[dwashbur]

I'm looking for somebody who knows something about this topic that I can bounce a few questions off. That's Washington state, not the other place. Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?

Thanks!

[ScottGem]

What is your question? Several members are knowledgeable about real estate law.

[joypulv]

My sister is a very experienced landlord in WA state; I can ask her, aside from any of us being able to look up the laws.

[dwashbur]

Okay, here's the situation. We rented a house through a management company. The guy who owns it got shipped out to Hawaii or something for a temporary assignment (he's some kind of government bean counter) so he rented the house out while he was gone. We signed a year lease, moved in and settled down.

Well, he got shipped back early, about three months early to be precise, and the next thing I knew, our rental agent was calling me, asking if we would be willing to move out early so he could have his house back. Simply because they asked nicely, we agreed. We weren't ready for a move, we really couldn't afford it. But we did it. After we got all our junk out and had the carpets cleaned, we did a walk-thru with the agent. I have the entire thing on video. She indicated that a couple of spots on the carpet might need to be redone.

Let me back up. When we were talking about the carpet, she said they usually use a company that I don't care for. We asked if we could have our own company do it. She said, as long as the carpets were professionally cleaned and we got them a receipt to that effect, we could do it however we wanted. We got a good deal through a Groupon and had the carpets done per her instructions.

We did have a dog in the place, but he never once did anything inside. We also know, both from the rental company and the neighbors, that the owner had an even bigger dog in the place before we moved in. So we didn't think anything about that. During the walk-through, she agreed that the carpet cleaners did a good job, but made a passing reference to a pet treatment.

Now, nothing in any of our lease paperwork or anything else ever mentions pet treatment. Everything, including her verbal instructions, just said "professional cleaning with receipt." We did that. That's issue #1.

Issue #2: The house has a road easement on one side of it, where tall grass likes to grow. The company tried to get after me several times about mowing this part, but I spoke with representatives of the county, and they told me that part is their responsibility. I passed this along to the management. Three times. They still want to charge me a couple hundred dollars (out of my deposit, of course) to have some professionals cut that down.

Issue #3: When we did the walk-through, she pronounced the garage just fine and said there would be no issues there. Well, the owner came along several days after that and noticed a few spots of paint on the floor. The next thing I know, our agent is calling me up, having a fit about that and informing me that we will have to pay to have those spots removed. Again, this is AFTER she pronounced it just fine.

Issue #4: When we moved in, the place had some hideous drapes over the windows in the living and dining areas. The agent told us that the owner didn't want them but didn't have time to dispose of them, and since nobody in the office liked them, we could just get rid of them. The problem: she didn't write that down on her checklist. We didn't dispose of the drapes, but one did get slightly torn on one corner. She wants to charge us an exorbitant amount to repair drapes that SHE said we should throw away. Conveniently, she can't remember saying that.

I'm trying to challenge all of these, but I'm not making much progress, and I suspect we may end up in court. Do I have any kind of case with any of these issues, under Washington law?

Also, when we moved into this new place - administered by the same company - we were told to pay our prorated rent on the 16th. I checked things and realized that I wouldn't have enough in my account to cover it until 3 days later. She told me that I could get the check in to them on time and request that it be held, and if I got it there on the 16th that would enable me to avoid their $100 late fee. The only catch was, they probably wouldn't be willing to hold it. I took the chance. I wrote the check for the 16th, took it in on the 16th, and got a receipt dated the 16th for the full amount. Two days later I got a bill for the late fee. The receptionist had put a note on the check, and I wrote in the memo line, asking that it not be deposited until the 19th. The bookkeeper decided that that constituted post-dating the check and charged me the fee. I'm refusing to pay it, and have sent this agent copies of all the relevant paperwork. She has told me three different times that she would talk with the office manager to see if the fee could be reversed. Trouble is, she's not doing it. And at the moment she's really not talking to me because she's angry about all that deposit business above.

What can I do about all this?

Thanks!

[JudyKayTee]

"Also, when we moved into this new place - administered by the same company - we were told to pay our prorated rent on the 16th. I checked things and realized that I wouldn't have enough in my account to cover it until 3 days later. She told me that I could get the check in to them on time and request that it be held, and if I got it there on the 16th that would enable me to avoid their $100 late fee. The only catch was, they probably wouldn't be willing to hold it. I took the chance. I wrote the check for the 16th, took it in on the 16th, and got a receipt dated the 16th for the full amount. Two days later I got a bill for the late fee. The receptionist had put a note on the check, and I wrote in the memo line, asking that it not be deposited until the 19th. The bookkeeper decided that that constituted post-dating the check and charged me the fee. I'm refusing to pay it, and have sent this agent copies of all the relevant paperwork. She has told me three different times that she would talk with the office manager to see if the fee could be reversed. Trouble is, she's not doing it. And at the moment she's really not talking to me because she's angry about all that deposit business above."


Here's a partial answer because I'm working the road BUT concerning the rent - a check takes the place of cash. The rent is due on a certain date, cash OR negotiable check. Your check was not "good" on the date your rent was due. Therefore, your rent is/was late. I've had tenants do the same thing but for a week - sorry. The rent is late.

Wish I had better news.

[ScottGem]

None of this is codified. So its all going to be up to a judge's decision on what is fair. And no one can predict what a judge will do.

My guess here is that you are fine on the carpets. You went and got a professional cleaning and have the receipt.

You should get a statement from the county on the mowing, but you should be fine on that as well.

The paint may be an issue, she could have just missed it in the walk through. Without proof that she noticed it and pronounced it fine, it could be a problem.

The drapes may also be a problem. Without proof that you were told they could be replaced, you did damage them. You should get your own estimate for repair.

On the late charge, I agree with Judy, if you specifically asked that the check not be deposited until later, then it was late.

[JudyKayTee]

And I agree with Scott - do you have photos of moving in and moving out?

In general, this falls into the category of "no good deed goes unpunished."

[joypulv]

I'd bypass the mgmt co and write directly to the owner (or call, etc) mentioning that you moved out 3 months early without any demands. I wonder if he even knows about this?

[dwashbur]

I have photos of moving in, and video of the move-out. I just sent the company a link to the county's page, and I'll probably have to sue them for the carpet stuff because they intend to just do it and take it out of my deposit.

I get what you mean about the late fee. Guess I'll suck it up and pay it.

As for contacting the owner, he's the instigator behind most of this. The agent and I had things sorted out, then he came along and started saying to himself "I can get some free work out of these guys!" Basically, he's a douchebag.

"No good deed goes unpunished." Yep, I've already used that one.

[dwashbur]

I won't know the outcome for a while; they're fiddling around having all this work done etc. and nobody knows how long it'll take. I just hope it's causing that guy some inconvenience in the process. As soon as I know something for sure I'll post.

[ScottGem]

If either the landlord or tenant wants to break a lease early, it is common to charge a 2 month fee. You should not have agreed to move early without negotiating some compensation.

[dwashbur]

If either the landlord or tenant wants to break a lease early, it is common to charge a 2 month fee. You should not have agreed to move early without negotiating some compensation.

I had no idea. But you can be sure I won't forget from now on.

So I paid the late fee, and engaged in a little brown-nosing when I told the agent she was right, I was wrong, and apologized. It seems to have gone a long way, because she was all smiles and greetings when I went in today. We're still waiting for the final shoe to drop on the deposit thing, but for now I'm putting that on the back burner. I'll go ballistic after I see the final numbers.

[AK lawyer]

If either the landlord or tenant wants to break a lease early, it is common to charge a 2 month fee. You should not have agreed to move early without negotiating some compensation.

Or, to put it another way, OP should have refused early termination unless the landlord agreed to waive cleaning fees, etc.

Did the lease allow the dog?

[dwashbur]

The lease did allow the dog, yes. We paid an extra deposit for him.

[AK lawyer]

Of course you should have got everything the agent told you, in writing. Absent that, it's your word against hers.

Professional cleaning: It looks like you have a good case that you complied with the requirement. Does the lease say anything about a "pet treatment"?

Paint in garage: You can argue that the agent should have caught it in the walk-through. Did you do it? Does it show on the video?

Cutting of grass: If, as you say, and particularly if it's not spelled out in the lease, that is not the occupant's responsibility, end of story.

Drapes: It's her word against yours regarding whether she told you they could be thrown away.

Late fee: Your rent was "received" when it cleared, not when you delivered the post-dated check.

Was there a deposit? In your state the landlord must give you an itemized statement within 14 days after you leave.

"RCW 59.18.280

Moneys paid as deposit or security for performance by tenant — Statement and notice of basis for retention — Remedies for landlord's failure to make refund.

Within fourteen days after the termination of the rental agreement and vacation of the premises or, if the tenant abandons the premises as defined in RCW 59.18.310, within fourteen days after the landlord learns of the abandonment, the landlord shall give a full and specific statement of the basis for retaining any of the deposit together with the payment of any refund due the tenant under the terms and conditions of the rental agreement. No portion of any deposit shall be withheld on account of wear resulting from ordinary use of the premises. The landlord complies with this section if the required statement or payment, or both, are deposited in the United States mail properly addressed with first-class postage prepaid within the fourteen days.

The notice shall be delivered to the tenant personally or by mail to his or her last known address. If the landlord fails to give such statement together with any refund due the tenant within the time limits specified above he or she shall be liable to the tenant for the full amount of the deposit. The landlord is also barred in any action brought by the tenant to recover the deposit from asserting any claim or raising any defense for retaining any of the deposit unless the landlord shows that circumstances beyond the landlord's control prevented the landlord from providing the statement within the fourteen days or that the tenant abandoned the premises as defined in RCW 59.18.310. The court may in its discretion award up to two times the amount of the deposit for the intentional refusal of the landlord to give the statement or refund due. In any action brought by the tenant to recover the deposit, the prevailing party shall additionally be entitled to the cost of suit or arbitration including a reasonable attorney's fee.

Nothing in this chapter shall preclude the landlord from proceeding against, and the landlord shall have the right to proceed against a tenant to recover sums exceeding the amount of the tenant's damage or security deposit for damage to the property for which the tenant is responsible together with reasonable attorney's fees."