[familyman2]

I don't quite understand what is going on. My wife of 12 years asked for a divorce 4 weeks ago. She said she didn't think we could work out our differences. I do, but that's besides the point. We've had some road blocks but nothing serious like adultry or abuse. We also have two children.
I think it is a sin to give up when kids are involved without trying everything.

Since this initial declaration she has made no attempt to get the process in gear. I tried a couple times, but she ended up having to cancel (we are separated). In fact she has been acting very friendly, almost like there is no real problem.

What is going through her mind?

[Delilah P]

In my opinion, just from reading what you had written, it almost seems to me that she is making 'empty threats'. Meaning that, perhaps she was feeling frustrated? Unwanted? Not needed? And, by saying she wants a divorce, but never following through.. she is at least getting more attention from you now than before her divorce threats. Does any of this make any sense to you? Did the two of you have quality time together after the children were born? Did previous conversations go to almost none after a few years? Maybe this is her 'cry' for attention. Perhaps thd two of you could compromise on the values you said you two differ on.. stay in the middle of the road without causing any tension.. give each other some one-on-one attention... suggest a babysitter, even if the two of you stay close to home to have some 'together' time. I can only go by the little info you have given here.. but I'm sensing it's her way of saying she wants attention, too. I hope this is all it is. You say you want to stay in the marriage.. maybe it just needs this little bit of 'fine-tuning'. Good Luck to you.

[familyman2]

Hi Delilah, Thank you for your thoughts. To answer some of your questions: We have tried counceling, and "dating", and we have worked on finding middle ground. We have made progress, I feel, but it is still not perfect. We still argue from time to time. She just feels like we will never be able to compromise enough to make it work.

She could be making idle threats, but it feels real.

[vlee]

Maybe she needs individual counseling. Maybe there are things she would be willing to open up to a therapist about if you weren't in the room. I am sure that sounds a little scary, but if your marriage is to improve then maybe your wife needs to take some time and sort through her feelings and re-focus. Have you asked her to try it? Maybe a suggestion that seems non-accusatory like, "For some reason I feel that we seem unable to communicate well, and I am concerned that it seems you have a hard time opening up to me. Would you consider speaking to a counselor? I feel like maybe if you were to open up to someone else you'd eventually be able to include me. I'd really like to be the person you lean on again." Make the statements about you, and yes, use the word "feel" a lot. It takes the pressure off her. Good Luck!

[Delilah P]

I agree with much of what vlee had written here. Nothing will be 100% perfect.. but the fact that you are both working towards it is a huge improvement in itself! Are you both perfectionists.. is that why you and your wife still don't think 'it's' perfect yet? Or, are your differences in opinion so far apart that you still have a huge gap in the middle? In my opinion, unless the arguing is at full volume and hurtful, then you could both learn how to control the conversation before arguing gets to the bad stage. Counseling would help.. or, counseling to learn how to converse in a way to share thoughts without attacking each other verbally.

I hope you can both work out your differences. It seems like you want really want to figure this out and put it all behind you. Good for you! I wish you the best.

[familyman2]

Well we finally have made plans to talk this weekend. She definitely sounds to be serious about wanting a divorce. Are there usually second thoughts by the one who wants a divorce? What if anything would cause her to reconsider? Even though I want her to stay, I don't feel it would be wise to ask her. It should be her choice without any guilt or influence. Do you have any advice for me going into this meeting, as you know my desires to fix this and not end it?

I am contemplating feeling her out during the talks, and if it seems as if she has any doubts I want to see if she would be willing to do the following:

Put off the divorce for 6 months. In this time we seek counceling to rebuild our friendship.
We don't talk about getting back together and we don't talk about divorce. Just fix our friendship. After 6 months we see where we are at that point. If she still wants a divorce I will give it to her no questions asked.

Thank you

[Delilah P]

Well, this is certainly going in the right direction! I like the idea that you have set the weekend aside to talk. But you wrote, "Even though I want her to stay, I don't feel it would be wise to ask her." Please, in my opinion.. and being that I am a woman... you have to let her know that you want her to stay! You have to make her feel needed, wanted.. not only as the mother of your children, but also as the person you had vowed to love forever. It seems to me that you DO feel that way about her, right? If that's true, then PLEASE.. this is your opportunity to let her know how you feel.. let her know you want her and need her.. that you love her. If she loves you, then she will also do whatever is possible to hold the marriage together. I think your proposal of trying to regain the 'friendship' that you both had is a great idea. Yes, give it six months. But, also try to rekindle the love you had felt as your friendship was building. Do some of the things you used to do when you were 'courting'. If she agrees with counseling, then try that, too. Sometimes two people are THINKING they are saying the same thing, but it comes out differently in the translation. Sometimes people need a counselor just to help you both understand that you're both on the same page, but you are just articulating it differently to one another. Think if these two days (weekend) as your last chance to really let her feel how you feel. Even go as far as to say, "I'm not sure I can say all that is on my mind .. maybe it won't come out right .. so just let me say it all." People have to work at what they REALLY want in life.. the same holds true for relationships. Have something that she will find endearing this weekend.. a notecard or love letter she may have given you.. a special photo of the two of you or with your children... something you may have cooked for her.. a favorite dessert.. a very special restaurant.. wear a shirt she gave you that she really liked on you... find something that will pull her in a little closer during your talk.

Please give us an update after the weekend, OK? I for one would love to hear what is happening. Best wishes and best of luck to you.

[familyman2]

You are beautiful Delilah! I will take your advice and check back after the weekend.

Thank you

[talaniman]

Sorry I am just to curious as to what issues could lead a couple of 12 years to a divorce? It has to be major if your separated, so if you can be a little more specific, so I can understand why she is so adamant to end this relationship.

[NowWhat]

I have to say - if you don't want a divorce - do not leave anything unsaid. Don't be afraid to tell her EXACTLY how you feel. You do not want to look back and think - if I had only...
It will eat you up inside.
People can change their minds - I did.

[Delilah P]

I have to say - if you don't want a divorce - do not leave anything unsaid. Don't be afraid to tell her EXACTLY how you feel. You do not want to look back and think - if I had only....
It will eat you up inside.
People can change their minds - I did.

Absolutely! You have to let her know exactly how you feel. I couldn't agree with this poster more. Best wishes.

[familyman2]

OK, on your advice I have written down what I wish to tell my wife. I am planning on talking to her tonight, so if anyone catches this soon please give me some feedback. To corny? All right? Did I leave anything out? Thank you, thank you...

As follows:

Dear Tami, I don’t know exactly where to begin or what to say, but I hope this comes out right. Please read this with an open mind and an open heart:

There has never been anything more important and special in my life than my marriage to you. If you have ever doubted this I am truly sorry. I have only wanted to love you unconditionally. I want you in my life. I need you in my life. I have taken an oath willingly to commit my love to you eternally. I don’t think I could break this oath if I tried.

I am now having second thoughts about this divorce. I think our marriage is too important to throw away. We can have many more years of happiness together. I know there are other men who could and would love you, but I know for a fact that there is no other man on this planet that can love you with the passion and depth I hold for you. It is just not possible. If I can guarantee you a marriage that will exceed your every desire and expectation, with a good man than is completely devoted to you, would you be willing to give it another try?

I realize we have had problems that have yet to be worked out. I am absolutely positive that we can fix these to where everyone is content. The love we bring to each other can overcome any obstacle. I am sure of it.

I don’t expect us to jump right back in to full speed marriage. What I recommend is that we forget about divorce, at least for now, and not talk about the marriage either. I suggest we get back with a certified counselor and work on rebuilding our friendship first. Work through our differences and learn to accept each other for who we are. Let’s learn to communicate with a better perspective of who we are.

I know without a shadow of a doubt Tami that we belong together. I can feel it to my soul, and I think you feel it too. We ARE soul mates. We can make each other happy, whole, and content.

I dream of the day that we can all be together as one family, under one roof. The way it should be. We can be a model couple and model parents. We can have it all, because I want to give you everything that you deserve and more.

There is so much I want to say, but it would be better to show you. Tami, please don’t leave. Let me prove to you that you made the right choice. You will not regret it. This I am sure. I will make you the happiest, proudest woman you ever could have dreamed.

I love you with everything ounce of my being. And always will…

[vlee]

Seems very sweet to me, and you used the word "we" instead of "I", so it doesn't come across as pushy or insensitive. I hope she reconsiders the divorce.

[Delilah P]

I just read your post now and depending on which coast you live on.. it may be too late for you to read mine. But, for what it's worth, I think your letter is very forthright and directly from the heart. Very well written. I sincerely hope and pray that your wife will understand you better through your words here.. I would have to think that she can see and feel what you are going through emotionally here.. doing your best to "woo" her back. As I read it, I thought... you're putting the WHOLE burden on yourself.. promising that you'll make her happy, proud, etc. Gee, it's a two-way street.. I hope she understands that. You BOTH have to work at improving the communication and friendship to regain the total trust and love your once had. I felt bad when I read that you're "promising' everything she had ever wanted. :-( But, it's how you felt when you wrote it.. and your words were coming from your heart.. so it's fine. What I'm trying to say is that you deserve as much happiness.. so don't take all of the burden of making this relationship work. Hopefully, your wife will agree and work together with you.. and it'll be a joint effort. What a sweet, sweet, letter. Please let us know how your meeting with her turned out! I'm keeping postitve thoughts for the two of you.

[familyman2]

Ok we were not able to have our talk because her schedule was full, again. So I just handed her the letter and asked her to read it when she had a moment. I went home and didn't hear from her all night. I was assuming that either she was not interested and didn't have the guts to call and let me down. Or she was contemplating the letter and didn't want to talk about it last night. Needless to say I didn't sleep a wink. I felt good because I finally told her exactly how I feel, and I felt bad with the thought that this could be the final attempt.

So, on to this morning. My wife brought over my son, and we had a chance to talk about it. She initially did not want to discuss it, so I just started the conversation without her. She couldn't help but join in. She was still reluctant, as was to be expected, but she did agree that we could hold off the divorce and seek counseling. She asked if I could go first and she would join me after a few sessions.

Some of the past did come up and she said she is having a hard time forgiving and forgetting. I told her that I have forgiven her for things she's done to hurt me, and hoped that she would be able to get to a better place; in time, and after counseling.

So in a nut shell, it seems that she is open to the idea of a possible reconciliation. She wants some time to think about things. I just kept encouraging her that this was the right thing to do, that our marriage and kids were well worth the effort. I also told her that the marriage can be better than it has ever been if we just stick in there. She is very pessimistic at this point. But hopefully this will improve as we progress.

What do you think? Did I do well? What should I be thinking or doing in the next few days, weeks? How should I play this hand? What works in wooing woman, especially a wife who has one and a half feet out the door? Should I give her a certain amount of time between talks?

I feel cautiously optimistic about this. I pray for her to turn the corner, and for me to have the strength and wisdom to see it to fruition.

[NowWhat]

Well, first thing, if you said you were going to do something - you follow through. You need to get into a counselor asap - if that is what was agreed upon.
My thing has always been - if you say your are going to do something you had better do it. By not, it breaks down trust little by little because you can't count on a person and it shows that you are not committed.

I don't know if I would be in her face all the time. I would let her know that you are there. If you call to talk to your son - talk to her and just keep it casual - don't always focus in on what your problems are.
You could send her flowers at work or send her little notes. Just to say Hi and I love you. Or to say you were thinking of her today and you wanted to let her know.
Nothing over the top or anything - just subtle gestures. The time to hash out everything is in counseling.

I think you should be cautious right now - she has given an inch (be happy about that) but you are not out of the woods yet. Just take it slowly. What's that old saying - "slow and steady wins the race."

[Delilah P]

Yes, I think you did very well being that your wife had a full schedule. I liked the way you initiated the conversation when she dropped off your son. I also agree with the last poster.. follow-up on your promise of seeing a counselor... the sooner the better. Don't let there be a time lapse, otherwise your wife will think your words were empty. Make the appointment and let her know the date that had been set. She'll know you're serious.

Let your mind go back to when you were both dating. Was there something you did that she just loved? Note cards, flowers, a certain brand of chocolates, hummus, tofu.. <laughing>? Send a well-worded card (loving card) to her once a week to keep you ever on her mind. Flowers would be nice, but you don't have to be extravagant. A small little bunch of spring flowers in a low vase would be SO sweet! Do you have Trader Joe stores in your part of the States? The reason I ask is because they sell inexpensive, lovely flowers.. and even small, potted single plants. Trader Joe's is a trendy, small food store. Anyway, the idea is not a huge arrangement of flowers, but something intimate and small which you let her know you are thinking of her. Don't go for a long period without talking to her. Check in with her just to say 'hi' every 2-3 days.. a short hello to let her know you're thinking about her.. nothing heavy.

Priorities first, though! Make that appointment for the counselor! Please! And, let her know you made it.

I'm really pulling for you. I hope the two of you re-discover yourselves with one another. Keep us updated, OK? Best wishes to you...

[talaniman]

I still am curiuos as to the events that led to all of this in the first place.

[familyman2]

Well, there is quite a history to what has lead us to this point Taliniman. 12 years to be exact. But the main problems have been problems that many couples face, which are money and kids. She has two kids from previous unwed relationships. I stepped in to be a stepdad and tried the best I could. I think I did a good job, but there were the usual authority type issues that plagued us. Without any experience or a manual this was a difficult situation for all of us. After about six years of this we got to a point where my wife was siding with the kids in front of them, which made me pull in the other direction. Further, my wife and her kids all have ADD, and it was rough dealing with them at times.
SO my wife took the kids and left. I wanted them to stay and have family counseling, but she has a tendency of flight instead of fight. We had two more kids of our own, who we share custody. Even though I gave her money for a new place, and have since made peace with her kids. She keeps suing me for the same crime, that I really didn't commit. She left, but doesn't see it that way. I have also offered to build a new house for her and her mom and sister, and kids. They all live together now. But twice they have backed out.
Our other big problem has been money. She spends, has no credit, and has put us in hot water for various irresponsible reasons. She loves to spoil her kids, and live for today. I am a bit more conservative. I prefer to save for tomorrow. There are pluses and minuses to both of our values. We just need to come to a middle ground. Another issue is that her father left when she was 13. I think she has a hard time believing that I really love her and won't leave. No matter how much I reassure her, and do things for her, it is never enough. Hence the need for serious counseling. She has a hard time taking responsibility for any of our problems and see her issues as solved. She thinks the problems mainly stem from my issues. Maybe she's right, maybe she's wrong, maybe she's half right.
All I know is that we need a top flight therapist who will help us both see the light, and find the love we have for each other. I know it's there. It never left. And even though I have pointed out her problems, she is a beautiful, sweet, fun, hard working, person. She is a wonderful mother, and was, at one time, a very loving wife. If I didn't have faith in her I would have let it go by now.

I hope this sheds a little more light on the subject. There's always more to say, but I won't take up your time any longer. Thanks for listening, interest, and concern.

[vlee]

I am glad to hear she is willing to try counseling. For now, I wouldn't put any more pressure on her. Attend a few sessions and let her know how they go. Then ask her to join you for the next one. All the issues you have and have had will be brought to light and discussed there, so save them for that room. Take a slow but steady approach. Best of luck.