[PaintsRule]

We have been having trouble for over a year with our water. We bought a brand new pump 3/4 horsepower. We have an above ground spring fed well about 450 feet away. We bought all new 1 inch pipe. The lift from well level to house level is less than 15 feet. The water runs up to the house, but does dip down about 3 feet and then up about 5 feet at the house, we dug out a trench and most of the line is on top of the ground, but goes down into the trench to come in the house. It will pump forever and give water, but not shut off. When it gets to where it should shut off, it bounces around and sucks back about 10 lbs and goes back up to where it shuts off and bounces back 10 lbs and runs again. When you unplug it it goes back to 0... but pumps up right away when plugged in. I have always told my husband that it needs to be wired differently... it is wired to heavy wire, but then that wire is plugged into about a 25 foot extension cord. It is then plugged into a receptacle... I have always said maybe all our problems are electrical, but husband does not agree.

[jlisenbe]

Do you have a pressure tank on this system? I'm guessing there is not, since the pressure should not be at zero even when the pump is unplugged. If you don't have a pressure tank, then that is probably your problem.

Is this a 120 volt pump or 240 volt?

Sorry, but I don't think the electrical is your problem, even though the extension cord deal is not the ideal arrangement.

[PaintsRule]

It has a pressure tank 6.6 gallon US one. It is going just down to 10 lbs pressure now when unplugged. It is a convertible 120 to 240 tank set at 120 right now. It will go up to shut off when running, then hit the shut off, shut off for a millisecond then bouce back to 40 lbs... it is set for 40-60 I think... not sure... will run down and check

[jlisenbe]

I'd do two things.

1. I'd put a larger tank on the system (optional).
2. I'd put a checkvalve between the house and the pressure tank, located just a foot or two from the tank. That will prevent the water trying to run back from the house to the tank. With such a small tank, it wouldn't take much to boost the pressure up.

Should mention one more thing. The tank should have a little air valve up at the top, like a tire air valve. Depress the valve stem a few seconds. You should get air only. Any water means the tank is bad.

If the tank is good, then reset the pressure in the tank. You do this by opening a faucet to drain pressure down to zero (with the pump unplugged). Now set the pressure at the top of the tank to two pounds BELOW the point at which the pump cuts on. So in your case, if that is 40 pounds, then set your tank pressure to 38 pounds.

The fact that the pump can shutoff at sixty pounds, then drop so quickly down to ten pounds, makes me want to check out the tank.

[PaintsRule]

The pump and pressure tank are in the house, so you would put a check valve on the outlet? The pump is sitting on top of the pressure tank... would you mean a check valve on the pipe coming into the house from the spring, or the pipe going out of the pump to run water into my house... wouldn't water running back into the tank INCREASE the pressure? I thought it was going back into the pipe coming in from the spring, that is what it sounds like.

[jlisenbe]

Nope. Misunderstood. Put the CV on the pipe coming into the house from the well. I thought the pump was outside the house with a fairly long run to the house.

Do you have a footvalve at the spring?

[PaintsRule]

Yes there is a foot valve in the spring, we originally pumped the foot valve to fill the pipe, but had to fill from the top too. There is no air showing now, as I can start unscrew the little priming plug and no air comes out... The footvalve was working all winter in a barrel in the house with a short pipe and the pump that died. Does voltage matter? It is set to the lower voltage now... So its drawing it that distance. It would pump forever with water running, does not loose any pressure, when we unplug it, it goes down to 10. Then plug it back in it goes right up to the shut off point, but bounces there, so will not actually shut off, at 50

Just saw your message about the tank. I don't know at where it turns on, because it looses down to 10 when unplugged and runs as soon as its turned on... it will jump down from 50 to 40 when it touches 50 and shuts of for just a millisecond... then falls back to 40 and bounces down up to 50... so we unplug it and it goes to 10.

[jlisenbe]

Well, the CV is a cheap idea to try. If the pressure gauge is "bouncing", then water has to be going somewhere. 400 feet of pipe to the spring would be a lot. I'd try it.

Running the pump at 120 seems to be working for you so I wouldn't change it.

With such a small tank, and you have a REALLY small one, I would think that these problems would be really amplified as opposed to having a thirty or forty gallon tank.

[PaintsRule]

Our previous was a 20 gallon we had on for years. We bought this pump brand new in box, that had been setting for 2 years, is it very hard to change pressure tanks? We could try our old tank... might be what we need.

[jlisenbe]

Try the CV first. Much easier. As far as the tank goes, you could change it. Not real hard UNLESS the pump and tank are made as one unit.

[PaintsRule]

They probably are, we bought it that way, UGGG!! LOL. I will get a check valve, I am sure there is one SOMEWHERE that I bought and never installed but cannot find it. Hubby does not want to frig with cutting into the line, but we have room to play and can just add it to the end of the pipe, then get another piece of pipe to put on to join to the pump.

[PaintsRule]

I checked the pump is bolted onto the pressure tank and it should be able to be removed. We have the larger tank here.

[jlisenbe]

Assuming there is a pipe going from the pump to the pressure tank, you could probably just replumb it to your other tank. In fact, you can try simply adding the second tank into the line between the small tank and the house. That has been know to cause some problems with water wanting to "bounce" between the two tanks, but it might be worth a try. You could certainly put a CV between the two tanks if need be.

But I'd sure put a CV in the line coming into the pump. Make sure you get it pointed in the right direction. A CV is a one-way gate, so if you put it on backwards, it won't allow water to flow to the pump.

[speedball1]

I'd put a checkvalve between the house and the pressure tank,

Well it took jllisenbebe a while to get to it but I agree, I don't think the bladder tank has a thing to do with the gage dropping to zero. However I would place the check valve just downstream from the pump between the pump and the well. While a check valve placed between the pump and the house will maintain the house pressure, (until you make a draw) It will not prevent the pump and tank from losing pressure. Install the check valve between the pump and the well. Good luck. Tom

[PaintsRule]

Okay so hubby checked the pressure tank and it only had 10 lbs, and he was adament he would NOT put a CV on, that the tank would be the problem, I said should still have one. He had it all to the right pressure and still not staying off. We then put the CV on and low and behold it would pump up and shut off! Yeah, but he cannot run a lot of water it can't keep up the water has to be running really low to fill our 45 gallon barrels for the animals (we used to with our smaller hp pump). So would a 20 gallon pressure tank help this problem?

Or I could just not unbolt and put pipe to join them to save work for now.

[jlisenbe]

Now you are talking about volume as opposed to pressure. In other words, it takes a long time to fill your water barrel because the pump can only supply so many gallons per minute. That would not be a pressure tank issue. Can you post the manufacturer and model number of the pump? We can probably find the specs of the pump online and see if it's delivering what it is supposed to deliver. Considering that it is attached to such a small tank (6 gallons is really small), I'm going to guess it is not a very high capacity pump. But that's just a guess.

Glad the CV worked.

Yes, you can try just adding on the second pressure tank, but just be aware of what I posted earlier. I remember we had a person on here a while back that added a second tank and had trouble with water "bouncing" between the two tanks. Might not be an issue with yours, however. I think a larger tank would be a good idea for you because it makes life easier for your pump, but it would not solve your volume problem.

[PaintsRule]

No it is not going slow, it puts pressure down to 0 when pumping with tap too far open. It is a 3/4 horsepower pump and will check how many gallons per hour it pumps, but thinking it is way more than what we were trying... If we put the tap just open very little it eventually fills the tank. Just flushing the toilet was too much for it yesterday... it went to 0 and did not pump up... maybe water supply problem? The spring is VERY good, it will never pump dry you cannot take a firemans pump and empty it... It's a mastercraft pump. I don't have the model number, I am at work.

[speedball1]

OK! If it's volume you want behind your draw then instead of a 6 gallon bladder tank go with a 40 gallon galvanized pressure tank, (see image). This will give you the same function as az bladder with the added volume to back it up. Good luck, Tom

[PaintsRule]

WE have a 20 gallon thinking with bladder, not sure, can we use that for now? I just want it to work, want to be able to flush the toilet, even if we can't run anything else with it, not sure where to find a 40 gallon tank!

[speedball1]

WE have a 20 gallon thinking with bladder,

Are you saying you have a 20 gallon bladder tank that's not installed? Any pump company can get you a pressure tank. Good luck, Tom