[talaniman]

She told me that 4 months before we met she had lost her virginity to a 28 year old man after a one night stand, she was only 16 at the time and so was a minor. This blew my mind, I'm the jealous type, I will admit to it, it bugged me for months but I kind of kept it in the back of my mind.

Posted by OP April 30

[bushg]

Now What If I attended church with this man and he coerced my daughter into having sex with him by manuiplating her and getting her to trust him and played on her emotions . And I knew that just one member in society could have warned me of this crazy man. Then in my mind they would be just as guilty as the molester... then 2 people should go to jail and not 1... but that is just how I would view it

[NowWhat]

Tal, do you think HE is the one making more of this than what is actually there? Out of jealousy? That particular post would definitely make you think that.

I still say - take the b/f out of the equation - the girl knows what happened in her heart, she knows if she was violated - if she feels that she was abused then SHE should come forward.

[talaniman]

I've read all his posts. I've read some right here on this forum with 14,15,year olds with older b/f's and before I take someone's word against any one I would look real hard before I took any action that may hurt someone or cause them to go to jail. The fact that she told him in the manner he described and then she has been broken up with him only lets me know she will not come forward and he will take no action and frankly I don't believe he has done this to any of her friends, sorry I can't swallow that. There is no way he does this in my neighborhood and gets away with it police or not. This just doesn't make sense. His word is not enough, and he will take no action. He takes no suggestions so case closed for me.

[bushg]

Tal I was raised in the country( rural) we had teachers that would screw around with not one student but with her grilfriends as well, I have seen it happen. This happens a lot and they are the worst predators... they get that job for a reason. Also true story a woman I know wanted to date a boy that just turned 18 she asked his mom... she was 26 and his mom laughed it off and said your too old... Guess what she went after his youngest brother 14 at the time... she got him and just about wrecked his life. Only this time she didn't ask the mom. I know the mom and the lady that was the molester that did this every time I get a chance to tell this story I do it. Even though this was many years ago and she never went to jail for it Let me clear this up I meet the molester after the fact, they had a baby together

[talaniman]

I understand and feel the frustration. There is only so much you can do on this thread and if they are not willing to take actions or do the right things, There is nothing we can do, no matter how we feel. I've seen a lot myself as I've counseled young adults for years and I can tell you for the sake of your own sanity you can only help those that want it. He doesn't want help, nor does she.

[zooropa1985]

OK NOW IM Getting SICK OF THIS.

Why the hell would I make it up? I'm not sick you know, what do you want me to do, write a letter to the guy, write a letter to the church? The world isn't black and white, I don't care if you believe me ot not.

You are sounding like hipocrites on this, look at the first 2 or 3 pages telling me to keep my mouth shut, telling me to mind my own business, then all of a sudden you start telling me to tell peeps.

Here's the deal, I did talk to him but not face to face and it wasn't pretty, it was a very heated argument that included threats of violence.

Now I will write the letters that you suggested but don't any of you ever suggest that I'm making more of this that there was!

[zooropa1985]

OK so you all don't believe me or have lost respect in what I'm saying.

Well me and my mate decided to go on bebo and pose as a 16 year old virgin, still in high school and email the now 28 year old sam, we then took screen caps as proof as this is what we made:

YouTube - Passion of the perve

Now I don't know if you will say this is wrong but I had to do something, this shows that he would happily do it again.

Remember he thinks he's talking to a 16 year old, he has never met her.

[bushg]

Wynelle " No man is an island unto himself" I say go to the police before he decides he wants , yours, mine, his, hers or their young girl and shakes your hand after church. Just what if you went to church or lived next door to this man!

[zooropa1985]

See what I mean, how can I win?

[bushg]

Zoor everybody is not going agree with you so stop trying to get them to! Chat with him and then take your myspace chats with you to the police and let them go from there you can leave the girlfriend out of it that way. Just chat with him more than once you sound as though your smart enough to do that. Get him to send you bulletins . And print them off. You can be conniving enough to do this. But if he keeps getting offers from 16 yr old he may get supicous.

[zooropa1985]

Well that's why I did it, so I wouldn't have to involve her, after this though he did delete his bebo, however I found he has made a new one but has it set to private

[bushg]

If you did that at least you tried and that is all that can be asked of you! Case closed.

[chuff]

Chuff, I don't disagree with you on alot of your points. Having said that - I have a question.
I got the impression that this encounter was not 100% consentual (sp?). That a 27 year old man FORCED himself on a 16 year old. I know she isn't calling it rape - but it said somewhere that he would not take her home until she gave him oral - things like that.
If that is the case - would reporting it to someone be appropriate?

Two issues here that I want to separate after reading what I wrote last night. Me, just my opinion that a 16 year old girl who has consentual sex with a 27 year old is not being molested given her age. She may not understand that this guy really doesn't care about her, but it's not like she is 5 and has no clue what's going on. Nor did I mean to imply that it was right or should be legal, but it should not carry the same label as someone that kidnaps and has sex with a 5 year old. However, at 16 or any age if she's being forced into sexual situations by a 27 year old then yes it is still rape.

After having gone through here and seeing some of the video that Zoo created, and assuming the words in the graphics were real duplications of a conversation that took place between this guy and someone he thought was a 16 year old then I would have to take back my previous beliefs that this was a big lie told by a big liar. It appears that I was wrong, in at least that regard.

Should Zoo go to the police with this information. At this point given what he says in that video I'd have to say perhaps he should.

But here's the problem at the end of the day. This isn't about that guy. This is about a girl that used Zoo, and she did she used him and dropped him. Zoo is madly in love with her to the point he's blinded himself so that he can't see what's going on. Zoo can turn over his video and he can tell them what happened to his ex. They may do some investagation into it but his ex has already told him that it was a one night stand. So she has already admitted it was consentual. Whether it was or not is irrelevant because she told at least one person that it was.

But Zoo, who I firmly believe is a good guy, I don't want to this to be thing where he thinks I'm picking on him or anybody else reads it as that, because I think some people are and that's not what I'm trying to do or say. But Zoo, had no issue with him until he needed to have an issue with him. As I stated before, Zoo is pissed, and rightfully so at his ex. But he also wants her back. So he's fighting himself. He's got one side of him telling him that he deserves better then she gave him and another side telling him to do anything to get her back. Well he can't direct his anger at her or she's gone forever, and he can't show her his value if she's not around. This situation fits perfectly for him to channel his anger and show her his value.

There's nothing wrong with channeling your anger for something positive and getting somebody like this away from teenagers is a great way to do that. I don't want to stop him from finding an outlet for his anger. If this helps in that regard then great follow through with it.

But the problem is she doesn't want him back and she has already told him to drop it. She has told him it is none of his business. And the reality is if she said it was concentual it is none of his business as it relates to her. She wants the whole issue dropped so why did he go digging about it. Well if it was truly for the daughter of the world, then why is Zoo not finding other men looking for sex with 16 year olds? Why just this one? Why not find other adult men who hunt for sex with teenagers?

This is not crime fighting, it's a hero complex gone bad. If it's truly about the crime, Zoo wouldn't be so confused about reporting it, but he isn't sure what it will mean to him in the end if he does. That's where the confusion comes from.

[chuff]

zooropa1985 agrees: Well you are correct in everythin but she knew how i felt about the whole situation, i just didnt do anything because she asked me not too. Oh and it was more a case of me tellin him to stay away from her, he didnt deny it and i saw some of the texts

Well, I'm glad, and a little surprised to see that you agree. As I said, I don't want you to think I'm attacking you but at the same time I'm trying to get you to see this is not healthy for the most important person in this situation, and that person is you.

You say you didn't do anything because she asked you not to. So why are you now doing something about it? Will you be going after other adults that talk to teenagers? Why just this particular guy? In other words, if you want to make the difference your really talking about why not respect your ex's words and go after other's not connected to you in any way.

Why exactly are you telling him to stay away from her? Are you threathened by this guy?

Again, I'll ask this and I wish you'd stop, just stop, and think about this. What does any of this do for you?

[NowWhat]

Zoo, just watched the You-Tube thing. It made me sick to my stomach. What are the laws like in Ireland for something like this? It is against the law in the US for someone to solicit sex from a minor on the internet. Even if the person on the other end isn't truly a minor. (ever watch Dateline's "to catch a predator"?) So, here - what you would have is this man committing a crime.
That is just sick.

[chuff]

Tal, do you think HE is the one making more of this than what is actually there? Out of jealousy?

Well, I'm not tal, but I think he is making more out of this then what is actually there. I'm still at a loss, trying to figure out what this gets him? If he's really doing for the good of society as is his argument then he would have done something about it along time ago. If he's doing it for his ex, then he is completely disrespecting her because she told him to drop it. Yes this is out of jealousy, but he's now jealous that another guy slept with her before he did and she doesn't even give a damn about him.

I still say - take the b/f out of the equation - the girl knows what happened in her heart, she knows if she was violated - if she feels that she was abused then SHE should come forward.

Exactly. This is her fight... if you can call a one night stand a fight, not his.

[chuff]

Tal I was raised in the country( rural) we had teachers that would screw around with not one student but with her grilfriends as well, I have seen it happen.

Yeah those things do happen. And they are not right. And society looks down upon those that do with no mercy. But you know what also happens that is ignored. Women make their little girls lie during divorces and say that daddy raped them when daddy didn't. That story isn't told on the 11 o'clock news because there is no way the woman could be one filled with hate and the man be the victim. No. Never. Of course not, it's always the guys fault and we must never question the motives of the woman.

You know what also happens. Sixteen year old girls or women at any age allow themselves to be talked into going out with and having sex with people that others can clearly see aren't right for them, I see it at 30 years old, with people my own age. Then when, and only when they get dumped they come up with these stories to justify the situation and... gasp... I know this surprises people... these fragile and delicate creatures called women... they lie.

Much like Zooropa's ex. She's a liar. She's lied to him about things not even related this. She's disrespected him about things not related this. She has said it was a one night stand. Then later recanted her version, when the self admitted, and obviously acted out extremely jealous Zooropa was uncomfortable with her having premartial sex. Although he did as well, but that is to be ignored because it doesn't really matter, a guy has been accused of raping a girl and he must be punished because the jealous ex said so.

This happens a lot and they are the worst predators...they get that job for a reason.

I have to agree with you there.

Also true story a woman I know wanted to date a boy that just turned 18 she asked his mom...she was 26 and his mom laughed it off and said your too old...Guess what she went after his youngest brother 14 at the time...she got him and just about wrecked his life. only this time she didn't ask the mom. I know the mom and the lady that was the molester that did this everytime I get a chance to tell this story I do it. even though this was many years ago and she never went to jail for it Let me clear this up I meet the molester after the fact, they had a baby together

My friend's sister is a councelor for the state of Michigan, and she helps children under 18 going who have parents going through divorces where the child's health and well being is in consideration for who should raise the child. She has told me numerous times about how children are told to lie about what their father does to them, in order for mom to get custody. Actually, I think that a mother that does that to her children and their father is probably the worst kind of predator.

Not exactly related to this issue here, but my point is, just because the accusation comes does not in any way make it a fact. Zoo's ex has changed her story. Zoo is acting irrational about his loss and not doing anything for his own mental and emotional health. If he truly wants to see justice then why not seek out others who are not related to this situation.

I'm not saying the points you made weren't valid but I guess the reality to me is if you take all the emotion out of this situation and just look at the facts, she's a liar, she can't changes her story, and Zoo doesn't care about the daughter's of society, just they fact that this guy slept with her before he did, and it doesn't matter because he doesn't even sleep with her anymore.

[chuff]

see what i mean, how can i win?

What is it you want to win? You want her back but acting like a overly jealous crazed man and the only person your going after is the guy that slept with her before you. Do you really think that these actions are going to get her back?

If you have given up on her and want to protect society then turn your information over.

But what exactly will that get you? At the end of the day, it is you who is hurting terribly inside. It is you who is got to come to terms with the break up. I believe that all this other stuff is a distraction to your dealing with the pain. Stop, and think about that for 30 minutes. Don't say or do anything, just stop and think about it. What does any of this do for you, because it's about time you started giving a damn about the most important person you know, that is yourself.

[mrssittingduck]

Where is he from, as different parts have different rules you say you are in ireland and I am in uk... in the uk age of consent is 16 not 18 so depending on where he originally came from depends on what he thinks about age,
I met my partner when I was 16 and have been with him ever since I am now 23 and he is now 42 that is 19 or 20 years difference depending on the month, that is not classed as sexual abuse..

She is old enough to know the consequences of her actions...

And I for 1 didn't know you had to be 18 in ireland :o

Could this man not know the age?

My first boyfriend was 27 and I was 15 ;) didn't have sex with him but the age factor was their all the same.. that relationship didn't last due to him been a ****** but their you go..

She knows what she did at the end of the day and I hope you don't disrespect me for saying this but...
Her past is exactly that and if you wernt togather at the time then why bring up the issues, they are not effecting her in the slightest only driving you mad, you need to learn to get over it and carry on with the future, by keep digging into it and bringing it up you are going to drive the girl of your dreams away from you... do you want that?

Let it go and think ahead for the future, don't let him bother you and that will make you a greater man , and hopefully she will see the bothering has gone away and may want to try again with you..

Best of luck
Katie