[harum]

Hello, the gfci outlet of the kitchen circuit keeps tripping, 20-60 sec after every reset. It seems to be tripping by itself because the fridge, garbage disposal and dishwasher are currently unplugged. What is left on this circuit is kitchen lights. Replacing the old gfci outlet with a new one doesn't cure the problem -- it trips too.

Does this mean the circuit is shorting somewhere? Would appreciate any comment and ideas where else to look for damage.
Thanks, h.

[hkstroud]

Does this mean the circuit is shorting somewhere?

Yes.

Normally garbage disposal, refrigerator, dishwasher and lights would not be on GFI outlet. Does GFI trip with lights off?

Most of the time GFIs trip becasuse of a defective appliance. Look for something else that might be plugged into this circuit. Some times GFI circuits also serve baths. Look there. When did this begin.

Who wired this GFI? GFIs can be wired to protect themselve only, or they can be wired to protect themselves and every thing down stream.

[harum]

Thank you, Harold! Yes, whoever wired the kitchen line wasn't professional. As far as I understand, fridge, dishwasher and garbage disposal should at least be upstream of GFCI outlets, if they happened to be on the same circuit.

The circuit (at the in-laws' house) has been working normally for years until about two weeks ago when the GFCI outlet tripped. I reset it then and it had stayed on for two weeks until tonight when it tripped again. Only this time it stayed on only for a minute or so.

I replaced one GFCI outlet with a new one, then found that the frigde outlet, the one downstream of the replaced GFCI, is also a GFCI. Replaced it with a used GFCI. This new combination kept tripping too for half an hour or so with no appliances connected and then stopped tripping. I connected all the appliances and they stayed on for a while before I left. Will see what happens tomorrow.

The lights are not affected by tripping, but turned off with the same breaker in the main as the affected outlets. I will replace the second, downstream GFCI with a regular outlet when I have a chance.

Was wondering if a tripped GFCI outlet can trip the GFCI outlet just upstream it? By "downstream" of GFCI outlet I mean whatever is connected through connected through the "load" screws of GFCI.

I suspect the fridge, moisture or loose/damaged wires somewhere behind the drywalls.

[donf]

You really do not want a fridge on a GFCI protected circuit. It is permissible, but the risk is that if the GFCI trips, the power to the refrigerator is cut and the food spoils.

By code, there are a minimum of two, 20 amp GFCI protected branch circuits required to serve the countertop receptacles. The refrigerator can be served by either of these circuits. Also, you can supply power to a wall mounted clock receptacle (although you rarely see wall mounted clocks anymore). Lighting and general use (such as wall receptacles outlets) are not permitted on either of these two branch circuits.

However, because the refrigerator can be an amperage hog when it cycles on it is also permissible to place the refrigerator on its own dedicated circuit.

Undercounter devices, such as dishwashers, trash compactors or disposals are prohibited for being on either of the two countertop 20 branch circuits.

My suggestion would be to request bids from several "Licensed" electricians to have the kitchen rewired. You already know that there are several code violations with the kitchen wiring as it exists now, but you also are having a failure.

GFCI receptacles are used to protect people from electrocution. They work by sensing an imbalance in the amperage.

[hkstroud]

A little confused by your post but I think you are saying that the lights, refrigerator and disposal are upstream of the counter GFI. That would mean the counter GFI is down stream of the refrigerator GFI.

If that is correct, remove the refrigerator GFI. Not required and not a good idea to have a refrigerator on a GFI. Also not a good idea to have two GFIs, one down stream of the other, on a circuit.

Suspect that is your problem.

[harum]

Yes, there is no need for fridge GFCI, but this layout has been working for years and years... The lights are somewhere upstream of the counter GFCI, and not affected by tripping.

Thanks, Don.

[donf]

Regardless of how long the layout has been working, the layout is incorrect. The electrical code is primarily about safety.

For instance, in your case, because all of these electrical outlets are on the same circuit, if the CFCI trips, your lights go out. Suppose you are trying to find a place to put a roast that is very hot down, and now your lights go out. I know that the floor will hold everything, just look at my office, but the danger is there.

Please make an effort to have the kitchen re-wired for your own safety if for no other reason.

[harum]

Thanks, Don. The lights are not affected by tripping. The house isn't mine, just helping there.