[Mericandream]

So I am curious about dilution of ETG tests. If a test shows up dilluted for other drugs (i.e. THC... etc... ) will EtG still be present in that diluted sample, or will a retest be ordered for false negative?

Is synthetic urine a possibility for passing an EtG test without diluting?

Lecture me if you must, but an answer would also be appreciated.

[smoothy]

If you are even consider doing that you really, really deserve to fail.

What's wrong with doing as you were ordered and abstain.


You don't get a retest when you cheat in any way shape or form and they detect it... they fail you. And they are way smarter than you are. They have seen all the tricks drunks and other addicts try....and know how to detect them. When they detect a cheat attempt...its an automatic fail.

And sorry....NOBODY here is going to help you break the law and even attempt to cheat on a test. In fact its against the site rules to do so or even ask for ways to do it.
How about abstaining.....passing a test really IS that easy. Its not going to kill you, its not even going to hurt you. In fact it will do you good.

Join AA they will help you get and stay sober. Not everyone can do it alone..and apparently you are one of them.

[Mericandream]

I have abstained and have done so since November. This is an addiction forum though and the urge is still there so yes I asked the question.. I am still here and not in "inpatient" or jail, I'm actually not even court ordered to be in the program. I self enrolled myself because I realized I have a problem.. As far as AA I tried it but it wasn't for me and I actually am using another program that isn't so much religious as AA.. One of the lessons we are going over now in my class is Urge control and I feel the more I talk about using the more I want to, hence why I asked my question.

[smoothy]

Well good... you recognize you have a problem... and are taking steps to address it through an organized program. However even thinking about ways to cheat is a step in the wrong direction instead of one in the right direction. You need to focus your energy in ways to stay sober and move ahead instead of backwards to your old ways.

A gambler wanting to hang out outside Casinos isn't helping them.....its only reinforcing their urges. Or a Child molester wanting to be where kids are, If you see the parallels in those analogies.

You have to stay away from situations where alcohol is common. Including drinking buddies. As you know...changing habits isn't easy, but its necessary.

[Fr_Chuck]

No, the synthetic does not pass, the testing knows the difference. Along with that, temp issues and other problems that is normally court in testing.

You are lucky if they merely do a retest, this is considered a failure where I used to work, and was even worst than testing positive. It showed not only where they using, but they tried to cover it up.

[Mericandream]

Ok so an absolute no for synthetic.. How about the dilution method? I know it masks other drug tests but does it merely warrant a retest for an EtG as well (which would be unhelpful if having to retest)

[talaniman]

If a fail for dilution triggers a retest, they test for more than just alcohol. This is a confirmation test and can result in a hearing and violation to whatever your agreement is with whatever testing agency you are involved in.

So yes you are screwed. If you are getting heebee geebees from being restless, irritable, and discontent then take it as a sign to reach out for more support from whatever program you are in. Urge control is based on positive action, and good orderly direction, and a lot of help from those that understand what you are going through.

Good you reached out here my friend, but even better with a real person or persons. No way do you keep this to yourself. Tell someone in your program exactly what you are feeling ASAP before you do the dirty deed....as after is too late. You would hate to throw away the sobriety you have worked for already because you FAILED to do the right thing for yourself when you had the chance to wouldn't you?

Call somebody, and tell them you are in a bad place like you are supposed to do. That's how you fight those craving until they pass.

[Luck0rN0t]

Have you tested previously? I ask because all drug testing I have ever done, including the walk-ins, where I literally walked in and had myself tested, under absolutely no order, were all observed. Any sort of tampering - such as trying to use synthetic urine - would have been obvious to the person watching. Cheating is by far, the worst thing you can get caught doing.

In most cases, a diluted sample will count as a positive test result. No questions asked. After a diluted sample, they generally scrutinize you more closely, perhaps lower the cutoff level, test more frequently, and/or employ different testing methods. PEth testing and hair testing will be much more telling of your alcohol consumption history, depending upon your use. Google those, if you have some spare time.

AA is not a religious program, although it does use the word God and does rely upon a Spiritual path - which turns a lot of people off - A Power Greater than Myself is a term I prefer to use or just "HP" for higher power. When I was a practicing alcoholic, alcohol was a power greater than myself because it made everything "better" and once I started drinking, there was no stopping, no "off" switch, no just "a couple of drinks" for this one.

If you still have uncontrollable cravings after 7+ months sober, then something may be missing from your program. I know the Relapse Prevention class I took was enough to make me want to reach for the bottle, after every class. For me, "simply" not drinking was, and is, not enough to maintain a happy, fulfilling life. That void has to be filled with something positive. I found volunteering - walking dogs, working at the local food bank, etc. kept me busy and distracted from constantly thinking about the next drink, for the first year or so. If I spent 1/4 of the time that I used to spend drinking, doing something that wasn't all about me, it made it tolerable.

Didn't mean to go off on a "Recovery" tangent. You asked about testing. Both options are going to lead to more problems. I spent hours, weeks 7 months looking for an easier way, trust me. After 21 months, I have not found one.

Good luck to you on your journey!

[CravenMorhead]

You have to look at this from the testers point of view. What are they looking for? The metabolites produced from alcohol being broken down. That is simple don't you think? It gets more complicated. Urine comes in different dilutions. You could have forgot to drink a lot or worked out a lot and drank a lot for it. A person could drink the same amount of alcohol, but based upon the amount of water they drank, it could produce different numbers on the test. You and a buddy go binge drinking. You do 10 shots and he drinks 10 beers. Same amount of alcohol, but he's got more water in his system and the test will give you different readings.

That's not a good test isn't it? Luckily people who have multiple PhDs and Mscs and are REALLY annoying at parties because they just don't get he joke, have looked at this problem. My analyizing urine and with knowledge of a average persons metabolism they know that the body, regardless of consumption, will put out a known amount of several different compounds. That's the eureka moment for the test in question. Take you and your buddy's binge night, normalize the test to the amount of these secondary chemicals and you'll get roughly the same numbers. Where this breaks down is when you can't normalize the test, this is a failure.

There is also a reasonable amount of psychology behind this too. It is known that alcohol has addictive properties on a emotional level not a chemical level. It is also known that alcohol and consuming it is REALLY fun, which is what brings us back to it. It is also known that people REALLY don't like being told that they can't do something that is REALLY fun. It is also known that, if a person isn't actively being watched, they're more likely to give into the desire for a prohibited substance without a thought for the consequences so long as they believe it to be harmless. Sure you killed someone Drunk Driving, but the pub is just around the corner and you can walk home. No one is going to get hurt. What is also known is when someone does something bad they're going to try to hide ALL evidence of their wrong doing. If you're going to steal a cookie, you're going to damn sure that the cookie jar looks EXACTLY the same and there's nothing linking you to the missing cookie. Given all the above it is easy to reason that if you can't get a reliable reading from the EtG/EtS test then it is 99% certain (19 times out of 20) that the person is trying to hide something, and this is a sign of a guilty conscience. Thus it is highly probable that the tested person did consume alcohol.

There isn't a way around it that hasn't been plugged. You have to expect that there's plants everywhere who are looking for what people are doing to try to pass a test like this, so anything that might work. Synthetic urine for example, won't for very long or at all.

Which brings us back to you. I am happy that you're getting treated for the monkey on your back. Right now what is going to save you is your will to not drink and the ability to isolate you from possible sources of temptation. It is easier to not be tempted and make sure you're not in a place that is going to tempt you then to rely on willpower. AA might not work for you, but that is just one of a large number of support groups. Find what works for you and hold onto it.

Good luck, we're actually rooting you!

[Mericandream]

No I am not observed when I am tested and guys and gals.. I appreciate all your responses. I came here with some urges in my mind and was honestly trying to see if I could sneak a binge in and not have to worry about it.. In reality I got some caring people who don't even know me come and give me advice.

While I have read other places and learned from you guys, while I can mask it all I want with water and dilute my sample, that will more than likely just harm me in the long run and raise suspicions..

This was a blessing in disguise to come here and read your responses. I appreciate everyone taking the time out to respond and give me advice. Thank you

[Fr_Chuck]

Guess we did differently, we always watched the person urinate, or had them step behind a screen after checking their pockets and not allowing any bags. Then we also checked temp of urine to be sure it was fresh.

But for us, a diluted sample, registered as a fail. And a retest, normally retest and future tests were of a more strict nature.