Quote:

---

I was spanked up until the age of 6 when reasoning took over. My parents reasoned right and wrong with me. So, I tried it with my kids, younger than 6, and guess what, it worked.

---

Well it doesn't work with my son. Do you think I started spanking? No, I started spanking when he showed no respect for me or my husband, or anything we had to say. I tried reasoning with him, he laughed at me. I tried redirection, he didn't take any interest.

So I guess the only answer is to let him run all over me and my husband. I mean why not, most kids these days are allowed to do whatever they want. Why should mine be any different.

NS, hun, you are young, kids don't come with a set of instructions. If they do please tell me and I'll see if I can download them. LOL

2 years old is too young for reasoning. Redirection is an art form.

I have got it down to a look now. I just have to look at my 5 year old and he redirects himself.

As I said, we all have different ways of parenting. I don't think spanking is wrong, but should be reserved for very serious infractions only.

See, my husband has that "look" and my son knows when he gets that look that he better knock off whatever he is doing. My husband has spanked him, but doesn't always have to.

Me on the other hand, he runs all over me. I tried the look, I tried yelling, reasoning, redirection. I don't think he sees me as any kind of authority, or something. He literally, I swear, laughs at me.

Don't spank them too hard but just let them know that what they are doing is wrong

NS it sounds like you've got quite a challenge with your little boy! I can't imagine how frustrating it is for you.

You say you spank/swat him and sometimes he doesn't even notice - if that's true then is the correction getting across to him? I mean, if he's doing something he's not supposed to, you swat his butt, and he carries on laughing or whatever, it seems to me the message got lost.

I wish I could give you an alternative suggestion, but as I said in my other post, I'm not a parent. I'm ready to pull my hair out after spending the day watching my nephew who just turned three, and he's usually pretty good! Maybe the childproof devices mentioned earlier will help curb some of the bad behavior, and for your sake, I hope so.

You could always call "Nanny 911"! :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jillianleab

NS it sounds like you've got quite a challenge with your little boy! I can't imagine how frustrating it is for you.

You say you spank/swat him and sometimes he doesn't even notice - if that's true then is the correction getting across to him? I mean, if he's doing something he's not supposed to, you swat his butt, and he carries on laughing or whatever, it seems to me the message got lost.

I wish I could give you an alternative suggestion, but as I said in my other post, I'm not a parent. I'm ready to pull my hair out after spending the day watching my nephew who just turned three, and he's usually pretty good! Maybe the childproof devices mentioned earlier will help curb some of the bad behavior, and for your sake, I hope so.

You could always call "Nanny 911"! :)

---

Usually it is the loud noise of swatting his diaper that scares the crap out of him the most. Even if he does cry, he is over it within 5 minutes. He does get the message, but it seems to only last for that day. Its like he forgets, and the next day he is right back to causing trouble.

The one thing lately he has been doing repeatedly is putting toys, food, pens, stuff like that, in the fish tank. I tell him no, I give him a toy to play with instead (which ends up in the fish tank mind you), I send him to his room, and nothing works.

He is being real lovey dovey right now. Its amazing how he can go from angel to devil in 2 seconds.. lol.

Ok, I misunderstood what you had written. I thought you meant you would swat and he would go about his business like nothing ever happened.

I used to work in a daycare and spent some time with the 2-3's. I found that correcting them on Monday didn't mean they were going to remember on Tuesday... it was always a day in, day out thing. Hell, correcting them on Monday at noon didn't mean they would remember it Monday at 12:15! Kids are a lil' dense, lol! :) Is it possible for you to move the fish tank out of his reach, or move whatever he climbs up on to get to it? Can you get a lid for it that has a lock that he can't operate? Obviously this depends on the type of tank you have, but there has to be SOMETHING out there - there's ALWAYS something out there... Or, is it possible to turn another room in the house to the main play room? Convert an extra bedroom into the play room to get him away from the tank for a little while, maybe he will forget about it. Given that he is so young it probably won't take long, and it might make redirection easier.

J-9:

What exactly do you mean by "redirection" - can you give me some examples.
I have 8-10-11 year olds, anything to help them, I'm game.


To the OP: I'm one of 4 [ we were born in the 60s ] that my mom [primarily] disciplined with a belt to the behind when we did something wrong , up until around 10 years old. 3 of us have doctoral degrees and professional jobs. My sister has a masters, but choses to stay at home for her sons. None of us is screaming abuse.

I wonder how many of peter jennings 'the greatest generation' were spanked growing up and if they spanked as parents?




Grace and Peace

His whole bedroom is like one big Toys R Us. And it all ends up in the fish tank.. lol. I do need to put some tape or velcrow on the lid, but I wish he would just get it through his head to just not play with it. I mean he has so many toys, its ridiculous, and he still wants to play with stuff he's not supposed to.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nauticalstar420

His whole bedroom is like one big Toys R Us. And it all ends up in the fish tank..lol. I do need to put some tape or velcrow on the lid, but I wish he would just get it through his head to just not play with it. I mean he has so many toys, its ridiculous, and he still wants to play with stuff he's not supposed to.

---

Well DUH, MOM! The stuff you aren't supposed to touch is the stuff you HAVE to touch! Lol! :)

My niece always has to push the limit - you tell her not to touch something and you can actually SEE the desire to just... touch... a... little... bit... welling up inside of her. Her self-control gets defeated every time...

Velcro is a great idea, and you can even get him involved in helping you apply it. Tell him it's to keep the fishies safe - so they don't escape. Also, I don't know what you feed the fish, but see if you can get floating pellets or something that he can throw in himself easier. They make pellets for goldfish, you can find them in the pet department at Wal Mart.

I found last time I watched my nephew I was able to distract him with a new, interesting activity. We baked cookies, scooped dry beans from one container to the other, worked on new puzzles, that sort of thing. For him, if you snag his attention with something totally NEW, you've got him. Might be worth trying with your son, at the worst you end up with burt cookies and beans under the couch. You can even make a day of it - go to the store to buy the cookie dough, let him hand the cashier the money, let him get the cookie sheet out, etc.

Me and him do things together all the time. He actually LIKES helping me clean. Go figure on that one.

I tried letting him feed the fish, and once when I wasn't looking he dumped the WHOLE bottle of food in the tank. Amazingly enough, the fish lived.. lol.

That's the good thing about the pellets - you can have him hold out his hand, pour a small amount into his palm, and let him throw it in. I have a fish pond in my backyard and my nephew LOVES to feed the fish! I give him a few pellets, let him throw those in, then a few more, then a few more... It works out well because he finally gets sick of it after the fish stop eating.

One thing that was kind of cute, but I still got mad at him, he likes goldfish crackers, well I gave him some, and looked in the fish tank a little while later and his goldfish were in the fish tank.. lol.

Ns I have 3 children, 1 of them was just like your son. He got a lighter at the age of 3 set his brothers closet on fire. His brother had a kidney disease that caused him to need different sizes of clothes depending on how swollen he was. I was devastated and scared,
I spanked him. Yes I made him cry. Then I made sure to take the lighter hide it on top of the chest . A few days later, I guess he watched me getting it and he got it again and I caught him trying to light a candle. What I learned from that was to keep the lighter on me or so far up that he could not get to it. I never spanked my children again, from there on in. I tried different tatics, even if I had to sit with my arms around them to make them stop a bad behavior. I figured if that scare and that spanking was not effective for that type of serious behavior, that I really must be doing something wrong! He also had a little sister that 1 minute he was kissing and the next he would try to bite her and he had an older brother that was very ill and required a lot of attention. So with him I had to be very flexible, and try to spend a lot of positive time with him even when he was doing wrong things. First I would address the bad behavior,make him stop. Even if I had to hold on to him. Tell him I loved him and we were going to do something else. Also evrything he did I did not address, I just let some things go, The fish tank was a joke, eventually I just gave the fish away, because it was full of batmen and whatever else he decided to put in there. I had to learn what was important and what could be let go. So, spanking for me was not the answer. Btw I was whipped with a switch or a belt when I was growing up. Now, my son will be 16 in October and he is a very fine young man and has not been spanked since then. Boy did we have some rough years, I could write a book on his adventures. Thank God he had a wonderful pediatrician that stood by me. So ns I know what it is like to have a wild one and a small baby and also a sick child and it is hard. But you will get through it. I let my gut tell me when I was wrong with my kids, if I did or said something to them that was unfair, I felt it in the pit of my stomach and in my heart I knew it was wrong. I Did not repeat it. No one can tell you how to raise your kids. That is up to you. Good luck

Not a father but I personally think there is a lack of it. I was spanked as a kid and it taught me to be a very respectful young man if I must say so. Particularly to elders. At school the kids who showed no respect for teachers or anyone else for that matter were the bad kids who were never disciplined. If only the teachers could have given them a whack I think lots of problems would have been avoided.

Call me cruel, call me old fashioned, call me what you like, but kids need discipline to learn right from wrong and in most instances I have seen (I have lots of young nieces and nephews) words, deal making, time outs and naughty corners just don't cut it.

Of course I'm not talking beating or anything of the like but just a little smack to reinforce who actually is the boss.

But it is such a personal choice and no one is right or wrong in their decision whether to spank or not. Some need it, others don't.

I do think though that the argument of "it isnt ok to hit another adult, so why hit a child is weak"

Especially in the US considering they still have Capital Punishment.

Quote:

---

bushg agrees: sounds like my son he always loved to clean, I think it's the busyness and organizing that satifys them. To this day he is organized and always on time and ready for an adventure!

---

His favorite thing to do is help unload the dishwasher (dont ask me why, dishes are my LEAST favorite chore.. lol). The pots & pans go in the cabinets beneath the counters, so I let him put those away. He also cleans up his own toys, helps feed his brother, and tries to help change his brother's diaper.

There are times when he is the biggest cuddlebug angel, and then there are other times when I see horns sprout from that kid. Lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skell

Not a father but i personally think there is a lack of it. I was spanked as a kid and it taught me to be a very respectful young man if i must say so. Particularly to elders. At school the kids who showed no respect for teachers or anyone else for that matter were the bad kids who were never disciplined. If only the teachers could have given them a whack i think lots of problems would have been avoided.

Call me cruel, call me old fashioned, call me what you like, but kids need discipline to learn right from wrong and in most instances i have seen (i have lots of young nieces and nephews) words, deal making, time outs and naughty corners just don't cut it.

Of course i'm not talking beating or anything of the like but just a little smack to reinforce who actually is the boss.

But it is such a personal choice and no one is right or wrong in their decision whether to spank or not. Some need it, others don't.

I do think though that the argument of "it isnt ok to hit another adult, so why hit a child is weak"

Especially in the US considering they still have Capital Punishment.

---

I think the problem is a "spanking" can turn into a "beating" (not that I think anyone here is doing that!), and that causes a whole bunch of other problems. Also, when you apply the logic, "I'm spanking him/her because he/she just doesn't get it/won't obey" to a husband and wife scenario, there's no doubt it would be called domestic abuse. After all, it's just a smack to show who's boss... Also, I think some people spank their kids out of anger; the kid keeps doing something over and over and the parent gets mad and hauls off and smacks them. Logically we know we should not hit out of anger. Logically we also know children don't have the same reasoning and planning skills adults do, but it's hard to remember that after you've corrected him/her for the 300th time. Then there's also the debate that smacking your kid teaches them to hit others; my nephew has his hand smacked and sometimes his butt, and guess what? He's a hitter. Is there a correlation? I don't know, but they learn it somewhere.

I don't mean for the above to make it sound like I'm judging anyone, because I'm not. I don't have kids, so it's easy for me to say anything I want because I don't have to deal with a 2-year old or 3-year old all day every day. There's no doubt being a parent is a tough job, and you are bound to lose your patience.

I think it's important to note, to all those who say they were spanked as a kid and they turned out OK that not everyone does. Some people are affected differently psychologically by spanking, and there's no way to know how your kid will handle it in the future.

Sarai,

As you can see, this was a very good question and we all have different parenting skills.

I am not an advocate of spanking, for the most part, but I do believe it has it's place if needed.

I am not an advocate of time out, at all.

I am, however, an advocate of redirection. I was asked to give an example wasn't I?

Okay just so happens I needed it yesterday at WalMart. Johnny so desperately wants Remy the Chef (the toy from the movie Ratatouille), well we were there to get school supplies. He was really getting on my nerves with the please, please mommy, in the whiney little voice that kids get when they beg. Well, I wanted to swat his tush, believe me. Instead, however, I reminded him that he needs a new lunch box and backpack for kindergarten. When he picked out the ones he wanted we could go home and play school and have a picnic with the new lunch box.

So, I successfully redirected his whining and begging for this Remy toy to something more constructive. I did follow through with playing school and having a picnic.

That is how redirection works. Redirect the bad behavior into something CONstructive rather than DEstructive.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by J_9

Sarai,

As you can see, this was a very good question and we all have different parenting skills.

I am not an advocate of spanking, for the most part, but I do believe it has it's place if needed.

I am not an advocate of time out, at all.

I am, however, an advocate of redirection. I was asked to give an example wasn't I?

Okay just so happens I needed it yesterday at WalMart. Johnny so desperately wants Remy the Chef (the toy from the movie Ratatouille), well we were there to get school supplies. He was really getting on my nerves with the please, please mommy, in the whiney little voice that kids get when they beg. Well, I wanted to swat his tush, believe me. Instead, however, I reminded him that he needs a new lunch box and backpack for kindergarten. When he picked out the ones he wanted we could go home and play school and have a picnic with the new lunch box.

So, I successfully redirected his whining and begging for this Remy toy to something more constructive. I did follow through with playing school and having a picnic.

That is how redirection works. Redirect the bad behavior into something CONstructive rather than DEstructive.

---

Earlier today, Aidan unlocked the poison cabinet (I need to figure out how he's doing that.. lol) and brought me the Clorox. How should I have redirected him from that?

You sit down in front of him and tell him that this is DANGEROUS. Use your best MOMMY MEANS IT voice. Take him by the hand to another room, to toys, crayons and paper, etc.

Next you move all chemicals such as the Clorox to a shelf above his reach. All poisons should always be out of reach. Proper childproofing means getting on your hands and knees and crawling around looking for potential dangers.

Well I have tried that voice before, and it hasn't worked, but I can try again next time.

He does need to clean his room, and he loves to help clean, so I can use that as a redirection next time he gets into something he's not supposed to.

Yes, if he likes to clean, that can be constructive redirection. When using the mommy voice make sure you are down on his level and looking at him in the eyes.

When disciplining our children it is of the utmost importance that we get down to their eye level.

Okay I will try that.

One other thing. He just came back from his grandma's house in June (my husbands mom) and was allowed to get away with all but murder there. He was there for about two months. It is only since he's been home that he started this behavior. He used to be a little angel.

How do I get him used to being back home and having discipline?

Ahhh, the age old gramma and grampa let them do it. Well, it will take time to get him back into your routine. You just have to stay consistent in your discipline.

You know, you had said that his room is like toys r us. If this behavior continues - you take his toys away - all of them. Let him earn them back. And if you are sending him to his room for punishment - if it's like a toy store - what kind of punishment is it really going to be?

I think "the voice" and "the look" are the hardest thing to master. I am still working on those! My daughter and I can have a conversation - without saying a word and being on opposite sides of a room - using only hand signals. Well, she looks and I "talk". If I need her to stop what she is doing and listen to whomever is speaking - I have a signal for knock it off and then a hand signal for listen. It actually works. Now, she is almost 7 and we didn't start this until she was in school and could comprehend.

You just have to find what is right for you.

Now What makes a good point about the room being full of toys. If you are sending your son to his room as a time out and there are toys in the room it is not a punishment. Instead try using a dining room chair, or a mat placed on the floor where he cannot get to anything. Remember that the length of timeout depends on their age not the severity of their action. One minute for every year of age.

Another effective way of getting a behavior that you want is to offer choices (your choices). For example: Would you like to set the table or clear the table? That makes him or her feel like she has a bit of control, but ultimately you are getting what you want too. It is a pretty effective tool for older children.

I couldn't agree more don't hit him just take him to his room and say bye bye toy put them in the garage somewhere he can't get at them.
The voice thing works you just have to do it slowly and calmly not in a high pitched tone they know they have won and will carry on also come right down to his level don't bring him to yours you go to him and tell him no just keep doing it they get the message eventually.
I think the best tecnique is the naughty wall step floor what ever you choose to use just remember there's one everywhere you go.
But the biggest thing is when punishment is over its over move on and play he needs your attention more than baby right now just remember he is probably thinking well hell I had her to myself a while ago and now I'm sharing with you.
Good luck raising kids was never meant to be easy and I'm the first to admit there are times I could throttle millie but it distract her first then go put kettle on admittedly I could scream till I'm blue in the face it doesn't get me anywhere just gives me high blood pressure not great when your pregnant.
Last but not least they know how to work you they are prime masters keep calm and tackle it head on rather than reacting the way they know you will.

I have 3 children aged 5, 2 and 6 months. I used to smack but found that other punishments work just as well. Try putting children on a 'naughty step' (one minute for every year). Children hate to be excluded so this works very well. You'll do yourself no favours by sending naughty children to their room as this just makes them associate their bedroom with bad things, making the bedroom routine even harder. If your child has a tantrum in public just say in a nice voice "ok when you are ready to carry on let me know" and wait patiently. There are loads of little things you can do but the trick is to praise good behaviour no matter how small and don't concentrate on the bad stuff!! Hope this helps :)

Quote:

---

curlybenswife disagrees: The more I re-read your posts the more I think you are over reacting and making him do all these things to wind you up as it gets your attention.

---

Excuse me, but what? Wind me up? Making him do what? Making him get into things, just so I can discipline him?

A quick swat on the butt at that age will get the child's attention along with a firm NO should be effective. Trust me it will hurt you more than the child.

Quote:

---

curlybenswife disagrees: The more I re-read your posts the more I think you are over reacting and making him do all these things to wind you up as it gets your attention.

---

You can judge my parenting skills, but can't follow up with responses to my questions? I don't even know what the heck you are talking about. It doesn't make any sense. The only thing I can make of it is that you think I am making him do wrong things so I can discipline him. Is that correct? If so, you don't know how wrong you are. You don't know me, or my son.

I think that you should try other forms of punishment like time out, but spanking should always be the ulimate punishment. Like if the child refuses to sit in time out then they get spanked.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SnaveLeber

i think that you should try other forms of punishment like time out, but spanking should always be the ulimate punishment. Like if the child refuses to sit in time out then they get spanked.

---

He does refuse to sit in time out sometimes. He has gotten better since this conversation happened. He just came back from his grandma's so he was going through the "spoiled little baby" syndrome. Since this conversation he has even started cleaning his own room, and started potty training.

I think he was allowed to do what he wanted at his grandma's and that was part of the problem. But I feel that every child is different and it makes me so mad when someone acts like they know my child well enough to tell me what I am supposedly doing with them.

Children need to be punished when they have been naughty but there are several other forms of punishing them rather than spanking them such as using the 'naughty step', ignoring them, give them a row but at the same time their behaviour will improve from positive praise and treats etc when they are good.

At age 5 months ( the orgainal question) no, a swat is not correct at this age. But an older toddler and child, a well timed swat will work wonders and will solve a lot more issues.

When my son was that old he used to love to yank my hair or try and headbutt me... I used a swat on the butt and said no and he would let go..

Hello:

You poor misguided people...

excon

Certainly don't spank a 5-month-old child. I'm not totally against spanking but I will say this: pick your battles wisely. Over-disciplining a child will be counter-productive and, as you suggest, only cause her to act out all the more. Decide on those few behaviors which are totally unacceptable to you and spank only when those occur. These should be serious enough behaviors to warrant a spanking but not those which occur with any degree of frequency. For example, the last time I spanked my daughter (age 7) was when she she threw a pencil at my wife while my wife was trying to help her with her homework. Openly defiant behavior is something I refuse to tolerate in my children, which is why I spanked my daughter. That's one of my few "handpicked" battles that will result in serious discipline.

Quote:

---

s_cianci agrees: I hope that "stranger" was taking on the role of a Good Samaritan!

---

I thank God every day that this WAS a good samaritan! A local preacher. I have a friend who has been "missing" for 25 years. A still unsolved disappearance. I can't imagine it being my daughter.

It is my belief, and mine only, that there are consequences to our actions, children included. However, spanking should be reserved for the most serious infractions. Running out in the middle of traffic, running away and going into a strangers home, just as a couple of examples.

Yes, I was spanked as a child, yes, I was one who came out okay. But studies have shown (I learned this in my mental health rotation) that it can be very damaging to a child.

You see, children can reason much better than we give them credit for. By reasoning the pros and cons with a child (of any age really) gives them the chance to learn reasoning skills, skills that they will carry with them through adulthood.

Quote:

---

J_9 agrees: I completely agree with you. It is sad, isn't it? Glad some of these people are not my children's teachers!

---

I would never spank someone else's child. You can't say that just because some people spank, that it means they are going to spank someone else's child too.