[cayne9111]

Hello I have been renting to a couple since 2011. Started rent off low (500$ for 3b/1ba/1400 sq/ft) because it is an old house and had unknown issues. Well a new water heater, water pump, sewer issues, new gas fireplace, New flooring... it has been repaired and dealt with over the years (mostly cropped up first year of course). Problem is no income once these repairs are made and taxes paid. Renters are constantly late paying rent or electric bill, up to 3 months and must be reminded or do not pay. Asked them to get electric bill in their name but they don't have money for the deposit, bad credit I suppose. Rent hasn't changed and it's in an area of substantial rental value increasing due to low amount of properties in the Asheville NC area. Renters said would move out in February (this month). It seems they have changed their mind.

Facebook posts show painting of wooden kitchen cabinets and brick fireplace. I am extremely upset and this was my grandparents home and I did not OK this. I co own with my brother. We planned to fix up and sell but now I am thinking they are devaluing our property. You can't remove paint from brick or cabinets at least easily. Also installed a dishwasher but there was not room before so must have made room for it with the cabinets.

I need advice how to handle this. I was out of town when they moved in and my brother did not sign a lease agreement. He does have text saying they want to move out this month or possibly buy the place. I doubt they could afford because they want what they have paid in rent off the price OR rent to own. I tried rent to own with a 3000 dollar car and that did not end up well with same renters... I will not do a rent to own after that (lesson learned and car returned with tranny issues!)

Questions:

Should I raise rent (or can I for several years increase in rental value) and create a strict lease agreement or kick them out with hopes to sell the place? Like an ultimatum to either pay increased rent and agree to terms or move out, or to even buy house?

How should I bring up the unapproved "upgrades"? Aka painting wooden cabinets and brick fireplace... Adding dishwasher which did not have a place for before. Should these changes be fined against them or how does that work? I know they do not have money to pay for any charges.

Note: broke married student relying on GI Bill. Planned to use money from selling house to pay off debts -10k car loan, 5k credit card, cell phone costs added to monthly bill. The rest me and my husband would invest long term. I will graduate this winter from college with good job outlook.

[cayne9111]

Basically I know they either need to move or buy the place at a reasonable price with land. The wanted to not buy land but we would have no purpose for it as it is mostly fenced in mountain side, plus it has their water supply (spring). Have a real estate agent who would charge half normal price. Just don't know how to value the place and on the other hand may have to settle for lower price when dealing with this family. Not sure they can get a loan since they do not pay rent and could not pay an electric deposit. Its stressful. Need insight and the knowledge how to properly handle this. I know I would need to give them 30 days.

[ScottGem]

Absent a termed lease they are a month to month tenant. You can raise the rent, but not retroactively. But if they are having a problem paying the current rent, how can they afford more?

Being a landlord is a business, you have to treat it as such. If they are late on the rent you send them a pay or quit notice If they are constantly late you send them a 30 day vacate notice. If they don't comply, then file for an eviction order. Letting them go 3 months is bad business.

This site Local Tenant Rights, Laws, and Protections: North Carolina can help you learn your obligations and the tenants.

If there is damage when they move out, you take it out of the deposit.

[talaniman]

It's your place, you set the terms under law, NOT them, and act accordingly as Scott says.

[AK lawyer]

I would kick them out ASAP. You of course could take the damages (painting woodwork and fireplace, probable destruction of cabinets for dishwasher) out of the deposit, but I'm betting there isn't a deposit. You shouldn't have to lurk on Facebook to discover that they have been modifying the premises without your permission: give them notice for an inspection; hire an agent if you are not nearby to inspect yourself. But give the required written notice and evict them before it's too late.

[Fr_Chuck]

I would kick them out, but short of that.
1. give them a option of a written lease.
a. provide for late payment changes that would be enforced.
b. I assume you are renting furnished, since you said chairs, that is an assumed issue that most furniture has damage over time, and seldom is good furnture provided in low income housing.
2. raise the rent to market level.
3. give them in writing a 30 day notice to move electric, and shut it off from your name if not moved.
a. there is a legal issue here, since you have allowed it to be in your name, for all these years. So short of a written lease, it may be hard to make them change electric now.

[cayne9111]

I have made a lease and given it to them. They know, I know about the changes they have made. They refuse to sign the lease because the septic is giving them problems. Afraid when they parked a truck on top of the septic, it may have cracked the tank. We thought they broke the lines leading out to the house and had them fixed but still it drains very slowly. They say its impossible to do laundry when it has had rained a good amount. I am thinking I could ask them to not do laundry but that seems a little unreasonable because there is not a laundry mat nearby. To temp "fix" septic apparently they have set up a pump to drain out to the creek. I am not okay with this but apparently the co-owner was aware and I do not want them to blackmail me legally. I did not know about it but the other owner did. I am taking charge now because the other owner lives out of state and has been too lenient in my opinion. House could potentially be condemned if it is bad enough but I honestly do not know its full extent. I want to get the septic checked ASAP but I do not think the rent income compared to the costs of repair would really be worth it. 500 a month and 4 months rent goes right into taxes and home insurance.. not to mention costly repairs over the past few years.

[cayne9111]

Hello,

I have renters and have issues with them as well as the septic tank there. They had parked their truck over the septic and thought the lines from the house were broken because the septic was not draining fast enough. We figured it was their fault but we decided to just fix it anyway. Had those repaired and taken off rent because that is what they assumed it was. One of their fathers did the repair is why the rent was taken off... Well that did not fix the problem and I wanted a lease agreement in writing. They will NOT sign it until the septic is fixed. If I do not have the money to replace the septic, and they are on a month to month lease, do I have the right to give them a notice? They are habitually late with rent... 3 months behind at one point just last fall. Late with electric so I am trying to put that in their name in the lease. They have also decided to paint cabinets and the fireplace as well as add a counter top and add a dishwasher and make a spot for it to fit in the cabinets. I have NOT accepted rent after finding out about this on social media. I should also mention renters father apparently set up a pump to basically straight pipe any excess sewer water into the creek. As soon as they told me I said that is NOT OKAY. However, they seem to want to blackmail me and say the other co-owner and my father knew about the situation. I am now taking over because the other co owner has moved and has no time to carefully manage the place.

The predicament... can they get me in trouble over what they did with the septic? Can I move them out knowing it probably need to be replaced? It is a month to month verbal lease. They have sent no written notices about needing a repair but now that I want a lease they are focusing 100% on the septic. It seems they are trying to blackmail me into keeping them there and continue illegal practices ( straight piping).

I cannot afford a new septic. I just simply cannot. Would pumping the septic when needed (if needed) and giving them a 30 day notice suffice? Or can I say if you do not agree to new lease then you must go? HELP



EDIT: also should notice I am unaware of any backing up of sewage just slow drainage. They stated they could not wash laundry after a really rainy day but that is about it. Thinking septic could just be too small and not draining enough for 4 people. Old septic so no records on it. I should also mention without permission alterations are considered a misdemeanor in NC. I just do not want to take it to that level.

[talaniman]

You need a lawyer because these tenants are really screwing you over. You need a professional assessment of the property (inspection of all conditions, damages, and an estimate of repairs).

I am sure you can serve them an eviction notice post haste, and sue them for damages, and put your affairs in order. That you and the co owner have let those folks bamboozle and blackmail you this long is no way to conduct business and some sound legal advice will go a long way in solving your problem and getting your affairs in order.

Well worth the money since you aren't making any anyway. Give them their 30 day notice and sue them for damages. Or let them sue you for everything you got for renting a dump!

Your decision. Let a lawyer help you make it.

[ScottGem]

First, please do not start a new thread over the same issue. Your threads have been merged.

We answered you, already. Since they are month to month, you can give them 30 days to vacate. If they are behind in the rent, you can give them a pay or quit notice (I think its 10 days in NC). I told you earlier you need to treat this as a business and you need to learn your rights and obligations.

As for the septic, you need to have a pro evaluate it. You won't know what the issue is until you do.

If you just want to raise the rent, you can do so, just give them 30 days notice. They can refuse to sign a new lease, so you can terminate their month to month at any time with legal notice.

[AK lawyer]

... I should also mention without permission alterations are considered a misdemeanor in NC. I just do not want to take it to that level.

Fine, but you seem to think you might get in trouble regarding the septic system ("septic" is an adjective, not a noun; it "modifies" a noun, such as "system", "tank", "field", etc.). You won't get in trouble because you didn't cause the problem, so don't let that stop you from evicting these people.

[aliseaodo]

Just a thought - could the newly installed dishwasher have something to do with the septic issue?