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excon · Mar 18, 2013, 05:15 AM

Hello:

ALL of us can feel the rumblings of this coming war. This one is shaping up to be like the war on cigarettes. Or, at least I hope so. We WON that war.

This one is going to be tougher. The direct link between tobacco use and death is clear. It's NOT so clear that empty calories contribute, or are DIRECTLY responsible, for our epidemic of obesity..

Yes, it's VERY nanny state to prevent people from buying HUGE, LARGE cups of sugary empty calories, but we ALL pay the cost when obese people get sick, so why ISN'T it our business?

Here's the problem. Healthy foods are MUCH more expensive than empty calorie food. Secondly there are what's called "food deserts" in the poor neighborhoods... That means, even IF a poor family wanted to feed their kids healthy foods, there are NO STORES in their neighborhoods to shop at. Whole Foods does NOT have stores in the hood, and even if they did, nobody would shop there because it's TOO expensive.

So, the problem is NOT about lousy poor people who don't love their kids, but it's a STRUCTURAL problem that is easily fixed.

Finally, if fruits and vegetables were subsidized like sugar, corn, soybeans and wheat, they WOULDN'T be so much more expensive... That's another easy fix.

What are we waiting for?

excon

smoothy · Mar 18, 2013, 05:27 AM

Time to take off the Tin foil hat.

excon · Mar 18, 2013, 05:33 AM

Hello smoothy:

I should have said SOME of us can feel the rumblings. It's true, smootho, I AM a few years ahead of you..

excon

smoothy · Mar 18, 2013, 05:38 AM

These same people that "don't have money for good food" somehow seem to have money for expensive shoes and jackets they create a sport in killing each other to steal from one another... and it happens every day.

Whatever happened to personal responsibility? THEY buy the food.. THEY cook the food... THEY have control over what they buy and cook...

Frozen vegis beat cheese puffs and gummi bears... and they are cheaper... but like crap for brains Bloomberg learned... its not his job to play food cop.

speechlesstx · Mar 18, 2013, 05:42 AM

All of that sounds nice but what you're really trying to do is regulate behavior. You don't want anyone telling you not to smoke a doobie, but you're fine with saying I can't have a Big Gulp.

excon · Mar 18, 2013, 05:47 AM

Hello again, smoothy:

Let's, for a minute, pretend you're right.. Since WE pay for their medical costs, would it be cheaper for us to intervene IN FRONT, or just continue paying the bills?

excon

smoothy · Mar 18, 2013, 06:06 AM

Originally Posted by excon

Hello again, smoothy:

Let's, for a minute, pretend you're right.. Since WE pay for their medical costs, would it be cheaper for us to intervene IN FRONT, or just continue paying the bills?

excon

They shouldn't get a welafre check... or anything else until they have been sterilized... so they don't continue to breed. If they can't properly feed themselves... they shouldn't be having any more kids.

We do it to pets because it's the humane way to control strays... time to apply it the non-productive part of the population.

excon · Mar 18, 2013, 06:19 AM

Hello Steve:

but you're fine with saying I can't have a Big Gulp.

I'm for choice. If we LEVELED the playing field, the free market MIGHT have a chance to work.

You SAY I want to stop you from drinking a Big Gulp, but since we SUBSIDIZE corn, the main sweetener in your Big Gulp, it looks like the government is ENCOURAGING you to drink one. I'd be happy with the government being OUT of the equation, ENTIRELY.

I'm just looking for the free market to work... What's wrong that?

excon

tomder55 · Mar 18, 2013, 06:25 AM

For what it's worth ;I oppose subsidizing... period . But what do you have against soy beans ? Soy is healthy . Judge Tingling called nanny-bloomy's dictates arbitrary and capricious . You do realize of course that straight up fruit juice is also loaded with sugary calories ? It just isn't cain sugar or corn sugar. So what you are really for is for the government to enforce portion control in everyone's diet.

I will also like to mention that Bloomy's conclusions weren't scientificly based . For the last 10 year period ,purchase and consumption of sugary soft drinks declined 12.5% while obesity rates went up. People more often have been consuming water and sugar substitutes (much worse than sugar in my humble opinion) . What they didn't do was stop eating carbs and other high calorie foods. Sugar beverages like sodas, juice drinks, sports drinks, and teas account for only 7% of calories in the average American diet. 93% of calories come from other foods and beverages.
During a more sober moment ,Nanny Bloomy once told David Letterman "I think that it is incumbent on government to tell people what they're doing to themselves and let people make their own decisions" . He was right then.He was wrong to try to impose it on his city .

speechlesstx · Mar 18, 2013, 06:27 AM

Originally Posted by excon

Hello Steve:

I'm for choice. If we LEVELED the playing field, the free market MIGHT have a chance to work.

You SAY I want to stop you from drinking a Big Gulp, but since we SUBSIDIZE corn, the main sweetener in your Big Gulp, it looks like the government is ENCOURAGING you to drink one. I'd be happy with the government being OUT of the equation, ENTIRELY.

I'm just looking for the free market to work... What's wrong that?

excon

Since you're a businessman you open a store in a food desert. Set the example.

tomder55 · Mar 18, 2013, 06:36 AM

Or go to San Fran and open a Micky D's... for an extra 10 cent charge ,parents can buy a toy with the happy meal!

joypulv · Mar 18, 2013, 06:36 AM

1. I continue to gain weight without consuming a single sugary soft drink or patronizing fast food places or any eateries. I just eat too much in my sedentary 60s, a lot of it ice cream - want to limit checkout to one half gallon? What if I went shopping again the next day?

2. It's a fallacy to say that it costs extra to eat a healthy diet. I agree about the grocers in poor neighborhoods, but I don't shop at Whole Foods, just a regular Stop and Shop, and it's full of healthy food. I can challenge anyone to a month of my healthy picks vs theirs and still be cheaper. My meals won't include prime rib and asparagus, but I will leave out the hot dogs and air bread.

3. There's only so much regulation of healthy habits for the good of the taxpayer. Definitely stop those damn corn subsidies and let the consumer buy all the crap he wants. Handle nutrition in the school cafeterias - those are paid for by us.

excon · Mar 18, 2013, 06:45 AM

Hello again, Steve:

Since you're a businessman you open a store in a food desert. Set the example.

I don't know what you missed or don't understand about the government subsidizing empty calorie food.

Ok, here's what it means... From a business standpoint, trying to sell NON subsidized foods in competition with GOVERNMENT subsidized foods is a loser. That's WHY nobody is doing that. IF the playing field were LEVELED, then I MIGHT just do that.

Excon

smoothy · Mar 18, 2013, 06:48 AM

If its subsidized... why do Cheetos and Doritos cost so damn much?

speechlesstx · Mar 18, 2013, 07:09 AM

Originally Posted by excon

Hello again, Steve:

I dunno what you missed or don't understand about the government subsidizing empty calorie food.

Ok, here's what it means... From a business standpoint, trying to sell NON subsidized foods in competition with GOVERNMENT subsidized foods is a loser. That's WHY nobody is doing that. IF the playing field were LEVELED, then I MIGHT just do that.

excon

Is that why milk is $6.00 a gallon, the government is leveling the playing field?

excon · Mar 18, 2013, 07:16 AM

Hello again, Steve:

Is that why milk is $6.00 a gallon, the government is leveling the playing field?

If and when the government STOPS subsidizing dairy products, your gallon of milk will cost $12.00.

For a right winger, you really don't understand how markets work. Uhhh, by subsidizing milk, the government ISN'T leveling the playing field.. It's TILTING the market in favor of dairy farmers.

Excon

tomder55 · Mar 18, 2013, 07:22 AM

I think we need to make a distinction between "subsidized " and "price supports" . Price supports if I understand them makes the foods from the commodity more expensive for the consumer . That is why milk would cost so much.

But then Speech makes an interesting point . As I understand it ,cane and corn are price support commodities . That means consumers are paying more than what they would if the free market price prevailed . Corn as an example has had it's price rise considerably since the government discovered they could corrode the internal combustion engine with a corn derivitave . I guess the justification is that without the price support then farmers couldn't make a profit and we'd have to import sugar instead of growing it domestically.. To that I say "so what ? "

smoothy · Mar 18, 2013, 07:22 AM

I pay just over $3.00 a gallon for milk where I buy it..

tomder55 · Mar 18, 2013, 07:28 AM

Originally Posted by excon

Hello again, Steve:

If and when the government STOPS subsidizing dairy products, your gallon of milk will cost $12.00.

For a right winger, you really don't understand how markets work. Uhhh, by subsidizing milk, the government ISN'T leveling the playing field.. It's TILTING the market in favor of dairy farmers.

excon

The problem with the dairy cliff was that price supports would go to 1949 levels and that is why the price was going to go up . The price of milk is in fact artificially high .
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...pinion_LEADTop

excon · Mar 18, 2013, 07:38 AM

Hello again,

Call 'em price supports, or subsidies.. It doesn't matter. The bottom line is, the GOVERNMENT is manipulating the market, and the FOOD industry is the beneficiary. I simply suggest that if they DIDN'T do that, healthy food MIGHT be made more available. In fact, I PROMISE you that it will. That IS how markets work, after all.

excon