[NeedKarma]

Most people that get abortions aren't religious.

That would be a false claim.

[tomder55]

If you want to get all religious over this, it is clear; Satan, as always, has found a way to slaughter the innocents and it is easy because the logic is simple. Just get someone to think the solution is all about me, that god that has replaced God. This is the Me generation, they worship themselves and have that three headed god, Me, Myself and I

yes ,that was the key theme of the Richard Fernandez blog post.

[speechlesstx]

The weird thing is that it's the religious who get abortions too.

That's not the weird thing.

[Tuttyd]

Of course, it's easy to make a rational explanation for murdering babies...

In exactly the same way as it is easy to make a convenient supernatural explanation.

[speechlesstx]

That would be a false claim.

Even if you could show that it's irrelevant.

[tomder55]

In exactly the same way as it is easy to make a convenient supernatural explanation.

Yup ; I've heard the "rational " explanations.. eugenics etc. the 20th century is stained with the blood of millions as a result and we are well on our way to surpassing that . I think the supernatural explanations make much more sense. Evil exists and is prevailing .

[NeedKarma]

Even if you could show that it's irrelevant.

It is but you've conveniently have the blinders on again.

[Tuttyd]

yup ; I've heard the "rational " explanations ..eugenics etc. the 20th century is stained with the blood of millions as a result and we are well on our way to surpassing that . I think the supernatural explanations make much more sense. Evil exists and is prevailing .

I'm glad you used "rational" in inverted commas. This includes may possibilities. Science not being the least of them. Rather convenient when you can claim that your reject humanism, but embrace the rational at the same time. Sounds like perfect ideologue to me.

Tut

[paraclete]

Of course, it's easy to make a rational explanation for murdering babies...

Yes so let's stop doing it and tell women to be responsible

[speechlesstx]

It is but you've conveniently have the blinders on again.

Dude, it's not me wearing blinders, it's your narrow mindedness toward people of faith and avoidance of what's relevant in this discussion. Do you have a comment on the OP or are you just here to hate on the religious?

[speechlesstx]

I'm glad you used "rational" in inverted commas. This includes may possibilities. Science not being the least of them. Rather convenient when you can claim that your reject humanism, but embrace the rational at the same time. Sounds like perfect ideologue to me.

Tut

The ideologues are the abortion absolutists that want to sweep Gosnell and the horrors of abortion under the rug.

[Tuttyd]

The ideologues are the abortion absolutists that want to sweep Gosnell and the horrors of abortion under the rug.

Yes, I would say this correct. My fear is that both sides are susceptible to this problem. However, you strike me as someone who a least considers the practical implications of a problem.

[speechlesstx]

Well thank you.

[talaniman]

I want all the facts, but I stop short at the notion this monster is typical of the free choice crowd. He is a fringe extreme at best, and a criminal at worst. Who aided and abetted his butchery is my concern.

The hell with the politics.

[speechlesstx]

I don't think any reasonable person is arguing that Gosnell's butchery is typical and I've already noted several times that the PA health dept's blindness was "by design" according to the grand jury. The regulators turning away is aiding and abetting in my book.

I'm glad you're outraged by it as well, but I'm waiting on abortion apologists to answer the deeper questions this case.raises as well.

[tomder55]

You hope he's an outlier. Evidently so is Dr. Leroy Carhart.
Doctor Death: 29-Year-Old Patient Dies After Late-Term Abortion in Maryland UPDATE: Complete Media Blackout by Feminists, Major News Organizations : The Other McCain

In recognition of his commitment to women's reproductive health, Physicians for Reproductive Choice and Health honored Dr. Carhart with the 2009 William K. Rashbaum, MD, Abortion Provider Award.

Physicians for Reproductive Health | LeRoy Carhart, MD
He has been awarded many times by groups like NARAL and NOW for advancing women's health . Yeah ,dying on the abortion table ,that's the ticket for advancing women's health !

[talaniman]

I will be honest Speech, its hard to wrap my head around a female that could afford his services never exercised her rights a whole lot sooner, and a whole lot safer. I just don't get any female not knowing a month or so from conception that a decision has to be made and doctors already sought out.

I feel his clients were desperate, and very ill informed, making them easy targets of exploitation. He was a predator in every sense of the word, and no doubt there are many like him, on many levels. I just think any choice you make in life has consequences, or blessings.

[speechlesstx]

I tend to agree most abortion patients are ill informed, this thread is to inform.

Kareema Cross worked for Kermit Gosnell for a harrowing four years helping with abortion procedures amid conditions so bad that she snapped photos to document them in 2008 — a year before the death of Karnamaya Mongar — then reported her boss to the authorities under a fictitious name.

But no one listened.

Two years later, authorities raided Gosnell’s clinic thinking it was a pill mill only to discover that it was frightfully so much more.

Yet another failure of those charged with protecting these women and children.

Read on if you dare...

While she worked for Gosnell, Cross testified that at least twice a day, six days a week, at least two babies would “precipitate” or be birthed before Gosnell ever arrived. She said “Dr. Steve,” Steven Massof, an unlicensed medical school graduate with a ghoulish curiosity about abortions, would be there to snip the babies’ necks. She saw him do it around 50 times. When babies “precipitated” in Gosnell’s presence, he would do the dirty deed himself.

Cross sometimes worked from 8:00 am until 3:00 the next morning helping with procedures. She routinely saw babies born alive, moving, breathing, and moaning.

Once in Gosnell’s absence, Cross saw a large baby delivered into the toilet. She saw his little arms and legs moving in a swimming motion as he struggled to get out of the toilet bowl. Cross held her hands 12-16 inches apart to demonstrate to the jury how big the baby was. Adrienne Moton, who was the first worker to testify for the prosecution, snipped the baby’s neck in front of the mother while she sat bleeding into the toilet. Moton then took the body away and put it into a container.

In 2009, Cross testified that another co-worker, Linda Williams, called Cross over to see a baby that had just been born. Cross saw the baby’s chest heaving up and down in steady breathing motions. Linda reached down and lifted the baby’s hand up, but the newborn pulled it away on its own strength. Cross said she saw the baby breathing for about 20 minutes before Williams murdered the child by severing its spinal cord with scissors. Cross demonstrated again with her hands that the baby was about a foot long.

It's time to end the lies...

[speechlesstx]

Gloria Steinem has spoken...

NOTED FEMINIST Gloria Steinem took the podium at the National Constitution Center on Tuesday night, addressing a crowd of 500 spanning four generations at Planned Parenthood Southeastern Pennsylvania's annual Spring Gathering.

Steinem's talk came at a time when illegal-abortion doc Kermit Gosnell's trial is highlighting the uglier side of the abortion issue in Philadelphia, and as state legislators are considering measures to limit abortion access under future government-funded health-insurance plans.

Organizers said the event - and Steinem herself - would move the public's focus to the organization's work.

"The Gosnell trial has shifted the focus off the high-quality services we provide," said Dayle Steinberg, the organization's president and chief executive. "These are criminal, horrendous . . . acts and should be appropriately punished."

Steinberg said that when Gosnell was in practice, women would sometimes come to Planned Parenthood for services after first visiting Gosnell's West Philadelphia clinic, and would complain to staff about the conditions there.

"We would always encourage them to report it to the Department of Health," Steinberg said as she sat with Steinem before Tuesday's events.

Of the Gosnell trial, Steinem added: "It makes more clear why you need Planned Parenthood."

Excuse me? Gosnell's victims would complain to PP and PP never reported it? That says a lot but it certainly does not make clear why PP is so crucial. If anything it makes PP complicit in decades of abuse. Read on...

Her speech, Steinem said beforehand, would aim to "remind us that reproductive freedom is a fundamental human right."

Steinem called the legislation being considered in Pennsylvania's Legislature "self-defeating." The bills would limit abortion covered by federally subsidized insurance to cases of rape, incest or those that are life-threatening.

"It's putting women's health at risk," she said. "It's like saying, 'You have freedom of speech, but only if you say one thing.' "

Steinem's address was punctuated at several points by bursts of applause and nods of agreement from the audience.

She praised politicians and men in attendance who support women's reproductive rights, but likened the battle to the fight for the right to vote and said she believes it's only about half-finished.

She called reproductive freedom the "key to equalizing males and females," and praised Planned Parenthood and its supporters.

"There's nothing on earth more important than what Planned Parenthood is doing," she said. "It is connected to everything else."

I'm sorry, I'm all for equal pay and all that but does she really believe her own bullsh*t? Do you believe her bullsh*t?

"There's nothing on earth more important" than killing off millions of children? I know a few women who've had abortions that would disagree and tell you it's the most traumatic, gut wrenching thing they'd ever done and there's nothing they regret more.

Time to end this folly and stop believing and promoting this bullsh*t about protecting women's health, everyone that should have been doing just that not only FAILED miserably for over 3 decades, but they covered it up to boot. No excuses.

[talaniman]

So throw away the cancer screenings, referrals, and check ups with the abortions. Nice strategy. I am sure females will appreciate you for it.

Depression is as common in woman who give birth as those who have had an abortion. And yes PP offers counseling for both scenarios.