[jstrike]

My 17yo son got caught shoplifting... this was his first time in any type of trouble like this. He was charged as an adult in court and managed to get it reduced to littering. He has a court fine of about $350 that he is saving up to pay off. The attorney's for the store have come after my wife and I for restitution to the tune of over $400. (The actual value of what he took was about $10) My son can't afford that and the fine so I'm probably going to end up paying one or the other. My question is this, since he was tried as an adult, shouldn't the attorneys be going after him for the money? (We live in Wisconsin) This is mostly theoretical since I'm probably going to end up paying it off myself, I'm just curious.

Thanks

[AK lawyer]

[What did the store need to incur attorney fees for. Criminal prosecution is handled by governmental-employed attorneys, not by the victims such as the store.

The store is suing you for their attorney's fees? There is a statute in Wisconsin which makes the parent liable for the attorney's fees, but I think this would be for a civil case, not a criminal one.

"895.035(4)
(4) Except for recovery under sub. (4a) or for retail theft under s. 943.51, the maximum recovery under this section from any parent or parents may not exceed $5,000 for damages resulting from any one act of a juvenile in addition to taxable costs and disbursements and reasonable attorney fees, as determined by the court. If 2 or more juveniles in the custody of the same parent or parents commit the same act the total recovery under this section may not exceed $5,000, in addition to taxable costs and disbursements. The maximum recovery from any parent or parents for retail theft by their minor child is established under s. 943.51."

So, no, in my opinion, you aren't liable, although your son might be. But the argument you are making, that he was tried as an adult therefore his parents aren't liable for damages caused by misconduct of a minor, doesn't hold water in my opinion.

[excon]

My question is this, since he was tried as an adult, shouldn't the attorneys be going after him for the money?

Hello j:

I'm not sure what you're asking... Your son has TWO different bills, and he'd owe them even if he were tried as a juvenile... The first bill is the fine he owes to the court, and the second is the "civil recovery" the store is going after him for. If he DOESN'T pay, lawyers for the store will surely come after him, and if he doesn't pay the fine, he'll have MORE collection problems. No, they won't send him to jail if he doesn't pay. If I were you, I wouldn't.

Ahhhh, I think I'm getting the drift of your question... Do you mean to ask if he was tried as an adult, then HE should be responsible for them instead of you... But, no. On second thought, I don't think you're asking that...

Trying him as an adult has NOTHING to do with the stores ability to collect their "civil recovery". Since you son WAS a minor when the crime occurred, you are legally responsible to pay. In THAT case, I'd pay, but I wouldn't pay the one HE'S responsible for.

Hopefully, you can figure out what I'm saying.

excon

[Fr_Chuck]

Two different issues, criminal and civil, in the criminal issue he is being tried as an adult ( his attorney could have challenged it and asked tried to keep it in Juv court)

Now the civil is another issue, they can sue for damages, this is employee time, cost of the store on the court case
And yes this is often 400 to 800 dollars, and has nothing to do with the criminal case. So because you are responsible for his debts till he is at least 18 ( older some places) they can come after you for this.

[AK lawyer]

... Now the civil is another issue, they can sue for damages, ...

One would have thought that this would have been covered in the criminal case by way of a restitution order.

[Fr_Chuck]

The stores today normally rather go though civil court, since they are often awarded much higher amounts

[excon]

Hello again:

In case of "civil recovery", they don't even have to go to court. The legislature passed a law that allows them to recover...

"Recover", of course, isn't the proper word.. Making a tidy PROFIT off these poor souls is a MUCH more accurate description of what's going on here.

It's NICE to have friends, isn't it?

excon

[jstrike]

Sorry, I wasn't clear... the attorney's office is coming after us for their fees. This was a bill my wife and I received in the mail, they are not suing us. So even though he was 17 and tried as an adult in court he is still considered a minor and we are responsible for those fees? That's the part that has me confused in this... if (at 17) the court sees him as an adult shouldn't he be fully responsible for everything including the attorney fees?

[AK lawyer]

... The attorney's for the store have come after my wife and I for restitution to the tune of over $400. (The actual value of what he took was about $10) ...

This appears to be the pertinent statute:

"943.51(3m)
(3m) Notwithstanding sub. (2), the total amount awarded for exemplary damages and reasonable attorney fees may not exceed $300 for each violation if the action is brought against a minor or against the parent who has custody of their minor child for the loss caused by the minor."

I'd be interested in knowing how the store figures it can get $400 instead of $300.

Now what I need is a full-time contingent fee contract with a store chain in Wisconsin to soak hapless parents of klepto-kids. An attorney could get rich from this windfall statute.

[excon]

if (at 17) the court sees him as an adult shouldn't he be fully responsible for everything including the attorney fees?

Hello again, j:

No, you weren't clear about the nature of the bill, but the advice is the same...

What the CRIMINAL court did, in charging your son as an adult, does NOT mean the attorney is required to treat him as an adult when they collect their fees.

Because he was a minor when the bill was accrued, and minors can't enter into contracts, you, the parent, are responsible.

excon