ABOUT THE PREVIOUSLY POSTED LETTER

Regarding the letter posted above for a motion to Vacate Judgment, please be aware that the first line under the heading is incorrect! That's actually from the Plaintiff's perspective. More specifically, I'm referring to the part that reads:

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NOW COMES the Plaintiff, Pro Se and prays this Honorable Court to Deny the Defendant's Motion to Dismiss and Motion for Sanction for the following reasons

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I just wanted to update that information in case someone uses the letter.

Here's my story. I also defaulted on a credit card to Chase. I was in foreclosure and could not pay. They did the charge off and Mann-Bracken (hate them) sent it to arbitration. I did all the required paper work and the request of the original contract and they got it and sent me a giant package of all the copies. Then it went to arbitration and they were awarded an amount of $17,500. Original amt was 14,000. That was in Sept. of 2006. Two days ago I got a summons that I was being sued by a different law firm, Blatt, Hasenmiller, Leibsker & Moore. I don't know how they got involved in all this, but the copy of the arbitration award was stapled to it with Mann Bracken's name on it. I pretty much am done with this. I have an appointment to see a laywer about a bankruptcy on Tuesday. I live paycheck to paycheck now. I did not charge things with default in mind. Due to a job loss and a bad decision, I lost my house, my money and my credit rating. Nothing could make my FICO score worse I think, and I can't afford for these pirhannas to garnish my wages so they can make a lot of money for something they paid little for. The laws in this country are very much against the creditor. The arbitration forum is paid by the law firms they give these awards to. The companies who buy charged off credit need some parameters because they are very much allowed to do a lot, even with the fair credit reporting act. Also, your case can be dropped by one and picked up by another, and another, and another. So just because you may not have to pay this one, another law firm can and probably will buy it for a few bucks and hound you relentlessly. The only way to get out of a bad debt is to either pay it off or get it discharged in bankruptcy. Otherwise, it will haunt you for the rest of your life.

Part of what you say is true, but not all. There is a lot of protection for the debtor in the US. But remember, creditors are assuming a risk,they are entitiled to get their money back.

What bothers me is this second law firm. If you have a written agreement with someone on the disposition of a debt, then another creditor has to honor it, if they purchase that debt.

Aren't you the guy who just paid on a 10 year old credit card?

I was referring to protection from debt buyers by the way. They are not subject to very many laws. They constatly break the fair credit reporting act law because they know that not a lot of people know about it, or how to use it, I used to be one of them. It took MANY hours of surfing the net to get answers. And the bottom line is, they can and WILL hound you forever till you pay or file bankruptcy.

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Originally Posted by bigcowboy1

Aren't you the guy who just paid on a 10 year old credit card?

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Who me? I've never defaulted on a debt in my life.

The best website that I have found for answers and form letters to send to creditors is Avoid bankruptcy eliminate credit card debt enjoy financial freedom and debt-free living > It has the best information and help.

That's not what I wrote

Ihatedebt.com is what I wrote

Sorry ScottGem. It wasn't you who had the debt, it was you who answered the letter of the person who had the debt. I just recognized your big diamond. My bad.

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Originally Posted by bigcowboy1

ihatedebt.com is what I wrote

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The hyperlink engine here will sometimes pick up a site name from its metadata then the actual URL. The link will work the same.

There are many good resources for info on how to deal with debt and creditors, including this site.

What now!?

I filed a notice to vacate judgment. Almost immediately after I filed the notice, I received something in the mail from the plaintiff's attorneys for a settlement/installment plan. Actually, I think they crossed in the mail. A couple of days later, I then received my copy of the notice to vacate judgment from the court.

Then today...

I received a copy from the plaintiff's attorney's : "Opposition to Defendants Motion and Declaration to Vacate Judgment."

In the document(s), under the attorney's points, the 4th one said

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That the defendant has filed a Motion asking to have the Judgment Vacated more than thirty (30) days after its entry. Said Motion alleges no basis for defense, no basis to vacate, modify or correct the arbitration award upon which this Judgment was entered and stats no basis for the Defendant's failure to plead.
5. That insofar as the Defendant's Motion was filed more than 30 days after the entry of Judgment, the Defendants must show not only that there was some irregularity but also that they have a meritorious defense and have acted with reasonable diligence in seeking to have the Judgment set aside. Here the Defendant has failed to show any of the above and his Motion should be denied

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Also, under the heading "Point and Athorities", they sited some state rule as well as a case "Capobianco v Gordon, 19 Md App. 662(nothing that moving party has the burden of establishing fraud, mistake or irregularity, and that they have acted within ordinary diligence, in good faith, and have a meritorious defense.)

Any suggestions on what I should do next? :confused:

Also, just to add, on the Judgment that I received from the court, there was NOTHING about a response in 30 days. How was I supposed to know that?

Oh, and my Notice to Vacate Judgment and its contents are posted within earlier responses.

Thanks!

They will hound you forever. Just file bankruptcy. That's what I finally did. Either that or pay if you can. I don't have any assets or money, so my only choice was to get bankruptcy protection so they would not garnish the little wages that I make. My financial situation now is much different than when I acquired the debt. So if you think you can win this, think again. Bankruptcy is not he end of the world like everyone tells you. Your credit is messed up anyway I assume and the good thing is you can start over again. Just remember not to ever get any credit cards again. It's like dealing with the devil.

What you received was a response to your motion. Did you think they were just going to roll over and play dead because you were fighting them? Of course they are going to respond and they are going to try and intimidate you. This is, of course, why its better to have an attorney. An attorney can advise you on all the fine points and make sure you dot your Is and cross your Ts.

So now you know what arguments they have against your Motion to Vacate. Your next step is to prepare your answers to those arguments. Check the summons and make sure that no response time was given.

I'm curious if their motion mentioned anything about the verification. If it didn't, then it looks like they are trying to do an end run. Your answer to the last point about them acting in good faith is; "then why haven't they provided documentation of the debt as frequently requested"?

I don't think Bankruptcy is the route for me. While my credit history hasn't been good because of some things 3 years ago, I really have worked hard to rebuild it and make honest efforts getting things done. True, it would help out my situation with my student loans, I'm not ready to go that route. Besides, while this debt isn't cheap, it's only $2500+.

ScottGem, I was really thinking about an attorney. Unfortunately, I cannot find anyone in my area who specializes in credit stuff. I did go to MyFairDebt.com and look, but that person seems to have countless cases against collectors for FDCPA violations more than anything. Plus, they're not really close to me.

In regards to the letter, it's funny you said something about the verification. I was thinking the same thing and no, they never addressed it whatsoever.

Also, when you say check the summons, what are you referring to? The only thing that every had a timeline was the original summons for a response, (30 days). That I'm positive I sent in within the timeline. The Notice to Vacate Judgment was in response to the judgment that was signed on the 5th of January but didn't get to me for over a week from that date!! I realize the court might not send something out the same day, but that's a bit long.

Lastly, whatever I am to file next, what is it called?

Thanks again!

I don't think you have to file anything. What you recevied was a pre-trial motion. Now you should follow up with the court for a court date (if one isn't already scheduled. And then prepare for that.

No date. The only things I've ever received from the court was the original summons for a response and then the judgment.

I guess they simply sent this to try and convince the judge to not schedule a trial date. That's what it sounds like anyway.

ScottGem, I know you said I don't need to file something, but is there some sort of thing I should send in response to try and sway the court for a trial date? Like, something in defense of the original Notice to Vacate Judgment? I just have a sinking feeling that the court won't waste the time with a hearing and that I'll never get a say.

Also, worth mentioning, the attorneys sent an Order for the judge to sign denying the motion to vacate judgment.

I'm kind of thinking I should respond and basically say I have the right to face my accusers and that I am demanding a contract. I know I already said that, but I really don't have much faith in a system that wouldn't verify the debt in the first place with a contract or provide me with an opportunity to clear my name.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

Yes you do need talk to the court and push for a trial.

I had the same thing from a credt card Providian from a collection agency. They even served me with papers to appear in court. The constable says, that they can not do nothing. I thought they would be like the IRS and seize and sell your stuff. Basically, if you do not appear in court then they could get a lien on anything you have. So if you are renting, and own a car and you are not going to pay them then I would not worry. I had to pay mine because I was getting a loan from the VA land board to buy some property and I just happen to have the money so my record would be debt free with them. Another credit card company has tried the usual legal threats but I do not pay attention to them and throw away the letters. I find that if you can not pay or have a lawyer then why do anything. You will still owe the debt. Do not stress yourself out, like I did. Now this long forgotten credit card, I just do not even think about it, but I just keep on trucking.

So if I want to push for a trial, (basically I just want to make them present me/the court with the original paperwork which they won't have), what should I do? I know that just sounded pretty dumb, but is there some official notice in support of the judgment vacation?

Also, should I just file a motion of discovery or is that way off base? :confused:

And lastly, they sent me a settlement offer/installment plan. How bad would it be to say to them that I'd consider accepting if they could provide me with the original contract? I'm just thinking that if they did provide me with something, at least I'd have an idea going into court - if I were to even get a date.

Thanks!

Oh, and barato56, my only reservation since I don't own a house is that they'd garnish my wages. That's my biggest fear... :(

If they win the judgement, they can garnish your wages. You need a laywer.

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Originally Posted by bigcowboy1

If they win the judgement, they can garnish your wages. You need a laywer.

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Technically, they won the judgment and can start the garnishment process. I think it's expensive process so that's probably why they offered to settle.

I'm just curious how I can force a trial or if I can fight for the notice to vacate the judgment. :confused: As for a lawyer, I've been thinking that since after the first response. Unfortunately, I can't seem to find someone in my area that specializes in this. Most of the lawyers I've found are busy with class-action stuff and injury/malpractice cases.

I think for the time being, I'd really like to push to get a trial and hopefully vacate the judgment. If I could somehow get a trial, I honestly think I'd be fine. However, if the judges denies my motion to vacate judgment, then I think I'd need to either price a lawyer for some sort of appeal since these guys won't have any original contract work.

Thoughts on what I can do to try to get a trial in response to their latest intimidation letter?

Have you spoken to the court?

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Originally Posted by ScottGem

Have you spoken to the court?

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That's what I'd like to do! Unfortunately, my work area isn't exactly private. Maybe if I could get away at lunch time, I could call.

I did try that option today at lunch but I was on hold forever. Probably no coincidence that I'd be on hold when they're more than likely at lunch as well... :(

Did Mann Bracken win an arbitration against you? My dealing with Chase/Mann-Bracken resulted in arbitration as this is what you sign when you get the card. I challenged the arbitration and they sent me a envelope of everything I had ever charged with that Chase card, so they did have it. I have a feeling they have yours too. They won the arbitration award and within 6 months, it was with a different law firm, but for the same arbitration award, (I think they just took over the suit as I had moved to another state). That's when I finally decided to file the bankruptcy as I can't pay it and don't want them to garnish the wages. You can go to court, but if you owe the debt, and they have the papers, you will pay not only the charges, but the laywers fees and the court costs. My advice is if you owe the debt, and you can pay, do so but try to get it reduced if you still can. This company is serious. They sue. They win.

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Originally Posted by bigcowboy1

Did Mann Bracken win an arbitration against you? My dealing with Chase/Mann-Bracken resulted in arbitration as this is what you sign when you get the card. I challenged the arbitration and they sent me a envelope of everything I had ever charged with that Chase card, so they did have it. I have a feeling they have yours too. They won the arbitration award and within 6 months, it was with a different law firm, but for the same arbitration award, (I think they just took over the suit as I had moved to another state). That's when I finally decided to file the bankruptcy as I can't pay it and don't want them to garnish the wages. You can go to court, but if you owe the debt, and they have the papers, you will pay not only the charges, but the laywers fees and the court costs. My advice is if you owe the debt, and you can pay, do so but try to get it reduced if you still can. This company is serious. They sue. They win.

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I think you might be right bigcowboy1. :(

Let me ask this, if I were to talk settlement, what would be a good price? I think the award is approximately $2500.00. In all honesty, I really did have a Chase card with a balance of $600. I sincerely have no idea where all the rest came from as I stopped receiving paper statements, (automatically enrolled in e-statements). Then, I went from writing a check for a minimum payment, (not ideal I know), to receiving delinquincy letters.

I never did receive a breakdown and when I logged on, my session was "unavailable". I'm pretty sure that's because I owed them for 2 months past due.

Any ideas on an offer? They offered me approximately $1800 as a lump sum.

Just thinking more about this...

I still want to force MB to present an itemized breakdown as well as the original contract. I would like to get that first before I decide whether I'll go to court to fight. The burden of proof should still be on them.

As for your case bigcowboy, it might be different considering the amount involved. It's at least worth a shot.

Also, IF they could present all the information, should I go straight to Chase for a settlement? Perhaps they wouldn't be as prudent about the court costs. Besides, according to the court documents, MB are attorneys for the debt - they never bought it.

Thoughts?


Thanks!

Sorry to bump this, but since it's been just over a week since I received that rebuttal copy from MB, should I file a Motion of Discovery or something for the original contract or should I send something in to support my motion to vacate or should I just wait for the court to decide?

Thanks

Without seeing what the rebuttal said, we can't be sure. What you need to do is find out whether a hearing is being scheduled and what you need to do to get one scheduled.

Not good news.

I took off work today to try to handle this mess. However, Saturday I received a letter from the court DENYING the motion to vacate judgement.

At this point, would it be worth it to just go to Chase - not MB - and try to work a settlement?

I really, really don't want to give a penny to MB and since they didn't buy the debt I don't see a problem with this.

Does this sound like a good path? If not, I'd have to pay a lawyer to appeal this and then go through all that stuff. The way I'm looking at this - which might be wrong - I can pay to Chase what I'd probably pay in legal fees.

When MB originally wrote after they first won, they offered me a payment plan of $85 per month or a lump sum of approximately $1800. I wonder how much Chase would've received out of that lump sum... :confused:

What grounds did it give for denying your motion.

I doubt if Chase will negotiate with you since they probably sold the debt.

If no reason was given for the denial, just denied. File Motion for Specific Answer for Denial. They must use the rule of law for that denial. The judge must comply or he is denying you due process of the law. Maryland judge lately like to take short cuts. Demand an answer.

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Originally Posted by mr.yet

If no reason was given for the denial, just denied. File Motion for Specific Answer for Denial. They must use the rule of law for that denial. The judge must comply or he is denying you due process of the law. Maryland judge lately like to take short cuts. Demand an answer.

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Hooray for Maryland!

Since the start it seems like they're very... um... just "not good." Realistically, I don't understand why they ever offered a judgment when there was no proof ever presented - even in those initial arbitration ruling in the NAF. But the motion for a specific reason sounds like a really good idea. Basically, I'm trying to get them to have to present the original contract and an itemized breakdown of everything before I talk to Chase or MB or whoever.

ScottGem, do you think Chase sold it? I was under the impression that MB are just the attorneys for Chase - not that they bought the debt. Otherwise, I honestly think they're being very misrepresentative about everything, i.e. "Attorneys for..". Plus, Chase is listed as the actual Plaintiff.

Also, when they sent something to offer a settlement, they specifically said something along the lines of "our client" will accept $1800.

Sound fishy or does it sound like a reason to contact Chase instead of MB - assuming the Judges here continue doing the same thing. :mad:

Me again. Sorry to bump this, but I've been "googling" Motion for Specific Answer for Denial and haven't come up with any guidelines with which to base my argument around.

Is there some sort of message I want to include in order to get an answer or maybe even a trial?

Here's the deal. In between being served and getting a judgement from the court, I did NOT get anything about what date to show up in court. So the judgement went against me. What I did do, was file the bankruptcy before they did that, and that stopped everything. It's really not so bad. No one came by to brand a big B on my chest. I think they put the fear of God in everyone about filing for bankruptcy because they don't want anyone doing it. Maybe if they played fair and let people have a fighting chance against these blood sucking debt buying turds it wouldn't have to come to that. Trust me, they will never let you go. They are sneaky, and they don't care if they get sued because they paid pennie for your debt, and anything above that to them is cake. Do yourself a favor, call the local bar association and ask for a pro bono laywer for free advice as there is so much red tape here, you will never do it by yourself. Let us know how this ends for you.

I think you said perfectly bigcowboy1: Debt Collectors = Turds ;)

I understand it could be a waste of taxpayer money, but given all the things you read about your tax money going to, you'd think "justice" would be given a priority. :confused:

I agree with what you're saying about bankruptcy being a taboo. But, given that I need to get a new car, (not right away), and that I'd like to start looking at houses, I can't really go that route. Besides, I don't mind paying my other bills like my student loans. I used the money and am cool with paying it off. I just don't like paying this off since I really can't seem to get any kind of itemization or explanation regarding it.

Would it be worth my time to just call up Chase and settle? If so, how much is a fair settlement? When MB contacted me, they said I could just do one lump-sum of approximately $1,800. If that's the ceiling, what's a good floor?

Also, if these guys purchased the debt, (as opposed to just being collectors for Chase), would they be misrepresenting themselves as attorneys as not the plaintiff?

Thanks!

If I file a motion for a specific reason for denial, should I make mention of anything from the following:

Debt Validation: The ultimate weapon against the collection agencies

I was thinking more specifically that I should somehow state the following from that link:

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The Right to Validate Your Debt

Under the FDCPA, you are allowed to validate this debt, and the creditor (in this case, the collection agency) must show you proof that you owe the debt to the collection agency (not to the original creditor.)

The specific section of the FDCPA:

FDCPA Section 809. Validation of debts [15 USC 1692g]

(b) If the consumer notifies the debt collector in writing within the thirty-day period described in subsection (a) that the debt, or any portion thereof, is disputed, or that the consumer requests the name and address of the original creditor, the debt collector shall cease collection of the debt, or any disputed portion thereof, until the debt collector obtains verification of the debt or any copy of a judgment, or the name and address of the original creditor, and a copy of such verification or judgment, or name and address of the original creditor, is mailed to the consumer by the debt collector.

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I say get a lawyer and sue them.

I don't know what grounds I'd be able to sue them on.

First, I think I need to call the "Plaintiff" and see if they would even settle.

If MB offered a lump-sum settlement of $1,800ish, what would be a good settlement for the original plaintiff assuming they don't have to go through all the additional court costs? Plus, if it is "just business", the only people to get screwed over are MB since they probably wouldn't receive any of the settlement.

Thoughts on that approach?

By the time you figure out what you're doing, they will be garnishing your wages.