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jlisenbe · Dec 11, 2019, 06:38 PM

jlisenbe: You said the "liberal left wing of the Democrat Party: Is there a CONSERVATIVE WING? Is there, even, a CENTER WING (Moderate)? From where I am standing, the ENTIRE Democrat Party is liberal and left wing!

Probably pretty accurate.

talaniman · Dec 11, 2019, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Yeah, just like you had the names of five people who had first hand knowledge of the president's guilt, except that, of course, then you didn't. And you just knew that Kavanaugh had to be guilty, except, of course, you had no evidence. And you think we make noise??? Noise and name-calling is all you have, so that's all you go with. Loud noise to cover up ignorance and dishonesty.

For the record, I had 7, and still do except they aren't allowed to testify even after being warned this would be seen as obstruction with corrupt intent. It was ignored and here e are. Personally, I would have still tried to go through the courts, but the appeal in the McGahm court case to testify will be heard in January and by extension apply to the other names as well. We will see.

You have a very simple and corrupt philosophy of justice. If it benefits you and the liberal left wing of the dem party, then it must surely be true. If it is a negative for Trump or for conservative values, then it must be correct. But if it's bad for the liberal dems, even it it's true, then it must be false. What a strange world you live in.

Truth is best found through investigation my friend. That should apply to left and right so your hodgepodge of words has no meaning or context unless you can specifically express it.

jlisenbe · Dec 11, 2019, 08:02 PM

For the record, I had 7, and still do except they aren't allowed to testify

For the record, you've got zilch. You have no idea what any of those people know or what they would say.

Truth is best found through investigation my friend. That should apply to left and right so your hodgepodge of words has no meaning or context unless you can specifically express it.

I saw your sense of "justice" during the Kavanaugh hearings. No evidence other than the testimony of a woman who had a hundred holes in her story, but the dems still wanted to loudly proclaim him guilty. Why? So you could keep him off the Supreme Court. He was a conservative, so to all of you he was guilty. Thus we see liberal dem "justice".

talaniman · Dec 11, 2019, 08:20 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

For the record, you've got zilch. You have no idea what any of those people know or what they would say.

Shouldn't we find out? Of course we should so let's get about it.

I saw your sense of "justice" during the Kavanaugh hearings. No evidence other than the testimony of a woman who had a hundred holes in her story, but the dems still wanted to loudly proclaim him guilty. Why? So you could keep him off the Supreme Court. He was a conservative, so to all of you he was guilty. Thus we see liberal dem "justice".

There you go again. You guys had the votes to push the drunkard frat boy to SCOTUS and stop and limit any investigation so you got what you wanted that time. So we all see conservative "justice " too! Haven't heard one repub say whether getting a foreign country involved in our elections is wrong though. Wonder why that is? Maybe you can address that question for us JL.

While your at it, what was the evidence to investigate Hunter Biden again? Besides to smear his daddy who happens to be running for president? That's not evidence you know, just a political ploy to sling mud.

paraclete · Dec 11, 2019, 09:35 PM

What are you going to find out Tal? nothing you don't already know. You are going to impeach Trump for being an idiot, yes , he is guilty, but it isn't grounds for impeachment

talaniman · Dec 12, 2019, 02:00 AM

The dufus isn't being impeached for being an idiot. He is being impeached for breaking the LAW, that says that you cannot use your office to invite a foreign nation to influence our election. He is being impeached because he is preventing the congress from investigating his breaking of the law. Now the righties can tell you whatever they please but that doesn't change those FACTS. He abused the public trust and tried to hide it to a degree that was more egregious than Nixon, or Clinton.

Maybe the righties can stomach such behavior, and it would not be the first time, but if we do not protect our laws, our elections then I fail to see the point in insisting everybody else but the dufus abide by them. He crossed the line and should be held into account especially given this may well be his second offense, just like everybody else.

He is NOT above the law Clete, that's the whole point of our society as hard as that is to tell sometimes.

Vacuum7 · Dec 12, 2019, 03:57 AM

BOTTOM LINE: Just like Hillary's E-mails, Biden's problem is parallel: IF YOU WERN'T DIRTY IN THE FIRST PLACE, THERE Wouldn't BE ANY DIRT TO "DIG UP"! We can't help it that BIDEN committed dirty acts in a FOREIGN COUNTRY! Just because he committed criminal acts in a foreign country doesn't mean that you can't go after him. Just because Biden declares himself a Presidential Candidate doesn't "SHIELD" him from being investigated. The POTUS has every right to protect the U.S. from CRIMINAL ELEMENTS LIKE BIDEN! He is not going to be able hide behind the cloak of Presidential Candidate: Its the right of the POTUS to go after criminals!

talaniman · Dec 12, 2019, 04:52 AM

Maybe so, but then again it's the dems job to go after a dirty dufus.

paraclete · Dec 12, 2019, 05:34 AM

Originally Posted by talaniman

The dufus isn't being impeached for being an idiot. He is being impeached for breaking the LAW, that says that you cannot use your office to invite a foreign nation to influence our election. He is being impeached because he is preventing the congress from investigating his breaking of the law. Now the righties can tell you whatever they please but that doesn't change those FACTS. He abused the public trust and tried to hide it to a degree that was more egregious than Nixon, or Clinton.

Maybe the righties can stomach such behavior, and it would not be the first time, but if we do not protect our laws, our elections then I fail to see the point in insisting everybody else but the dufus abide by them. He crossed the line and should be held into account especially given this may well be his second offense, just like everybody else.

He is NOT above the law Clete, that's the whole point of our society as hard as that is to tell sometimes.

Investigations were made Tal, but the demonrats weren't satisfied and then Trump had the temerity to accuse one of their sacred cows of illegal activity and influence peddling. He should have allowed someone else to make the request, but we all know Trump doesn't trust anyone. Has he abused his office? probably

jlisenbe · Dec 12, 2019, 06:00 AM

Here's the reality.

Dems. "Mr. Trump, you're guilty."
Trump. "Where is your evidence?"
Dems. "We don't need evidence. We hate you because you defeated our liberal darling, so that's good enough for us."

talaniman · Dec 12, 2019, 06:16 AM

Originally Posted by paraclete

Investigations were made Tal, but the demonrats weren't satisfied and then Trump had the temerity to accuse one of their sacred cows of illegal activity and influence peddling. He should have allowed someone else to make the request, but we all know Trump doesn't trust anyone. Has he abused his office? probably

He had that chance Clete and if I'm not mistaken the fool could have just made a formal request through the DOJ to the Ukraine government to start an investigation but NOOOOO, he just full out asked a foreign government for an investigation into his political opponent and the repubs deny that was the wrong thing to do. Then we could have impeached DOJ AG for playing political partisan games. No impeachment, and the dems would have no choice but to wait for a judge to finally hand down a judgement for testimony, and documents and the election would probably be over by then.

No doubt the dufus has abused his office, and his oath, and his country.

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Here's the reality.

Dems. "Mr. Trump, you're guilty."
Trump. "Where is your evidence?"
Dems. "We don't need evidence. We hate you because you defeated our liberal darling, so that's good enough for us."

We don't need evidence to bring articles of impeachment, just a vote and then it goes to the senate. That's how it works. So your spin is silly even if I took it as twisted humor which I don't. Hating a guy is no excuse for bad behavior no matter how you spin it.

jlisenbe · Dec 12, 2019, 07:35 AM

We don't need evidence

That is plainly your motto. I don't think the American people will go for such an outrageous view of justice.

Vacuum7 · Dec 12, 2019, 07:43 AM

Talaniman: You sure the JAPANESE haven't secretly taken over the Democrat Party? The DEMOCRAT PARTY SHOULD BE RENAMED "PARTY OF KAMIKAZE" because they are committed so hard to leftist ideals that they are bashing their collective brains out on the suicide mission of trying to remove Trump from Office knowing full well, well beforehand, that their attemp will be in vain. The whole Democrat fiasco of the IMPEACHMENT Inquiry is a total POLITICAL EXERCISE, it has nothing to do with justice, as proven by no need for evidence and as proven by no need to Due Process: YOU KNOOW IT IS SIMPLY DESIGNED AS AN ATTEMPT TO DAMAGE TRUMP FOR THE 2020 ELECTIONS: AND IT IS FAILING IN THAT ATTEMP! FAILING BIG TIME!

Demos launch and Impeachment missile at Trump.....missile is steered by incompetent Little Adam Schiff and Jerry "The Penguin" Nadler and missile misses by a country mile: Trump is found not guilty in Senate Trial. Entire Impeachment Inquiry is ACADEMIC! Demos knew going into all this that they had NO CHANCE of removing Trump from Office because they knew they couldn't get past the Senate. All Demos did was lose voters, lose elections, guarantee Trump's reelection, and do what they do best: SPEND TONS OF TAXPAYER $$$s!

talaniman · Dec 12, 2019, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

That is plainly your motto. I don't think the American people will go for such an outrageous view of justice.

Half the country supported the impeachment inquiry, and that number is unchanged as the vote in a few days for articles of impeachment against the dufus. Let me clarify my previous statement as it should have read you don't need evidence to start an investigation. Thank you for pointing that out as justice is in the process of being done. The senate get's it's chance soon to decide what must be done and that's the process of justice.

Originally Posted by Vacuum7

Talaniman: You sure the JAPANESE haven't secretly taken over the Democrat Party? The DEMOCRAT PARTY SHOULD BE RENAMED "PARTY OF KAMIKAZE" because they are committed so hard to leftist ideals that they are bashing their collective brains out on the suicide mission of trying to remove Trump from Office knowing full well, well beforehand, that their attemp will be in vain. The whole Democrat fiasco of the IMPEACHMENT Inquiry is a total POLITICAL EXERCISE, it has nothing to do with justice, as proven by no need for evidence and as proven by no need to Due Process: YOU KNOOW IT IS SIMPLY DESIGNED AS AN ATTEMPT TO DAMAGE TRUMP FOR THE 2020 ELECTIONS: AND IT IS FAILING IN THAT ATTEMP! FAILING BIG TIME!

Demos launch and Impeachment missile at Trump.....missile is steered by incompetent Little Adam Schiff and Jerry "The Penguin" Nadler and missile misses by a country mile: Trump is found not guilty in Senate Trial. Entire Impeachment Inquiry is ACADEMIC! Demos knew going into all this that they had NO CHANCE of removing Trump from Office because they knew they couldn't get past the Senate. All Demos did was lose voters, lose elections, guarantee Trump's reelection, and do what they do best: SPEND TONS OF TAXPAYER $$$s!

For all that rant and rave you left out the attempt by the dufus to connect the Biden's and Ukraine corruption to tarnish them for the purpose of re electing the dufus.

Wondergirl · Dec 12, 2019, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

That is plainly your motto. I don't think the American people will go for such an outrageous view of justice.

Tal didn't say that. You chopped off his sentence to make it untrue. He actually said: "We don't need evidence to bring articles of impeachment, just a vote and then it goes to the senate."

That's how it works, btw.

jlisenbe · Dec 12, 2019, 12:40 PM

Tal didn't say that. You chopped off his sentence to make it untrue. He actually said: "We don't need evidence to bring articles of impeachment, just a vote and then it goes to the senate."

You are appealing to context, but even at that, it still has the same meaning. "We don't need evidence" in a legal proceeding, which impeachment clearly is, is still an outrageous view of justice. It is admitting that a person can be charged with high crimes and misdemeanors without evidence. In what way do you agree with that?

Now if you want to make it purely political then your statement would make more sense, but God help us if all of this boils down to nothing more than politics. I can think of nothing more wretched than that. That a political party would attempt to basically depose a duly elected president simply out of political expedience would do violence to everything a democratic republic stands for.

Wondergirl · Dec 12, 2019, 01:21 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

You are appealing to context, but even at that, it still has the same meaning. "We don't need evidence" in a legal proceeding, which impeachment clearly is, is still an outrageous view of justice. It is admitting that a person can be charged with high crimes and misdemeanors without evidence. In what way do you agree with that?

No! Get a grip! The evidence will be presented elsewhere, NOT YET! There's no charge at this point.

jlisenbe · Dec 12, 2019, 01:23 PM

No! Get a grip! The evidence will be presented elsewhere, NOT YET!

So that's how it works now? Accuse him of guilt, brand him as guilty, and then try to find evidence? What an interesting perspective you have.

Me get a grip?? What are all those exclamation marks about? You seem rather stirred up.

Wondergirl · Dec 12, 2019, 01:38 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

So that's how it works now? Accuse him of guilt, brand him as guilty, and then try to find evidence? What an interesting perspective you have.

You've never had a civics or US government course apparently. Please read up on how this works.

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Me get a grip?? What are all those exclamation marks about? You seem rather stirred up.

Oh, yes, I'm stirred up!!!! We teachers get stirred up when people don't do research.

jlisenbe · Dec 12, 2019, 02:37 PM

You've never had a civics or US government course apparently. Please read up on how this works.

I see. You can't explain it, so I need to look it up. Right.

Oh, yes, I'm stirred up!!!! We teachers get stirred up when people don't do research.

Just read my comment above again. It works here as well.

Just so you'll know, I'm well aware that the House functions somewhat like a grand jury in impeachment. If they have evidence of a crime, they can vote on impeachment and, if passed, it is then passed to the Senate where what could be referred to as a trial takes place. If 2/3 of the Senate can be convinced the president is guilty, then he/she is removed from office. But to send articles of impeachment simply because you don't like someone is both absurd and despicable. Sorry that your liberal dogma prevents you from seeing that.