[Wondergirl]

Thanks wonder. Writing and language was always my strong suit. Im hoping my sharp tongue will give me a punchers chance when I meet her parents.

But now you've just put a lie to that. I'm guessing English isn't your first language, because saying your "sharp tongue was always my strong suit" would make that the absolutely worst way to sway her parents to your way of thinking about their daughter. And what's "a punchers chance"?

[J_9]

But now you've just put a lie to that. I'm guessing English isn't your first language, because saying your "sharp tongue was always my strong suit" would make that the absolutely worst way to sway her parents to your way of thinking about their daughter. And what's "a punchers chance"?

I'm curious as well WG. Also curious about the mention of the removal of the clitoris here in the U.S.

Are my spidey senses tingling?

[forksandspoons]

ScottGem: I believe the only rude post I made was directed towards the priest. His comments were unconstructive, and I was looking for real discussion. Please don't judge me by that alone. Your concern about her needing "time to grow up" is my biggest concern. I only want the best for her. I think I can help her and be a very positive part of her life, but what if Im wrong? I would never forgive myself.

J9: Thank you for your imput. I just hope her parents give me a chance.

Wondergirl: Friend of a friend. Started talking one day and before we knew it 2 hours had passed. My parents do not know yet. I think its only fair her parents go first.

And lol, I wouldn't say that to her parents. I just mean, I can speak like a well manorred kid.

[ScottGem]

Thanks wonder. Writing and language was always my strong suit. Im hoping my sharp tongue will give me a punchers chance when I meet her parents.

Hopefully this a difference of idioms. Because a "sharp tongue" in American English has a negative connotation. In fact you have exhibited a "sharp tongue" in some of your responses in this thread and if you act the same way when you meet her parents you are in for trouble. You need to be polite and self-effacing.

You also still haven't explained how you met her. Once you found out her true age, you should have IMMEDIATELY backed off until you cleared the relationship with her parents. And if her parents do NOT support the relationship, you need to back off.

[forksandspoons]

Uhhh.. Yes english is my first and only language. Im not sure what you are getting at. I was born and raised in Pennsylvania.

Like many illegal things, clitoris removal takes place here in the usa. I don't want this to turn in to a debate about female genitals or my language (which I still don't understand). I have no reason to lie. That is why I came to the internet, to have an anonymous, true discussion about this, as Ive been all alone on this, and it has been driving me crazy.

[ScottGem]

Uhhh..? Yes english is my first and only language. Im not sure what you are getting at. I was born and raised in Pennsylvania.

Then your use of the phrase "sharp tongue" is puzzling.

[forksandspoons]

Scott: I am aware of my surroundings. I know there is a time and place for that type of talk. My sharp tongue is just as capable of saying something loving as it is hurting. There was no pun intended. I would handle my meet with them like a job interview.

[J_9]

Like many illegal things, clitoris removal takes place here in the usa.

Interesting, as it was banned in 1996 and those that do it can be jailed.

[JudyKayTee]

Reasons OP would not be allowed to date my daughter:

"1. I am not a pedophile if I am not having, or perusing sex with her. Need to explain himself - "I'm not a murderer." Then why did you mention it?"

"2. I dont see her in person often. That would be selfish, and unfair to her, and her family. I want to be able to see her though. Before I do that, I would meet her parentsdon't need to "justify" it to anonymous people." Once you post on an open forum you DO need to justify your actions. No one here would have even known about this dating situation if you had not posted. Doesn't see her in person OFTEN and hasn't met her parents. So the girl is sneaking out or meeting him without the knowledge of her parents?

"3. I am in a transitional period. I work full time saving money while living at home." Lives with his parents and is in transition. Reminds me of my ex-husband who was in a "transitional" period while looking for himself for 4 years. Note - ex-husband.

"4. clitoris removal takes place here in the usa." So does murder. That doesn't make it legal AND if you have direct knowledge that this surgery is being performed and this isn't just a "fact" you read in some rag magazine you owe it to women in this Country to notify the Police.

Where are parents when their 14 year olds are on the computer?

This is a true and honest discussion - you want people to agree with you and with one exception, I don't think that's going to happen.

This relationship is inappropriate - maybe she's very mature and you're very immature but a relationship that involves seeing someone at that age without parental consent is playing with dynamite.

You ARE aware, of course, that if her parents get wind of your "relationship" and decide to press charges against you (with or without her consent) you could be tried for rape and found guilty whether you were actually having sex. It happens when the parents are angry enough.

Then there's always the charge of parental interference if you are "dating" and the parents don't know.

What are you transitioning to and from?

[ScottGem]

Uhhh..? Yes english is my first and only language. Im not sure what you are getting at. I was born and raised in Pennsylvania.

Then your use of the phrase "sharp tongue" is puzzling.

Like many illegal things, clitoris removal takes place here in the usa. I dont want this to turn in to a debate about female genitals or my language (which I still dont understand). I have no reason to lie. That is why I came to the internet, to have an anonymous, true discussion about this, as Ive been all alone on this, and it has been driving me crazy.

Clitoral removal is a cultural thing that is NOT American. Don't know where you even got that idea. It does take place in the US, but among immigrants. You were the one who brought up the issue to justify your claim that Americans don't know about real love. A point I disagree with. But, if you want to make that point then why do you, as a native, think you have a better handle on things? And, if you want to make that point, why do you bring up things that are very unAmerican to justify that point?

This is mostly about you, not the girl, not American values. This is about you, as an adult, trying to have an adult relationship with a child. So the question now is, when are you going to talk to her parents and ask their permission for this relationship?

[JAMDixon]

Forks let me ask you this and please answer honestly. Would you let your 14 year old daughter (or sister) date a 25 year old man? Add into it that the main fact you would hear (along with everyone in this thread) is your age. Not how well dressed you are (which doesn't hurt) or how smart you are. If your little sister came to you about this what would you think?

[forksandspoons]

JUDY:

1) When I mention the age difference of 21 and 14, what do you think of? Not mentioning the word "pedophile" would be like not mentioning the big pink elephant sitting in the middle of the living room.

2) I don't need to justify it to you. You are ignoring things I have said. Im alone on this. Its been driving me crazy and I need someone to talk to about it. Ive talked to her about it but I don't want to constantly bug her about it. And no, she has never snuck out to see me. I haven't seen her since I learned her real age I shut it down but the feeling didn't go away, so we began talking on the phone.

3) I am transitioning from a medical condition that required multiple surgeries, and over a year to fully heal. I intended on going back to school next semester.

4) can we drop the clitoris remark please? It is irrelevant.

5) I doubt very seriously I could be charged with anything. And if I was it would never stick. No opportunity to have sex.

You just want to assume the worst of me.

[J_9]

4) can we drop the clitoris remark please? It is irrelevant.

It is not irrelevant. It speaks volumes of your culture and beliefs. What is your cultural background by the way?

5) I doubt very seriously I could be charged with anything. And if I was it would never stick. No opportunity to have sex.

Oh, if it were my daughter you were after it would stick. I'd make sure of that. I'd move the moon and the stars to make sure you never saw daylight again.

[ScottGem]

2) I dont need to justify it to you. You are ignoring things I have said. Im alone on this. Its been driving me crazy and I need someone to talk to about it. Ive talked to her about it but I dont want to constantly bug her about it. And no, she has never snuck out to see me. I havent seen her since I learned her real age I shut it down but the feeling didnt go away, so we began talking on the phone.

4) can we drop the clitoris remark please? It is irrelevant.

5) I doubt very seriously I could be charged with anything. And if I was it would never stick. No opportunity to have sex.

You just want to assume the worst of me.

2) YOU came here asking for advice. So yes YOU do have to justify your actions to anyone here who asks. You are talking to us about it and we are talking to you. The problem here is you don't want to listen to anything that you don't agree with. And, again, I have to question your attitude here.

4) You were the one who brought it up. So just admit you were wrong and it will be dropped.

5) You are wrong. While it would be unlikely to be charged with a sex crime, there are crimes that you could be charged with if you go against her parents.

[forksandspoons]

Jam, an 11 year difference is much different from our 7 year difference. I will change your question to apply to myself.

I would give the guy a chance. I would sit down with him, and talk to him. See what he is about. Honestly, 90% of guys wouldn't pass my test. Most guys are in fact *******s and ruin potential love for someone like me. If he did pass the test, I would set strict rules, maybe only allow them to be together at home. If trust built up, I would perhaps allow them to go out with a strict curfew, and mandatory phone calls.

Im not a very traditional person, and I have no idea what to expect from these people.

[JAMDixon]

Oh my bad... I thought you said you were 25. Thanks for answering, though. I would agree with your restrictions.. I will say, though, that I don't think I would have any say in the matter because the guy I'm with now would be cleaning his gun during your talk. It just depends on the parent.
Advice: be 100% honest with them to build trust... answer every question they ask honestly.

[JudyKayTee]

35) I doubt very seriously I could be charged with anything. And if I was it would never stick. No opportunity to have sex.

You just want to assume the worst of me.

You are so very, very wrong - but if you think you can "see" her and "date" her and her parents MIGHT try to press charges but they won't stick, then keep on keeping on. And the charge of parental interference - you're in contact with her. I actually went to law school (as did one of the Mods) so I'm not making this up as I go along.

"We" don't know you. "We" only know what you post and THAT'S the ruler by which you are measured.

Where were you meeting her before you learned her true age? That went unanswered.

[forksandspoons]

Actually, it was answered. I feel like all you see are the numbers 21, and 14, because you have overlooked certain things.

I didn't know her age at first. When I did, I told her we had to stop talking, and we did for a week.

I also said, that if I get a no go from her parents, I would back off.

What is your real objection? Can't you see I care for her?

[JudyKayTee]

I can't see that you do or don't care for her. My opinion? If you cared for her you'd meet her parents and if they don't approve I'd stay out of her life. Of course, that's just my opinion - which I think is why you posted here.

Again - where did you meet her and how did you continue to have contact with her?

My objection? I wouldn't want MY daughter "in love" at 14. People you love at 14 are NOT the people you love at 20 or 30 or 40 with very few exceptions.

So you told her you had to stop talking. That lasted for a week.

You think no one can make a false accusation. You might find out about that.

You are talking to her? By phone? Computer? Where are her parents during all of these conversations?

And I would like to know more about the genital mutiliation which YOU brought up. Where is this happening? Has it been reported? Is it something you read in the National Inquirer?

I always wonder when people answer these posts how many 14-year old daughters they've had? The people who are not terribly happy with the OP tend to be those who have children. The people who think it's a great idea tend to be those who don't.

And I'll name names - I am NOT referring to Wondergirl who gives sound advice and has given that same sound advice here.

[forksandspoons]

Thank you for your input judy. There is no sense in us going back and forth. I will never convince you, and that's OK. I don't expect everyone to approve. As a matter of fact, I am very pleased with the amount of support I have got. I was expecting nothing but responses like frchuck. I appreciate you all for hearing me out, and I hope her parents give me the same chance.

There seems to be quite a few intelligent people here. I will be sure to return. Anymore feedback in the meantime would be appreciated.