[976missy]

How do I evict an occupant out of my home, our landlord put him on our lease as an occupant not a lease holder and said he is left with us to deal with. The man came with the house we are renting. We rented it to prevent him from being homeless, which was our first mistake, 1)We are woken up when he is dropped off between 2 am - 3 am highly intoxicated, and left at our doorstep and told he's our responsibility now, where he doesn't reside upstairs. 2) We have several times told him to please stop smoking indoors, where he agreed he would not but still to this day continues and it comes upstairs to our home. 3) When he is highly intoxicated all he talks about is how he is going to kill himself. I do not want our children to end up finding this man dead in our basement.What can we do?? I live in PA.

[joypulv]

Wow. Your altruism knows no bounds, if you rented to prevent him from being homeless. Or did you get super cheap rent?
You really have no easy options other than moving out. Why are you talking to him? He lives in the basement, but has access to where you live? Does he have his own bathroom, hopefully?
What does your lease say about term, and about rent payment?
Given how casual the landlord was about foisting this total stranger off on you and your family, I would expect him to be equally casual about letting you out of a year lease. If it's month to month, just give 30 days notice.

[976missy]

To prevent him from being homeless, not knowing what we do now know about him. We felt sorry for him being he is a disable Vet. Yes he has access to where my family and I live. Which we are afraid now. He has his own bathroom yes. Landlord said it was up to us on what to do with him or how to handle him.

[joypulv]

Please tell us what the lease says.
What the landlord says isn't totally relevant, if someone on a LEASE decides to take it to court. If you want to call the landlord's bluff, either tell him that you are leaving, or just leave without saying anything, or try to evict the other tenant - which you have no right to do.
So again, if you don't want to answer all questions, we can't help you.

[976missy]

He is NOT a tenant on our lease, he is only listed as an occupant under us. My husband and I are the only two on the lease our boys and this man are listed as occupants. Nothing more said on them on the lease itself.

Our lease states that our home is a non smoking home.

[ScottGem]

If the landlord is leaving you to handle it, you will have to legally evict him.

[joypulv]

I asked what the term of the lease is, but never mind.
Eviction will follow state law and the process will be determined by your local court house. Meanwhile you can send a certified letter to him telling him to vacate, or you can hand one to him with suitable witnesses present. The letter is better. If he says he will kill himself (he might) then call the cops. But still proceed with the eviction paperwork because it will take about 2 months. Since you are caring people, call the town social worker too.

[Fr_Chuck]

I would start a eviction process and leave it up to him, to contest and try to fight it.

I could say a dozen things about the stupidity of allowing a unknown person to live in the house with you and your children.

At this point, inform the landlord you are going to evict thim, and start process.

[AK lawyer]

... We rented it to prevent him from being homeless, ...

Are you saying that you would not have rented the premises from the landlord but for this occupant? Where would you be living otherwise?

Do you have any written agreement with this person? Has he ever been asked to pay you anything which would be, in effect, sub-rental payment? If not (and others on this forum tend to disagree with me in this issue), I don't think he is a "tenant" and therefore you can lock him out immediately.

[976missy]

I checked with the courts here and a lawyer here, We were told WE ARE SCREWED. Yes we wouldn't have moved into the house if we had known that we would have to deal with all these problems with him, there are a lot more going on since my last post including me contacting our landlord and the courts.

July 4th 2014- Brought home highly intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


August 2nd 2014- Brought home again highly intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


August 3rd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


August 4th 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home. Told he is our responsibility now that he is home.


September 2nd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home. He was left on the steps in front of me by the person who brought him home.


September 3rd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


September 4th 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


October 2nd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


October 3rd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


October 4th 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


November 2nd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


November 3rd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


November 4th 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.This time by a male and female couple who left him after he fell flat head first on the floor in front of them.


December 2nd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home.


December 3rd 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home. With a stranger to us who stayed till 6 am. Not allowing us any sleep with all the noise.


December 4th 2014- Brought home highly again intoxicated between the hours of 2am - 3am, with loud disturbance which woke everyone up in our home. With the same man from prior night named Nick who stayed till 8:38 am. Not allowing us any sleep with all the noise. He also stated to this man that this was his home and he can do what he likes and forced the man to stay till 8:38 am. Which kept us up all night.


Was asked on August 1st to please stop smoking indoors as it was coming up the vents to us and making everyone in our home sick. He agreed to no longer smoke indoors. But failed to comply. We continued to ask for the following months for the same respect to not smoke indoors. Again he stated he would not but continues to do so. On December 3rd he brought home a stranger to us in our home and was smoking something other then cigarettes which the smell came up the vent. On December 4th he again brought this stranger to us (Nick) into our home and again was smoking the same item we smelled the prior night. We notified the pd to make sure it wasn't something illegal but they were unable to determine what it was due to the statement the officer gave was the smell down there was too dirty and nasty to determine what else they were smoking. On December 4 we asked Him for his part of the rent, who then stated he was getting it from a friend at 5 pm that day. When 7pm came around I again attempted to collect his part of the rent he then lied to me (as I checked my home phone records to verify if it was a lie) and stated he just called this same friend on my home phone which he had no consent to hook up a phone to use and stated she will be by on December 5 at 3 pm to bring it to him.








On November 11 2014 he was given a notice in writing being asked again to please stop smoking indoors, he agreed again to comply but again has not done so.






--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Notice was given


11/21/2014
You have been asked and agreed upon several times, to no longer smoke indoors. You have to this day continued to smoke inside. If you continue you will be asked to vacate the premises. We are giving you a chance to fix the problem.






Text with Landlord on October 3rd about his smoking indoors.


Me- May I ask you a question pertaining the last paragraph of the lease. It states that the upstairs is a non smoking and any damage from smoke is our responsibility. How can we get him to stop smoking in the house. I have already on several accounts asked him to stop smoking indoors. And yet he continues to do so and the smoke is coming upstairs into our home.


Landlord- That wording in lease is my standard lease language about smoking. I knew he was a smoker when we signed lease. I will not hold you guys accountable for smoke. I understand your situation but you need to work out with him and come to a compromise.




Text with Landlord again on November 29th.


Me- I'm ordering a lock for the sliding door we can not take it any more he has been served and notified.


Landlord- I am OK with whatever you guys work out. He may have certain rights so I am not sure what you can and can not do legally.


So I then checked with the courts and they stated that because we do not own the property we have no legal rights to evict him. The only person they said that can is our Landlord who won't do it. But continues to say its up to us to handle him. But legally our hands are tied. What can we do. We are the tenants and we are paying EVERYTHING in this home. He is paying NOTHING.

[976missy]

Please tell us what the lease says.
What the landlord says isn't totally relevant, if someone on a LEASE decides to take it to court. If you want to call the landlord's bluff, either tell him that you are leaving, or just leave without saying anything, or try to evict the other tenant - which you have no right to do.
So again, if you don't want to answer all questions, we can't help you.

I have no problem any longer with letting anyone who asks information. I posted a full account on what's going on and why we are asking him to leave and what we can do.

[ScottGem]

So I then checked with the courts and they stated that because we do not own the property we have no legal rights to evict him. The only person they said that can is our Landlord who won't do it. But continues to say its up to us to handle him. But legally our hands are tied. What can we do. We are the tenants and we are paying EVERYTHING in this home. He is paying NOTHING.

Who, exactly ,did you check with and what were you told?

If I follow the setup here, he lives in a basement apartment. If your lease is for the entire house, then as the leaseholder, you have control and should be able to evict. If your lease is only for the portion of the house that you occupy, then the owner has to evict. You may have to get the landlord to issue an addendum to the lease giving you control over the basement apartment. That should permit you to handle an eviction.

By the way, while the log you are obviously keeping will be important in court, it is really TMI for here. We have no reason to doubt this guy is a nuisance who is causing your problems in enjoying your home. The information we need is about how your lease is structured.

[AK lawyer]

I checked with the courts here and a lawyer here, We were told WE ARE SCREWED
...

So I then checked with the courts and they stated that because we do not own the property we have no legal rights to evict him.

What do you mean "the courts"? I strongly doubt that a judge (which is the normal meaning of "the courts") told you that. Court clerk office personnel are usually instructed by their employers that they are not to "give legal advice". This case appears to be the reason why.

And what did the lawyer give as a reason for the conclusion that you are screwed? Did the lawyer actually tell you that you, as a sub-lessor, cannot evict a sub-tenant? That would be indeed curious.

... If your lease is only for the portion of the house that you occupy, then the owner has to evict. ...

If that is indeed the case, you should demand that the landlord evict the person. If the LL refuses to do so, tell the LL that he or she has breached the lease, giving you grounds to move out.

[ScottGem]

AK went into more detail than I did, but I agree with what he is saying. I doubt if a judge told you that and I wouldn't trust a court clerk to know the actual law.

But the basic legal premise here is that a leasee has a great deal of control over the property they lease, subject to the terms of the lease. A Tenant can't make structural changes or do damage to the property. Other than that, they are in control. If your lease is for the whole house then the occupant of the basement apartment is YOUR tenant and you have the right to evict them.

So I too am curious as to what the legal basis was for an attorney to tell you were screwed.

[976missy]

I went down to our local magistrate who handles evictions, and things like that. She told me I was screwed. As far as our lease is concerned it states that my husband and myself are tenants and our boys and this man is occupants and we (my husband and myself) are responsible for any damage done by any of our occupants. It also states in the last paragraph that our home is a non smoking home.

[976missy]

As far as grounds for moving out, the lawyer told us we do have grounds for that, to vacate our lease if the LL refuses to remove him. Which makes our lease voided out. Since he is causing all these problems for us to enjoy a peaceful home and the LL refusing to remove him.

[ScottGem]

But what does it say about a description of the property you are leasing? That is the key point. And WHY did the magistrate tell you that? What was his basis in law? Like I've already said, if you are leasing the entire property, then any occupants are YOUR tenants and you have the right to evict them.

[976missy]

Yes we are renting the entire house. We are responsible for maintaining the entire yard and house. She told me that because we do not own the house we have no legal right to evict him only the owner does.

[ScottGem]

Well, I disagree, As a leaseholder, the law allows you evict YOUR tenant. And I think this guy is YOUR tenant. maybe you didn't explain the situation to her properly. But here's the rub. Since she will be hearing the eviction case, if she does not want to allow it then she can, forcing you to appeal to a higher court.

So I would consult an attorney and find out what law or precedent does not allow you to evict YOUR tenant. Then you can research whether that law or precedent applies and show her that she is wrong as to the law.

[976missy]

Thank you all for your help, I know some where I had rights too. As far as where we were living prior to here. We were living in a 3 bedroom townhouse.