[John1865]

excon:

Disagree! Those countries you site were conquerors. We are and have been liberators.

[NeedKarma]

It's easy to live free in Canada bordered by the greatest and strongest nation ever conceived.

Actually it isn't that much fun for us since some of your violent criminals come and hide out here. It is fun when we travel overseas and, when asked if we are american or canadian, we reply gladly "Canadian" and their smiles light up their faces.

Let's see if we can create a short-list of countries freed by the US: ...
Hong Kong

Really? I don't think so.

all of the pacific to include Australia

I think a lot of aussies would love to hear how the yanks 'freed' them.

But personally, I really don't care what you think about us. I have received many thanks from folks in the countries I have visited while in uniform.

That's the arrogance we all know and love! Being in uniform surrounded by your army buddies and weapons will indeed give you a different response than backpacking through Europe with the US flag on your back.

[excon]

Excon:

Disagree! Those countries you site were conquerors. We are and have been liberators.

Hello again, john:

Tell that to the Iraqi's, the Vietnamese, the Somoli's, the Kurds, the Cubans, and on and on...

That is exactly the problem with you Bushies. You don't quite understand English. What you call liberation, is really occupation. What you call pre-emptive invasion, IS really conquering a nation. What you call winning is, in the real world, losing.

excon

[John1865]

History lesson:

Let's analyze. British forces in Hong Kong surrendered to the Japanese on Dec 24, 1941. The United States won the war with a Japanese surrender September 1945. Britain took back Hong Kong following the Japanese surrender.

You wouldn't admit the United States was the catalysis for Hong Kong being free?

Most historians agree, American victories at the battle of the Coral Sea and Midway prevented or should I say thwarted Japanese plans to invade Australia.

Obviously, Australian and British Navy's helped. But it was only the United States naval power in the pacific that directly prevented an attack by the Japanese on Australia and resulted in the surrender of Japan.

[John1865]

I would also like to dispute what Jesushelper76 wrote as follows:

The war of 1812 the Americans lost. Thank Goodness or Canada would not be the place it is now.

The United States won the war of 1812 with a British surrender following the battle of New Orleans: Jackson decisively defeated the British at the Battle of New Orleans on January 8, 1815 with over 2000 British casualties and fewer than 100 American losses. It was hailed as a great victory.

[Allheart]

Actually it isn't that much fun for us since some of your violent criminals come and hide out here. It is fun when we travel overseas and, when asked if we are american or canadian, we reply gladly "Canadian" and their smiles light up their faces.

Really? I don't think so.

I think a lot of aussies would love to hear how the yanks 'freed' them.

That's the arrogance we all know and love! Being in uniform surrounded by your army buddies and weapons will indeed give you a different response than backpacking through Europe with the US flag on your back.

Hi NeedKarma,

I am actually and honestly asking these questions to learn. I really don't understand your above statement. How is John being arrogant when he was just relaying how he was being treated while in uniform. How is that being arrogant? Also, are you inferring that we would be treated in a negative manner, if we were backpacking through Europe, solely because we are American?

NK, you mean to tell me we are that hated, that when they discover you are Canadian, you are treated better than if you were American?? Again, asking to acquire knowledge.

John, - I take it you were in the military. Thank you so very much! John, I do believe we are a great country, but it does put one off to say we are the greatest. I believe we are a great Country, one of many great countries. Would you not agree with that?

If I don't belong on this thread, please, just let me know, I will not take it personal. I am trying to learn and sadly there seems to be such hostility from those I would have never anticpated it from. Lastly, if I am correct, John, served this great country, and as far as I am concerned, I not only trust and value his perspective, I respect it and would like others, who may not agree with him, to at least respect him. I would not say we were the greatest country though. I do believe we are one of many.

I do embrace and respect the difference in other countries and cultures. I find it so dishearting that others can not do the same for us.

[JoeCanada76]

You do not know your history bud. Nice try but you need to go back to school and learn your history. You think you won everything, when you have not. You are an example american that most people around the world would love to see on their soil so they can teach you a true lesson that you would not forget. Knock you down a few britches and knock that huge chip and arrogance and pompous attitude off your shoulders. You are lucky you were not killed. I dare you to go to many countries telling them your American and you will be a prisoner, and rightfully so for causing so much uproar, death and mayhem. I am holding you responsible for all the deaths around the world. You are a murderer, you are a arse hole and you are exactly like Bush. You are delusional and you need some real help.

As far as the states being successful in that war your wrong. How do you call not being able to invade canada as successful. That was the point of the war for america. America declared war because they wanted to take over land and occupy. They were unsuccessful.

[Allheart]

I have obviously stepped into a thread I should have never have entered. This is, admittedly way above my level.

I will not wait to ask to leave, I will leave on my own, because I am just not understanding.

Allheart

[JoeCanada76]

Allheart, Please do not feel that way. If you do not understand, why not just ask? I hope you read my message. Please do not take me the wrong way, I tried to explain it. Hope you get back to me.

[Allheart]

Joe,

I will say in public, what I tell you in private. I just adore you and you are one of the kindess most caring and loving individuals I have ever had the pleasure to meet and I proudly call you my friend.

I do just get all twisted up with subjects such as this. I am not deep in knowledge as all of you are, but I am deep in love for my country, my military and those countries that have stood by us as our friends.

You know that all of this dislike or shall I say hatred for Americans is new to me, and hard to digest.

But I send you a big hug anyway {... } Hope you are feeling better.

I admire, respect and adore the love you have for your country.

[JoeCanada76]

Allheart,

I did not mean to upset you and it hurts my heart to think that that is what I did to you because I do not mean this personally towards you or anybody else. It is just an attitude that John has that we Canadians do not like that much. It is not so much a hatred towards americans but a dislike for arrogance. We tend to be more humble and peaceful and we do not like it when somebody, especially American John come out and say that he and his government has every right to invade and fight and get involved in any war they want. Then to top it off say they won wars they never did. Americans tried to invade canada for land in 1812 and they lost. If they did not lose, then Canada would be part of the states right now, but we are not.

So know that I love you as a Friend, and it hurts my heart to see you react this way, but I am trying to share with you why I and others might feel the way we do. It is not towards you but towards Johns attitude that American has the right to invade any country and start strife in any Country they feel like it, that makes me angry.

Joe

[John1865]

In response to Jesushelper76:

I thought this site was for quality debate, why do you have to get personal. Did I attack you personally? Seems to me you woke up on the wrong side of the rock. It has become fairly obvious to me, you only want to hear from folks with your opinion... that's a fair and balanced debate.

I have been to many countries out of uniform, and lived in several. I have always been respectful to all folks while in their country, and have never had any problems with folks' attitude towards the United States. In fact, most folks thank us for all the good we do around the world.

Unfortunately, you have taken this debate to an unhealthy level. You are holding me responsible for all the deaths around the world. I'm falling over laughing!!

The war of 1812 was clearly an American victory. I don't know what history books you have read. The war was fought against the British. Trade was the real issue. Yes, Canada was a minor issue, a mere foot note in history!!

[JoeCanada76]

It is not personal. You john are the one that said that you and america has every right to bring your arms in any country, to start and interfere in any countries war. How you are superiour to every other country, how you are the best country, how you are the biggest power and have every right to fight a war in any country you want.

As far as 1812 being an american success, Nope. If it was we would be calling parts of Canada, America. The united states was unsuccessful in advancing on Canadian soil. So no you did not win the war.

At the time Canada was a British territory so to say that Canada was a minor issue your wrong there too.

I am saying your war like attitude. Just like Bush is what got your country in the mess it is in now. If you did not go around to all the different countries acting like King _____, then you would not have the attacks on american soil you have had.

This is a very healthy debate. Whether you like it or not is not really a concern for me. It is not personal at all. It is your attitude, it is your thoughts that it is your countries right to invade and bring up arms on any country that kills people, so yes you are responsible just like Bush is responsible for all the deaths on American soil of his own people and Americans abroad, and innocent people from all the other countries you decided to go to war with.


Joe

[Allheart]

Hi John,

How long did you serve? I am so glad to hear that as an American you were met with positive feedback. Hurts me to my heart, as well as confuses me to know otherwise.

[Allheart]

Joe,

My good friend.

I do not believe we go around the world acting like King anything. To me, we provide aide and safety to those who are in desperate need of it.

There is no way, shape or form, that any American is responsible for the lives lost on the USS Cole, and 9/11. Those actions, were, to me, just shear unbased hatered.

[JoeCanada76]

I am letting you know that is the perception that many people have about the american government. That many different nationalities were lost in 9/11 and I do believe if The american government was not so trigger happy in other peoples wars that hatred would not be there and there would have been no attack on american soil, but that is just my opinion.

[educatedhorse_2005]

I told myself to stay out of this thread after my first couple of post.
But I have to make a couple of points and then I will try and stay out of it.

John 1865 we are nowhere near the top of the food chain.
We are no where near where we need to be military wise. We have so many open holes in this country and with all or military else where we are open to an attack anytime.

Correct me if I am wrong but the war of 1812 was over before the battle of new orleans was fought.

I will go back to one thing I have said before. We are right in some of are decsicions but we need to be willing to admit when are thinking is wrong.

Iran has been a problem and will continur to be a problem.
How ever we do not need to jump into it blind we need a good stratgy before we go in there.
We also need the support of a lot more countries then we did before we entered Iraq.

If you look back we did not have the full support of the UN and we really needed it rather then try and go it alone.

We are streached to thin to put up too much of an offense If the untied states is attacked.

[chuff]

I agree with all those saying that America needs to stay out of other countries affairs. I for one am one American who is tired of paying over half of what he makes to give food, health care, protection and other aid to countries and people all around this planet who don't seem to give a damn or ever want to pay us back, or worse yet never want to do anything for themselves or set up real governments. For the love of God, when we went to war in Afghanistan we actually had to drop food and water to the citizens, much which was taken by the Taliban militias. For love of all that is PC, I would love to know what other country would fight a war like this? And then of course you had the New York Times claiming that wasn't enough and immediately calling for us to pull out!

So here's my idea that will never work in the real world. But it's this, if the rest of the world supposedly hates us like CNN and the NYT keep repeating how about we just cut off all aid everywhere! That way my fellow Americans can receive it or my personal choice, my taxes decrease significantly. The world wins and we win.

[JoeCanada76]

Wow, Chuff. I have to say well said.

My thought as well is if your unable to take care of your own, how can you expect take care care of anybody else elsewhere. Well that is what has been happening.

I say that is the best solution ever thought of. Stop spending billions of dollars in wars that have nothing to do with your country. Stop aid and let them fend for themselves. They will eventually become a better people because of it and Americans, and as well as Canadians will prosper and be able to take care of its people in a better way.

Joe

[Allheart]

I agree with all those saying that America needs to stay out of other countries affairs. I for one am one American who is tired of paying over half of what he makes to give food, health care, protection and other aid to countries and people all around this planet who don't seem to give a damn or ever want to pay us back, or worse yet never want to do anything for themselves or set up real governments. For the love of God, when we went to war in Afghanistan we actually had to drop food and water to the citizens, much which was taken by the Taliban militias. For love of all that is PC, I would love to know what other country would fight a war like this? And then of course you had the New York Times claiming that wasn't enough and immediately calling for us to pull out!

So here's my idea that will never work in the real world. But it's this, if the rest of the world supposedly hates us like CNN and the NYT keep repeating how about we just cut off all aid everywhere! That way my fellow Americans can receive it or my personal choice, my taxes decrease significantly. The world wins and we win.

Sorry Chuff, had to spread it... grrrr

With you 100%. Sure would be nice if those so filled with hatred for us, would be kind enough to express that and decline taking our aid. Seems only right. Either you hate us or you don't. Make up your mind. Sure boils my blood. Would have much rather seen that same aid go to those Americans in New Orleans. Now that would have been money well spent !