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    Tatla's Avatar
    Tatla Posts: 55, Reputation: 5
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    #1

    Jan 2, 2012, 05:37 AM
    Will a corpse remain unspoiled after 1 1/2 month burial?
    I am a writer and scribble tales, novels and stories. Now, I am writing a story on detective aspects, in which a corpse is buried by digging the land, by the dubious persons, who want to escape the public and police eye by this action. However, the police spies discover and recover the dead body after about 42-44 days. The milieu of the story is Punjab (India) and its winter season, when the story takes place. So, in the light of these aspects, I ask for your opinon, if the dead body - recovered after so many days - will be in proper shape (recognizeable) or will be spoiled? Will it be stinky?

    I shall appreciate those who answer.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #2

    Jan 2, 2012, 05:42 AM
    Will there be snow? How cold will temperatures be? Will the body be outdoors in an area inhabited by wild animals, such as a forest? Outdoors buried in dirt or mud or sand, able to be dug up by wild animals?
    Tatla's Avatar
    Tatla Posts: 55, Reputation: 5
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    #3

    Jan 2, 2012, 05:49 AM
    No snow, wondergirl.
    It is 6 degree centigrade in daytime and 3 degree centigrade during night-time. No, the corpse is buried 10 feet deep, in a room, with four walls and a roof. Moreover, some religious worship goes on all the time, over the place where the dead body has been kept, or hidden. So, obviously, no scope of it being dug up by wild or pet animals.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #4

    Jan 2, 2012, 05:52 AM
    The rate and manner of decomposition in an animal [human] body is strongly affected by a number of factors. In roughly descending degrees of importance, they are:

    * Temperature;
    * The availability of oxygen;
    * Prior embalming;
    * Cause of death;
    * Burial, depth of burial, and soil type;
    * Access by scavengers;
    * Trauma, including wounds and crushing blows;
    * Humidity, or wetness;
    * Rainfall;
    * Body size and weight;
    * Clothing;
    * The surface on which the body rests;
    * Foods/objects inside the specimen's digestive tract (bacon compared to lettuce).

    The speed at which decomposition occurs varies greatly. Factors such as temperature, humidity, and the season of death all determine how fast a fresh body will skeletonize or mummify. A basic guide for the effect of environment on decomposition is given as Casper's Law (or Ratio): if all other factors are equal, then, when there is free access of air a body decomposes twice as fast than if immersed in water and eight times faster than if buried in earth. Ultimately, the rate of bacterial decomposition acting on the tissue will be depend upon the temperature of the surroundings. Colder temperatures decrease the rate of decomposition while warmer temperatures increase it.

    The most important variable is a body's accessibility to insects, particularly flies. On the surface in tropical areas, invertebrates alone can easily reduce a fully fleshed corpse to clean bones in under two weeks. The skeleton itself is not permanent; acids in soils can reduce it to unrecognizable components. This is one reason given for the lack of human remains found in the wreckage of the Titanic, even in parts of the ship considered inaccessible to scavengers. Freshly skeletonized bone is often called "green" bone and has a characteristic greasy feel. Under certain conditions (normally cool, damp soil), bodies may undergo saponification and develop a waxy substance called adipocere, caused by the action of soil chemicals on the body's proteins and fats. The formation of adipocere slows decomposition by inhibiting the bacteria that cause putrefaction.

    In extremely dry or cold conditions, the normal process of decomposition is halted – by either lack of moisture or temperature controls on bacterial and enzymatic action – causing the body to be preserved as a mummy. Frozen mummies commonly restart the decomposition process when thawed (see Ötzi the Iceman), whilst heat-desiccated mummies remain so unless exposed to moisture.

    from Decomposition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Tatla's Avatar
    Tatla Posts: 55, Reputation: 5
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    #5

    Jan 2, 2012, 06:09 AM
    Wonder Girl,

    So nice of you for the concerns and for writing such a lengthy answer. But, kindly tell me frankly on the basis of your own judegement, as to what will be the condition of the body after one and half months, under the conditions mentioned above by me. There is no access of flies, as it is buried deep 10 feet. It is chilly season and the temperature is also menitoned to you, as it is in our area.

    As, the killers do not want to keep it for long, so they will not elbalm it. The victim must be wearing woolen garments, as it is trend here, in winter and the killers might have wrapped the body in garment, some woolen garment.

    Or, tell me the garment, which garments should be shown to be used by the killers so that the dead body does not decompose... or just tell me frankly -

    I want the dead body in my story unspoiled and undecomposed and so how much time (maximum) and what other options can be described, which look natural, so that the body, when dug up after so many days is recognizeable...

    Moreover, it should not stink.
    Tatla's Avatar
    Tatla Posts: 55, Reputation: 5
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    #6

    Jan 2, 2012, 06:19 AM
    Will corpse decompose?
    A dead body is buried in the soil, circa 10' deep. The murder takes place by suffocation, i.e. by pressing the neck. The room is open on one side, as it has one door, and there is light all the time by electric bulb/tube and the temperature is 6 degree centigrade daytime and 3 degrees during night time. Can the dead body be recognizeable after 42 days? It is winter season in Punjab, as per the story.

    I want quick and any type of answers as I am giving last touches to my story.

    Answers will be appreciated for sure.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #7

    Jan 2, 2012, 06:25 AM
    After reading many, many murder mysteries and also after searching the Internet, I would say that for no stink and to be recognizable after 45 days, the body would have to be in a very cold situation and not in soil.

    Think of putting a whole chicken in the refrigerator, but you forget about it and it gets pushed to the back wall. The temperature is above freezing but there will be stink for a while. After 45 days -- then what does it look like and smell like?

    My cousin is a funeral home director nearby, and I could call him, but it is too early to do so yet. I will call him in a few hours, if you want me to.
    Tatla's Avatar
    Tatla Posts: 55, Reputation: 5
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    #8

    Jan 2, 2012, 06:29 AM
    Please confirm it at the earliest and thanks so much for the concern. I wait for your reply. So so so much thanks. Also tell me what conditions should I show so that the buried in soil body does not decompose and does not stink. Thanks
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #9

    Jan 2, 2012, 06:32 AM
    If the body is not embalmed, it will decompose in 45 days, but may no longer stink.

    I will call my cousin later this morning. It is now 7:30 a.m. here.
    Tatla's Avatar
    Tatla Posts: 55, Reputation: 5
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    #10

    Jan 2, 2012, 06:37 AM
    Sure, I will wait, dear. Thanks so much
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #11

    Jan 2, 2012, 06:39 AM
    Does the time have to be a month and a half for no stink and recognizability of the corpse?

    What was the cause of death?
    Kahani Punjab's Avatar
    Kahani Punjab Posts: 510, Reputation: 203
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    #12

    Jan 2, 2012, 08:45 AM
    Wonder Girl,

    About time, OP has clarified that it is 42-44 days, but if it does not work, he can reduce it to 25 and even 20, but the dead body must remain unstinky, recongnizeable and intact. I shall suggest him to not bother about stink as it it stinks he can show the people or diggers covering their noses with a kerchief and can make it look authentic. They can also spray/sprinkle some perfume over their garments. (About it, OP has also mentioned it in some other post too, and that post seems to be removed, but I am sure, I definitely read it somewhere, penned by this OP)

    About CAUSE of death...

    From the following quote of TATLA, we have a clue...
    Quote Originally Posted by Tatla View Post
    The corpse is buried 10 feet deep, in a room, with four walls and a roof. Moreover, some religious worship goes on all the time, over the place where the dead body has been kept, or hidden. So, obviously, no scope of it being dug up by wild or pet animals.
    It seems the man/deceased has been done to death by someone, who is either head of or works in the religious place, and had placed/buried the dead body, under the land, to conceal it from public eye. He killed him under doubtful circumstances, but, about HOW, it can be anything, as the OP just wants to show him killed. It can be any reason, I assume. I think if you give the reply on assumption of the deceased being killed anyway, OP will be benefitted, and you can suggest him to show him killed in such a way, so that the body remains in 'unspoiled' condition for the maximum time.
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #13

    Jan 2, 2012, 09:00 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Kahani Punjab View Post
    HOW, it can be anything, as the OP just wants to show him killed. It can be any reason, I assume. I think if you give the reply on assumption of the deceased being killed anyway
    I wondered if body fluids (blood, lymph, etc.) were leaking which would change the situation about decomposition. Was lime spread when the body was put into the hole and before dirt was piled back on?
    Kahani Punjab's Avatar
    Kahani Punjab Posts: 510, Reputation: 203
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    #14

    Jan 2, 2012, 09:15 AM
    Let us suppose that the killer(s) took care to make sure that the deceased is hit in such a way to ensure no fluid oozes out. How many days will it NOT decompose, if the fluid leakage occurred, a bit and how many, if a little more, and how many, if much... I think the OP, who is a writer, will surely get a clue.

    Furthermore, you can tell about lime spead as well as no-lime-spread.

    I think OP can make alterations in the story accordingly. Is not it?
    Wondergirl's Avatar
    Wondergirl Posts: 39,354, Reputation: 5431
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    #15

    Jan 2, 2012, 09:28 AM
    I just talked by phone with my cousin. He said after 45 or so days, the body would be nearly skeletal, very dark, and unrecognizable -- "very nasty." Identity would come only from personal effects such as a wristwatch or necklace or information in a wallet. Skin would have sloughed off, and there would be a very heavy, musty odor.

    He said the best way to preserve an buried, unembalmed body would be to freeze it.
    DrBill100's Avatar
    DrBill100 Posts: 3,241, Reputation: 502
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    #16

    Jan 2, 2012, 11:14 AM
    Wondergirl's last post is right on target. "unrecogizable". Unquestionably! Interestingly here is a link to a book that mentions attendant odors. Decomposition.

    In the early stages of decomposition the body will invariably leak fluids from each orifice. It is referred to as purging. Results from the bloating created by internal bacteria during putrefaction. The body you reference is well past that stage.

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