewed understanding of the founding of the US, no doubt propagated by the far right. Most of the founding fathers were deists, masons, & unitarians. Few were christians. If you doubt my words then maybe you ought to read article 11 of the treaty of Tripoli, signed by president John Adams himself & ratified by congress in 1797. Article 11 in part reads that the US government is in NO sense founded on the christian religion. The US was founded as a secular nation. Why do you think the constitution guarantees separation of church & state ?

After Christ was killed on the cross and sealed in the tomb, he appeared to them after three days.
You are correct that a lot of the founding fathers were not Christians but they had no problem with Christains or anyone believing as they wished to believe.
May the force be with you.

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Originally Posted by magprob

After Christ was killed on the cross and sealed in the tomb, he appeared to them after three days.
You are correct that a lot of the founding fathers were not Christians but they had no problem with Christains or anyone believing as they wished to believe.
May the force be with you.

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I have a problem with anyone who wants to turn America into a totalitarian theocracy where it is illegal to be anything other than christian, & that's what the far right wants.

Just as testimonial... Ever since I started asking and praying sincerely, so far I've had many if almost all of my prayers answered.

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Originally Posted by brookeleigh

Im very new! If you can go answer my question though I would appreciate it so much!!

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To whom are you speaking, & what is the question ?

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Originally Posted by deist

You're wrong about me not believing in God. I am a deist, & deists believe in God, just not your evil bible god.

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Jesus Christ is the God of the Bible. Promised to Eve, prophecied about by the O.T. prophets, conceived by the Holy Ghost, identified by the angel Gabriel as "God with us". Jesus identified Himself as the Son of God, and claimed equality with God. ("I and the Father are one") expressing complete unity with the Father. He proved His claims by His control over natural forces, unclean spirits, sickness and death. Then this God that you call "evil" volunteered to endure a Roman flogging and death by crucifixion, probably the most brutal death ever conceived by the mind of man, so that all mankind (including yourself) would not have to suffer eternal judgment. He arose from the dead to seal the deal. What evil do you see here? You owe Him an apology. Now I understand that you believe none of this despite multiple correaborating records, but your unbelief affects no one but you.

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Originally Posted by Galveston1

Jesus Christ is the God of the Bible. Promised to Eve, prophecied about by the O.T. prophets, conceived by the Holy Ghost, identified by the angel Gabriel as "God with us". Jesus identified Himself as the Son of God, and claimed equality with God. ("I and the Father are one") expressing complete unity with the Father. He proved His claims by His control over natural forces, unclean spirits, sickness and death. Then this God that you call "evil" volunteered to endure a Roman flogging and death by crucifixion, probably the most brutal death ever conceived by the mind of man, so that all mankind (including yourself) would not have to suffer eternal judgment. He arose from the dead to seal the deal. What evil do you see here? You owe Him an apology. Now I understand that you believe none of this despite multiple correaborating records, but your unbelief affects no one but you.

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Where is your multiple corraborating records ? There are none outside the bible. You are guilty of using the bible to prove the bible & that is circular reasoning. Nowhere in the New Testament does the angel Gabriel call Jesus Immanuel (god with us), in fact, nowhere in the entire New Testament is Jesus called Immanuel outside Matthew's reference to a prophecy that didn't even refer to Jesus, but to Isaiah's own son born by a prophetess (probably his wife). The evil bible god drowned millions of young children & unborn babies, who had committed no personal sins, who didn't even understand the concept of good or evil. The evil bible god says, It's my way or hell damnit ! He sounds like a mean bully throwing a tantrum. You have been brainwashed by fundamentalism. The true God is good, nothing at all like the evil bible god.

Jesus was referring to the Holly Spirit which is the spirit of God/jesus. All the proffecies of Jesus' first coming were fulfilled to the T. theses were written many years before his birth and they all came to pass. All the prophesies of his second coming have also been fulfilled including the creation of the country Isreal which happened in 1946 after the first world war. So jesus can come anytime, even now as I type but the Bible says not even the Angels know only God Knows. Jesus talks of the signs of his coming he does not give a timeframe!